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Old 20-09-2012, 13:25   #1
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Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Hi Sailors/Boatpainters,

I am thinking of applying (correct and toghether with professional) that type of anti fouling (Coppercoat of Aquarius Marine in England) after gridblasted to 2.5 S and surface profile of between 60 and 68 and put Epoxy Intershield 300 V in 4 coats (450 Micro).
My questions: who has the Coppercoat on his hull and what do they think about it?
Would be splendid when it is like in what they say on their nice website.

All REAL Coppecoat owners reactions (negative/possitive), advice and tips and trix are more than welcome.

Tx in advance,
Sigrid Greven, SY Lucky Bitch, Chaguaramas, Trinidad.
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Old 20-09-2012, 13:42   #2
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

If you are considering one of those copper loaded epoxy products, in lieu of bottom paint, I strongly suggest that you pass.

I have told my CopperPoxy horror story before, so will not repeat it, but during the same 10 year period, I had NUMEROUS friends that had the same bright idea, as a solution for multihulls. They tried the WEST copper powder, EpcoTec, CopperPoxy, NovaCote, CopperClad, etc, etc... There was a slew of them.

None worked for long, as the outside copper powder corrodes away, and the "mummified in epoxy" copper, is isolated, so doesn't work. ALL of my multihull/builder friends, painted over it within 2 years, and in my case, I couldn't get it to stick. (Had to grind it off in areas)!

When I had CopperPoxy, I tried to wet/dry sand the hull from under water, (SCUBA), but it is impossible. You can't press hard enough!

The other bummer, is that unlike bottom paint, that releases some of itself WITH the harder stuck barnacles when being scrapped, these rock hard bottom products do not, so the little Bastards stick X10!

In the HIGH growth waters of Beaufort SC... I had to scrape HARD to clean our hull, ONCE A WEEK! The one time I waited for two, the hull took all day to clean. This failure as an antifouling was almost from the get-go!

This new version out there is the same flawed concept, but I understand works just a bit better, in LOW growth waters.

I saw a 57' hull with it this summer, when I was in the yard. The owner of this $1,000,000 + boat raved about it, but I doubt that he did his bottom maintenance himself. Later, I looked carefully, and the hull was COVERED with still stuck Barnacle bases.

As an environmentalist, I am hoping for a bottom paint solution... still!

Caveat Emptor!
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Old 21-09-2012, 07:58   #3
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

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If you are considering one of those copper loaded epoxy products, in lieu of bottom paint, I strongly suggest that you pass.
+1

Have never seen good results from any copper-loaded epoxy, Coppercoat included. They work so poorly that we almost never see them on boats around here anymore, thank God.
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Old 22-09-2012, 08:41   #4
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

I used Aquarius Marine Coppercoat and I am quite happy with it's performance so far. Only 3 years so far but it is performing reasonably well; I am hoping for a few more years yet . If it does, I would use it again.

I think it is somewhat different from other copper loaded epoxies in so far that the use of thinners is a requirement in its application but don't quote me .

But as with all bottom paints, the performance can vary tremendously from location to location.
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Old 27-09-2012, 05:06   #5
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

I must start by introducing myself as a director of Aquarius Marine Coatings Ltd, the manufacturing company of Coppercoat. Having visited the forum numerous times over the years it seemed high time I joined and I hope that my years of experience in the anti-foul manufacturing industry may prove useful to other forum users.

In relation to this particular thread I note that reference is made to various copper anti-fouls. I am glad to see that the only user of our Coppercoat product is pleased with it so far, after 3 years of use in Australia.

There have been several attempts at making a lasting anti-foul using copper and epoxy, and the majority of these have failed and been discontinued by their respective producers. Over the years I have seen systems such as CopperClad, Cupro FF, CopperGuard, CU17, Copperbot 2000 (and others) come and go. The common problem with these systems is that the resin binder has not allowed the release of the copper at the rate required to give good anti-fouling performance. For example, with CopperClad it proved necessary to thoroughly burnish the hull each year to expose fresh copper - and this burnishing process was generally more work than applying a new coat of conventional paint.

The key, in the simplest terms, is to have an epoxy that is strong enough to contain a high volume of pure copper, but simultaneously sufficiently weak/porous at the surface to allow fresh copper to be exposed. This surface copper slowly breaks down, releasing the well-known anti-fouling agent cuprous oxide as it does so. (Since the ban on TBT, most anti-fouls use cuprous oxide as a core ingredient).

