"Dock Lines will be Cut!"

[Capt Phil]

Would be interested to get a Harbor Master or marina operator's point of view on these issues. When we lived aboard in San Diego, our marina manager was known as the 'last living nazi' who cut no one any slack and ran the marina like a prison camp. Living there, I saw first hand the way the guy would dump on permanent liveaboards for leaving stuff on the dock overnight, leaving the gate open or allowing non-residents/slip owners access to the marina. We never had a problem with him because if we were going to be doing some work on the boat, I'd go up to his office and tell him what I planned to do and was always given the go ahead.
One night there was an explosion and fire aboard a neighbors boat arising out of flamable aromatic glue being used to secure carpet and boat was not properly vented so when the bilge pump kicked in a spark caused the explosion. We were aboard and broke out hoses to limit the damage to the dock and other boats. The next day there was an envelope in the cockpit from the marina manager with a gift coupon for dinner at a high end local restaurant and a note of thanks.
I had a long chat with him one day and he said that his rather gruff demeanor was more of an act to discourage folks from taking advantage of his basic good nature which used to happen all the time, according to him.
Can't be an easy job making a judgement on how far to let things go without losing control of the marina and the tenants. He turned out to be a pretty decent guy IMO.
Delancy has it right... we are our brothers's keeper to some extent and should take responsibility for our own and neighbors' property if needed or requested. Phil

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Capt Phil

Can't be an easy job making a judgement on how far to let things go without losing control of the marina and the tenants. He turned out to be a pretty decent guy IMO.

IME most people react well to certainty and that everyone gets treated the same, and for that they are willing to pay a price on bluntness .

In OP's case he has neither equality of treatment (folks are clearly getting for free what he is paying for) nor certainty (never knows who is going to be inconveniencing him or his neighbours - and that does impact on him and everyone). In the absence of authority acting folks develop own solutions - which can end up worse than the problem, by providing ever more uncertainty and inequality (too many Chiefs syndrome ).

In OP's shoes I would get a few other boat owners together to write to the Marina Management to request a sign, or as the Management are absent simply put one up by selves!........or failing that maybe call up a Poop boat, slip the operator a few bucks to have an accidental discharge for frequent visitors............

[valhalla360]

"Instead you chose to imply I was lying or fabricating details when..."

No I think it's to get clarification on what was a "hazard to navigation". People often exagerate so a little clarity can assist. When repeated questions about the details go unanswered or get an evasive answer, it leads one to wonder if the issue is as bad as you suggest.

[Celestialsailor]

That was my take on it too. The OP's last post was how the female called the liveaboards for help as to be seen pro-active, yet does not confront an abuser of side-tie use. It doesn't add a lot of credibility

[AbaftAndBaffled]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

I'm sorry...but how was your home being violated. I have also responded twice about restriction to navigation and you have remained silent on that one. Why is your security at risk if the "offender propped your gate open? Is it a bad and dangerous neighborhood where you are?

I think I saw in another thread that you're from Hamilton, so I think it's worth noting that a few years ago some punks wandered into LaSalle Park Marina (Burlington, arguably one of the 'shinier' cities in Ontario) and set fire to a number of boats for no good reason. These things happen, even (especially?) in the nicest areas.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by AbaftAndBaffled

I think I saw in another thread that you're from Hamilton, so I think it's worth noting that a few years ago some punks wandered into LaSalle Park Marina (Burlington, arguably one of the better cities in Ontario) and set fire to a number of boats for no good reason. These things happen, even (especially?) in the nicest areas.

I was born in Hamilton. Have not been there for some time...Too cold. Our docks are gateless in Alameda where I am now. From the road in to the Marina is gated at night only. We have never had any real trouble from the street. That said, there was a lot of outboard thefts all up and down the estuary for a couple of weeks. The caught them eventually. They would stealth into the harbors during the wee hours in stealth mode.
I was in one marina in the Delta that actually allowed the homeless from the Islands out there to use the facilities. To me, that was taking it too far. I talked to the Harbor Master about it and was amazed with his reply..."Oh that's so and so,,,he's harmless". Sure, maybe I was judging the homeless as a possible theif because he had a cruddy old skiff with a near new Honda 4 stroke outboard, But I have to call them as I see them. It was not a liveaboard marina, so essentially, no after hour security. I gave notice and left a few months later.

