Tiller Pilot on Windvane.

[TOM]

Is there anyone using a tiller pilot on a windvane. I have a Cape Horn windvane but would be interested in hearing about anyone using the above on any type of vane. Especially looking for a way to pilot the boat under motor or very light winds.

www.byamee.com

[bazzer]

Originally Posted by TOM

Is there anyone using a tiller pilot on a windvane. I have a Cape Horn windvane but would be interested in hearing about anyone using the above on any type of vane. Especially looking for a way to pilot the boat under motor or very light winds.

www.byamee.com

Our boat, s/v Tillie, a Hans Christian 38 has a ST 1000+ installed along with the Cape Horn. The mechanics are all there, but the PO never did complete the installation. It is very well engineered and I see no reason why it should not work. I aim to connect it and sea trial it sometime soon. I have been plagued with troubles with the Cape Horn. Today I sailed from San Diego out a few miles with the intention of fixing the Cape Horn friction problem, but alas, my darling other half decided to steer the boat through a kelp bed with the Cape Horn steering oar down. I can confirm that the safety release works and having a tether attached is essential, but putting the oar back in position whilst at sea is a daunting task. Not possible on our boat without going over the side. So I left the re-attachment until back at the dock.

Since the Cape Horn is designed for use with a tiller autopilot it should work well. The problem being is that the autopilot itself is installed in the lazzeret so course adjustment could be a pain. I have a Raymarine remote attachment which I aim to install in a convenient place in the cockpit.

[Ocean Girl]

I've been doing some research for our monitor, which is quite different but maybe these pics will help

[Ocean Girl]

Also found this blog, he connect the tiller pilot to his helm. This allows the autohelm tiller pilot to use its top mast wind vane, which is more sensitive in light winds. Well he explains it better.
Papers have beeen Submitted | SV Dawn Treader's Adventures

I have more examples of this, if your interested.

[daddle]

The usual technique is to connect the tiller pilot in place of the wind vane. Removing the windvane itself. Principally to save power or steer a boat that exceeds the capacity of the tiller pilot. Or perhaps while motoring.

[S/V Alchemy]

Not entirely true. The old Autohelm 1000s had (and have, as I use one) a "vane" setting. As far as I know, it's a good way to run in flat water, and here's a potential set-up:

http://www.selfsteer.com/faqs/faq.php?ID=134

And here's an interesting thread on the topic:

http://forum.ssca.org/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9153

[conachair]

Originally Posted by daddle

The usual technique is to connect the tiller pilot in place of the wind vane. Removing the windvane itself. Principally to save power or steer a boat that exceeds the capacity of the tiller pilot. Or perhaps while motoring.

Not knowing there was a usual technique, I've lashed my st2000 and aries together with tie wraps and string before, with the autopilot arm attached to the vane counterweight. Worked fine, a few days motoring offshore.

[TOM]

Thankyou Ocean Girl and Alchemy ,this is the sort of info i was looking for. I want to mount the tiller pilot in the lazerette as per the pic oean girl sent however as i have a steel boat i was wondering if this will effect the built in compass on the tillerpilot ...anty thoughts?

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by Ocean Girl

I've been doing some research for our monitor, which is quite different but maybe these pics will help

I contacted Selfsteer (Monitor) and they wouldn't respond. They probably know but want to keep it to themselves.

I just need to sit down and do the math b/c it's an economical way (electrically) of having an autopilot in light air. I've noticed that in winds over 20 kt I/this boat has to reduce sails/reef for the monitor to still work.

[S/V Alchemy]

Originally Posted by TOM

Thankyou Ocean Girl and Alchemy ,this is the sort of info i was looking for. I want to mount the tiller pilot in the lazerette as per the pic oean girl sent however as i have a steel boat i was wondering if this will effect the built in compass on the tillerpilot ...anty thoughts?

Yes, it will screw it up. The tillerpilot may not be capable of receiving a data stream from your fluxgate compass...you have one, right?...to both provide a proper heading and to override the tillerpilot's internal compas, which is going to read God knows what back there.

[Tomm0]

I have a rotovecta windvane/guage on the masthead and it is wired to my raymarine 1000 autohelm, which then does windvane steering instead of just directional... It's not rocket science. It's a poor mans windvane steering really, given that I wanted an autopilot either way... 2k for proper windvane steering or 350 for the rotovecta...
Uses power, yes, but I have plenty of that.

[bazzer]

Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy

Yes, it will screw it up. The tillerpilot may not be capable of receiving a data stream from your fluxgate compass...you have one, right?...to both provide a proper heading and to override the tillerpilot's internal compas, which is going to read God knows what back there.

I might be wrong, but is not the compass on a tillerpilot a flux gate? Either way a compass will work fine on a steel ship but will need to be swung to be accurate. If not how do the many steel ships find their way around?

[gjordan]

I had a flux gate compass on my steel boat, and its sole purpose was to be able to mount it as far away from steel as possible and have the remote readout in the cockpit. I mounted it about 15 feet up the mast. I may be wrong, but I dont think there is any way that one would work in the lazzeret. As far as the regular ships compass went, It was a proper steel boat compass with the large compensating irons which ,when we swung the compass on Long Island Sound seemed to be fine. When we left Long Island we discovered that when the boat heeled, the compass would go up to 30 degrees off. The flux gate packed up on the second day so I lived with a terrible compass. The tiller pilots that actually take the place of the blade on a windvane will be farther away from steel on a steel boat, so I think will work much better than anything in the lazzeret. I have seen photos of the home made mounting brackets to have a tiller pilot on an Aries. A web search might turn up something.___My 2 cents worth._____Grant.

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by bazzer

I might be wrong, but is not the compass on a tillerpilot a flux gate? Either way a compass will work fine on a steel ship but will need to be swung to be accurate. If not how do the many steel ships find their way around?

From what I can remember from the Raymarine tiller pilots manual (4000) is the tillers themselves do not have a compass in the unit itself but rely solely on the fluxgate. The tiller either has to be mounted on port or starboard pointed broadside, and that the display has to be set to that configuration. There is a bit of a swing calibration that is programable, but for how much, there isn't any specs in the manual I can fine, in mine at least.

And according to the installation instructions for steel boats, it says to mount the fluxgate on the mast above decks.

[S/V Alchemy]

Originally Posted by bazzer

I might be wrong, but is not the compass on a tillerpilot a flux gate? Either way a compass will work fine on a steel ship but will need to be swung to be accurate. If not how do the many steel ships find their way around?

The compasses on most tillerpilots are indeed fluxgates, AFAIK, and they can indeed be calibrated, but proximity to large steel plates can be an issue. I have a fluxgate compass, a KVH AC103, and the sensor is well above the deck, smack in the middle of the aluminum pilothouse roof. It will require declination adjustments (or compensation in the form of corrections) when we go south.

I have a fluxgate compass in my watch. It clearly "spazzes out" below five and a half feet above the deck. Above that, even three inches above that, I can take a useful bearing at eye level (I'm just over six feet tall). Clearly, proximity to mild steel is the culprit. As I've heard of tillerpilot errors on F/G boats caused simply by being within too few feet from the engine block, I would say there are some experiments that have to be performed to see if this can work at all on some boats. There are also certain brands of tillerpilot that might be a better choice than others for a steel boat, particularly those that can take headings from a sensor well off the deck.