We are confident that our epoxy blend provides the correct balance, and over the last 20 odd years (we launched Coppercoat to the public in the early 1990's) some 50,000 boats World-wide have benefitted from it. Of course, exact levels of performance will vary from location to location, boat to boat, and season to season. But as a typical example, at last week's Southampton International Boat Show I met the owner of a Malo 42 kept in Antigua, and he was still pleased with the performance of his Coppercoat after 8 years of use.

But the point of my reply here is purely to point out that lumping all copper/epoxy products together is not wise. Just as it would not be wise to judge all conventional anti-foul paints as one. Each individual product needs to be judged on its own merits. Just as some conventional anti-foul paints work better than others, the same is true with copper/epoxy systems. When researching a particular product therefore, do ensure that the information relates specifically to that individual product and is not purely generic.

We have exchanged emails over the last week or so Sigrid and I trust you now have the information requested. But pleased do feel free to contact me again should you require greater assistance.
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Old 27-09-2012, 05:18   #6
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigrid View Post
Hi Sailors/Boatpainters,

I am thinking of applying (correct and toghether with professional) that type of anti fouling (Coppercoat of Aquarius Marine in England) after gridblasted to 2.5 S and surface profile of between 60 and 68 and put Epoxy Intershield 300 V in 4 coats (450 Micro).
My questions: who has the Coppercoat on his hull and what do they think about it?
Would be splendid when it is like in what they say on their nice website.

All REAL Coppecoat owners reactions (negative/possitive), advice and tips and trix are more than welcome.

Tx in advance,
Sigrid Greven, SY Lucky Bitch, Chaguaramas, Trinidad.
If you do not mind diving 3-10 times a year and hand cleaning your hull, CopperCoat will be fine. The required cleaning is directly proportional to lower latitudes. I have been in Chaguaramas, Trinidad and certainly would not dive there...even fish die in that water.

Remember, it has no antifouling characteristics.

See the attached photo.

Hope this helps you.

Bill
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Old 27-09-2012, 06:15   #7
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

For tens of thousands of Coppercoat treated boats a yearly clean off is sufficient. But naturally this is location and boat-use specific. For example, a work boat used every day in a low fouling area may not even require an annual clean. But a boat left stationary in a high fouling area may need cleaning twice a year or more.

Certainly we have European based clients with boats in the Caribbean who only get to visit and use their yachts twice or maybe three times a year, for a week or two at a time. These owners tend to give their hulls a wipe over when they arrive, to remove any growth that has appeared during their months of absence. They take the view that it is quicker, cheaper and easier to give the hull an in-water scrub from time to time than it is to repeatedly lift and repaint. Naturally, some other boat owners take a different view.

I should perhaps also explain that the product sold as "Coppercoat" in Australia is a conventional, single-pack anti-foul paint produced by International Paints. The Coppercoat that we manufacture in the UK is branded and sold as Coppershield in Australia.

Bill - I would be happy to investigate further the performance of the Coppercoat on the catamaran you mention. Please have the owner contact my office (info@coppercoat.com).
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:23   #8
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Hi Sigrid - I understand that you have completed some local research by discussing the performance of Coppercoat in Trindad with owners of boats that use this particular product in your location. This is a sensible thing to do and something we recommend, as the performance of any anti-foul will vary from location to location (our Coppercoat included).

And thank you for now choosing Coppercoat. I trust it will give your hull many years of anti-fouling protection and I look forward to your updates as the years go by.
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Old 09-10-2012, 04:42   #9
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ewan Clark View Post
Hi Sigrid - I understand that you have completed some local research by discussing the performance of Coppercoat in Trindad with owners of boats that use this particular product in your location. This is a sensible thing to do and something we recommend, as the performance of any anti-foul will vary from location to location (our Coppercoat included).

And thank you for now choosing Coppercoat. I trust it will give your hull many years of anti-fouling protection and I look forward to your updates as the years go by.
So Ewan do you have location data with where Coppercoat has and hasn't worked. Or this a buyer beware? I'm interested in maybe trying but don't what to be the test case.
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Old 09-10-2012, 06:07   #10
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Hi Don - given your location you are probably best to speak with Jim Edwards of Coppercoat USA LLC. He is based in Florida but is in charge of supplying it across the US, so he is better placed than I to discuss differences in performance from place to place.

But, it's not really a product that is "on or off", so it's not that it works in soem locations but not in others. It's more a matter of degree. In some locations it works so well that even by the of the year there is viturally nothing on the hull and cleaning is all but unecessary. But, at the other end of the scale, in the most harsh locations (Singapore Harbour, Recife in Brazil, etc) it may be necessary to scrub/wash the boat 3 or even 4 times in a year to keep it really clean. That said, in these harsh locations you could be applying a new treatment of conventional ant-foul at least once every 6 months, so there is still an advantage to using a scrubbable epoxy system instead.

