Why don't production boats have external alternator regulation

[DougMc]

Consider our 2017 Bene Oceanis 45. 125 Amp Valeo alternator and 420Ah of sealed lead acid batteries.

I am seriously considering installing either Balmar or Wakespeed external regulation, and it occurred to me to wonder why it's not already installed from the factory? Is it:

1) It's not an obvious selling point for the first owner, so Beneteau saves a few bucks.

2) These boats spend a lot of time on shore power, so the benefits are marginal and, again, Beneteau saves some cost.

3) The Valeo internal regulation and the cabling to the batteries isn't too bad, so the benefits are marginal.


I'm a slightly obsessive engineer so my urges are to install a Wakespeed WS500, and then spend my declining years writing a program to monitor its behavior over WiFi/Bluetooth via an ESP32.

But, seriously, I'm curious. Is there a good reason why external regulation seems to be the domain of a few small companies?

Our boat still has to earn her living in charter, with us spending about 6 weeks on board, so there is some benefit to keeping things simple, but I'm adding solar with the goal of having the diesel used less for battery charging and it seems crazy to not get the most efficiency out of whatever diesel charging is required.

In my situation is it worth the cost/effort/complexity to add external regulation? I'd do the work myself and monitor for 4 or 5 weeks before the boat goes back to the charter operator.

regards
Doug

[sailingharry]

Not sure that you would see a personal return on investment. There is absolutely no question that it is a huge improvement, but if you don't get to use the boat a lot, there may be little cash savings.

You may not even see less charge time. The one charter boat we have been on had zero way to assess the state of charge. No battery monitor, not even an ammeter -- the only indication was a voltmeter, which is a horrible way to assess state of charge. The charter company told us to run the engine an hour in the morning and an hour in the evening without regard to any known condition of the battery.

Perhaps a better way to reduce charge time in your situation is to install a battery monitor. I personally am a huge fan of coulomb counters, but some people swear by the Walmart smart gauge. Coulomb counters are much more informative, but take significantly more effort to accurately set up and interpret. With a battery monitor, you could tell your charterers to never let the battery below 50%. They would know when to charge, and when to stop charging.

[bgallinger]

I upgraded the alternator to a Balmar 100 amp. and the the batteries to 4 x 110 amp Lithium. To keep charging levels where they need to be, I have the Balmar SG 200 battery monitor and the Balmar 614 programable regulator on my boat. I love both of them, they function flawlessly and I would be lost without them! None of these were included in my 1998 Hunter 340, but adding them was the best investment ever.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by DougMc

But, seriously, I'm curious. Is there a good reason why external regulation seems to be the domain of a few small companies?

my 2001 Hunter 410 came from factory with external regulator

[mjscottinnc]

Money, an internal regulator is less costly to purchase for the manufacturer, one less item to purchase, qualify vendors for, inventory, and keep spare parts for. That’s for large manufacturers, smaller one put in what they can find in stock which means many more documented and undocumented variations.

[Matt Johnson]

The boat manufacturer just installs the engine as it comes from Yanmar. No need to modify it for most buyers, as it has little value for a day sailor.

[Shanachie]

If you have enough solar, a high-efficiency alternator is not really needed for many boats.



A regular alternator will provide some bulk charging, and bail you out on a cloudy and rainy day, but solar is so efficient now that I don't even turn on the battery charger when I plug in at the dock.


My battery bank is nearly full by early afternoon even when we're using a lot of amps.

[markxengineerin]

If you have enough solar, a high-efficiency alternator is not really needed for many boats.

Second- if you want to spend your declining years on something better, do the same monitor but for Solar. But if you use a Victron charger, they already have a nice bluetooth app...

[DougMc]

OP here.
Thanks for the replies. I agree on the benefits of solar. I am adding 350W of solar on our next visit, if all goes according to plan. This is in addition to the (somewhat ineffective) 180W that Beneteau installs on the deck.

I agree on the utility of a battery monitor/Coloumb counter and I already have a Victron smart shunt in place. The Bluetooth app works well but I now realize that, for charter guests, I would have been better to use the version with the gauge.

That all being said, I have limited space for solar and I'm still interested in improving the efficiency of the charging from the alternator. A prudent person would do one thing at a time and learn as they go but:

a) where's the fun in that?! and
b) I don't often get to spend long enough on the boat to tackle projects. This visit will be about a month long so I've got time.

Hence, I'm still seriously considering converting to external regulation. Balmar makes a external regulator kit specifically for our alternator, so I can convert it to external regulation without too much drama.

Cheers,
Doug

[Statistical]

Couple reasons

1) Cruisers are a small percentage of boats. People dreams are usually bigger than reality so most boats spend 300+ days docked at the marina connected to shore power

2) Boat manufacturers sells the dream hence so much empahsis on asthetics, and giant salons, and massive cockpits and photos with 9 guests on board, etc. Cheaping out on alternator is no different than cheaping out on seacocks. They aren't part of the dream.

[noelex 77]

External alternator regulation is pretty easy to add to an existing system.

What I would like to see production boat builders address, is those issues that are hard or even impossible for owners to upgrade later. Improving a boat’s structural quality with simple actions such as properly tabbing bulkheads, fitting beefy rudder systems, avoiding liners etc would not be expensive to incorporate at the design stage.

[Emmalina]

I had an 80Ah Hitachi on my Perkins but then converted to Lifepo So I bought a Balmar 614 and an sg200 (pretty useless on lithium !) but the alternator got changed to a high output Delco 28 copy. This thing can put out 225A but gets hot quick but when I down tune it it will give me 100A all day and the good thing is it cost $100 !

[witzgall]

Chris from Balmar here. We do have an option to easily convert your Valeo altenator to external regulation. It is a kit with the parts for the alternator, which is an easy DIY, + a MC-618 regulator: https://balmar.net/product/mc-618-vl-01/

Chris

[carraiguna]

I purchased the kit from Balmar for my Valeo 120 amp alternator and it works great. I have Lithium batteries and I used the setting to limit the output to 80 amps continuous and max temperature of 100 degrees.
Very happy with the results.

[DougMc]

Originally Posted by witzgall

Chris from Balmar here. We do have an option to easily convert your Valeo altenator to external regulation. It is a kit with the parts for the alternator, which is an easy DIY, + a MC-618 regulator: https://balmar.net/product/mc-618-vl-01/

Chris

Hi Chris,
Thanks for joining in. That exact kit is one of the approaches I am seriously considering taking. My only hesitation is that I think I'll be converting to lithium on the next battery replacement, and I am wondering if the Wakespeed may offer more "time-proof" communication options. However, I don't want to over-complicate things more than I have to!
Perhaps you can reassure me that the 618 can play nice with lithium BMS systems?
Thanks
Doug