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by Capt Phil

Would be interested to get a Harbor Master or marina operator's point of view on these issues.

I think the marina management's position is pretty straight forward, trespassing will not be tolerated.

If you tie your boat up and leave it unattended it will be chained and the State Police will be called and you can get it back from them. Sounds like you will be paying a tow + ticket based on what the tow guy said.

If you try to land to drop off or pick up your friends who snuck in the gate or try to get beer at the deli you will be chased off and denied access in a manner consistent with the attitude you present on the occasion. If you act dick, I will be twice as much of a dick back at you. If you're cool about, I will wish you well. It's up to you.

If you are a vessel in distress you will be accommodated in any fashion the circumstance requires.

If you are an innocent mom and pop cruising couple who simply doesn't know any better you will treated with respect and dignity, but will still be denied access.



The State Police actually dock their boat at the larger marina across the way. If they are not out patrol I expect they would be on site quicker than you could hack-saw off the chain. There was a separate, completely unrelated, incident a month ago and they were on the spot in minutes. Thank you Law Enforcement, your service is appreciated!

It may sound harsh but that's life in the big city. What plays out in the sticks doesn't apply in a city of 8,000,000 people, visitors are advised to leave their small town mentality at home.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by Delancy

It may sound harsh but that's life in the big city. What plays out in the sticks doesn't apply in a city of 8,000,000 people, visitors are advised to leave their small town mentality at home.

Thanx for the heads up. You're right about the mentality of people in the big city for sure.

[Capt Phil]

DOJ's suggestion about the 'poop boat' operator is positively Macheovalian (sp?)... love it! Phil

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Thanx for the heads up. You're right about the mentality of people in the big city for sure.

New York isn't the financial and cultural capital of this county because it's full of a bunch of push-overs. At least not since the dutch came here. Think about it next time you trade some stocks or read a magazine.

[Capt Phil]

Celestialsailor... it has been my experience that liveaboards in marinas, even in the cities, have more of a small town mentality than a 'big smoke' view of the world.
Personally, I could never live in a big city but found living aboard in San Diego, even though it was in a city, the vibe and neighborly feel of the liveaboard community within the marina was definitely small town... enjoyed it immensely. Phil

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by Delancy

New York isn't the financial and cultural capital of this county because it's full of a bunch of push-overs. At least not since the dutch came here. Think about it next time you trade some stocks or read a magazine.

Financial...maybe...Cultural?...ROTFLMAO

[nimblemotors]

This was the question asked: 'Anyone know the law on this subject?'
And I believe that question was answered. You did not like the answer, so it must be wrong. Oh well. Don't put up a sign, then chain up and **** on someone's boat, and you will find out the details of the law when they sue you.

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Financial...maybe...Cultural?...ROTFLMAO

Players play, posers pose, haters hate, and New York leads the way!

As far as I know "they" didn't try to crash a plane into Hollywood. Or Chicago for that matter. When you watched it happen on TV while having your morning coffee you watched it on a TV program originating where?

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by nimblemotors

This was the question asked: 'Anyone know the law on this subject?'
And I believe that question was answered. You did not like the answer, so it must be wrong. Oh well. Don't put up a sign, then chain up and **** on someone's boat, and you will find out the details of the law when they sue you.

"810.09 Trespass on property other than structure or conveyance.—
(1)(a) A person who, without being authorized, licensed, or invited, willfully enters upon or remains in any property other than a structure or conveyance:
1. As to which notice against entering or remaining is given, either by actual communication to the offender or by posting, fencing, or cultivation as described in s. 810.011;"

As far as I know a marina is both a structure and a conveyance. What is your point? It's not an empty field or a vacant lot, but you seem to be pretty confident of yourself, stop by anytime......