Also, one persons idea of success (for an anti-foul) can be different from anothers. Most of customers accept and understand that some fouling will arrive eventually, and that the boat will need cleaning. If they have a little slime or the odd barnacle after a year afloat, it's not a big problem for them - they just clean the hull and off they go again. But we do get customers with incredibly high (unrealistic?!) expectations, and they can get upset when the boat bottom isn't spotless indefinitely. Part of our job is to be realistic with our claims, and to be able to back them up, and to give people a guide as to what they should expect. For example, we do not claim that Coppercoat is maintainance-free and we do say that periodic cleaning during the 10 years or so of life should be expected. Remember, Coppercoat is an anti-foul, not a miracle!

When I started this business 20 years ago it was because I thought it easier, quicker and cheaper to clean my boat every year than have to lift and repaint it every year. It turns out I was not alone, and approximately 50,000 boats across the World now use Coppercoat.
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Old 13-10-2012, 16:25   #11
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Mark Johnson spoke the truth about Coppercoat

Three pics, taken two days ago, of a Valiant 40 coated in Coppercoat, and last hauled six months ago. Pretty much says everything. Mark Johnson tried to edumacate me, but I insisted on eating the books. Thank you Mark. Time period was May to October, 2012, in San Diego Bay, water temp below 70 degrees F. This boat was side-tied to me for that period, and needed some haulout work prior to cruising south on the Ha-Ha. On the way to the yard, they were able to get only 4 1/5 knots, then noticed that the seawater flow was restricted to the engine. Heavy tube worm growth in the thruhull and entire hull area, as well as tunicates. The green band is the Coppercoat that was above the waterline. They had raised the waterline due to that condition that seems to affect cruising craft about to depart. The fresh Coppercoat is as heavily encrusted as the existing base coat below it.
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Old 15-10-2012, 04:24   #12
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Hi Roy,

Would you have the contact details for the owner of the pictured boat as I'd dearly love to get to the bottom of this. (For privacy it might be better if you send them to info@coppercoat.com and not via a public forum!). Alternatively please have the owner contact us, or Coppercoat USA (jim@coppercoatusa.com), directly.

And while Mark Johnson does indeed talk the truth about his own experiences with his chosen anti-fouls, he does not have first hand experience of Coppercoat and did not have Coppercoat on his boat. I just thought it might be useful for me to clear this possible confusion.
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Old 25-10-2012, 13:10   #13
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

The OP asked for experiences of real owners with firsthand experience of the specific product from Aquarius in the UK. Here's mine.

I prepared my 45ft Hunter in Rhode Island with a brand new application of the genuine Coppercoat product just shortly after it was introduced into the US a couple of years ago.

The hull was soda blasted and rubbed down with 60/80 grit to get a good key on the gel coat which was the real spendy and boring part.

We then immediately splashed her then sailed up to Boston, down to Florida (via most of the ICW) across to the Bahamas and on to Cuba where she sat for two months in warm tropical water before returning to Virgina where she sat for about 3 months in the summer.

In all, she was in the water for 18 months and when we finally hauled her out to go on the hard the yard wasn't prepared to power wash her as a hurricane was on its way and they just wanted all the boats out of the water.

No problem, it took me half an hour to hand wash the hull with a sponge and a hosepipe and she looked pretty much the same as when she went in. A few small barnacles on the waterline and in the crevices where the antifould didn't quite get, that's all.

FWIW, I beleive that Ewan is correct about the epoxy itself, the water based goo that you put the copper powder into doesn't look like it would work at all, but its obviously got different properties than some others.

Back here in the UK, this idea is decades old, but only the Aquarius has stood the test of time. Even their nearest competitor here who spray the hull with a hi tech cupro-nickel compound admit that its pretty good for DIY applications.

So, as far as it goes for this customer at least, I'm happy. YMM(and probably will)V.

Duncan

p.s I have absolutely no connection with the manufacturer of this product at all.
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Old 31-10-2012, 05:24   #14
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

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The OP asked for experiences of real owners with firsthand experience of the specific product from Aquarius in the UK. Here's mine........
We then immediately splashed her then sailed up to Boston, down to Florida (via most of the ICW) across to the Bahamas and on to Cuba where she sat for two months in warm tropical water before returning to Virgina where she sat for about 3 months in the summer............
Just curious - what time period do you mean when you say immediately - hours or days or....?
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Old 31-10-2012, 05:42   #15
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Re: Coppercoat by Aquarius Marine Coatings UK

Wotname,

Just overnight actually.

Duncan
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