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Old 05-12-2009, 09:59   #16
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I had a problem with the hose material breaking down in my fuel line, which of course wreaked havoc with my carbs and fuel pump. My friend said that mainly engines/systems from about 2001 or so and before used materials that are affected by the ethanol much more than some of the more recent outboards. Also, on the newer ones, he said the problem still exists, just in a different area - the VST tank gets full of water, and if you don't empty it consistently, you're looking at a very expensive fuel pump fix/replacement. Hope I got all that right - but whatever the deal is - it's certainly a pain in most everyone's A** - and I couldn't agree more with the post above - the potential benefit certainly does not seem to outweigh the real damage caused by this.

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Old 05-12-2009, 10:18   #17
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A related problem for those of us cruising is that we tend to bulk up on gas for our outboards and perhaps portable generators when we purchase it, and then it sits in jugs for extended periods of time, magnifying the effects of the separation problems mentioned by thinwater. So that in turn means, if filling the jugs and knowing some of that fuel will not be used for several weeks or longer, one needs to source the one fuel pump in town that sells non-E10 fuel. Really quite a hassle and bad on the gear, as well.

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Old 05-12-2009, 11:18   #18
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Usta be that it was reccomended that you fill to 3/4 to 7/8 (to allow for expansion) before lay up with Stabil or some other additive to minimize condensation and breakdopwn of fuel. With the ethohol in the gas it seem it might bebetter to run it down real low then fill up with fresh in the spring...any thoughts?
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Old 05-12-2009, 12:07   #19
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This has been a real problem in Hawaii for a few years. They mandated it in all service stations several years back and everyone was having trouble with weedeaters, outboards, chainsaws and boats with fiberglass tanks. Boaters complaints went unheeded.
My solution was to run the gas out of whatever machine I was using each time I used it. It solved the problem for those machines that had a fuel shutoff or I could drain the tank of.
Just don't let the fuel stay in the carb.
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Old 05-12-2009, 14:54   #20
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Ditto!

I had a Yamaha generator that had less the 10 hours on it and I had to teardown the cab because it wouldn't start this last summer. When I pulled out the meter nozzle it was full of oxide of some kind.
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Old 05-12-2009, 16:35   #21
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Le me explain why filing is a better choise....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mule View Post
Usta be that it was reccomended that you fill to 3/4 to 7/8 (to allow for expansion) before lay up with Stabil or some other additive to minimize condensation and breakdopwn of fuel. With the ethohol in the gas it seem it might bebetter to run it down real low then fill up with fresh in the spring...any thoughts?
BTW, no more than 5% is required for expansion (about 1% for each 15F and 1% for safety). It doesn't grow that much. This will give 5x less breathing that 3/4 full.

* Condensation is not the problem; absorption is. Ethanol draws water from the air. The only cure is minimizing breathing.
* Additives do not help with absorption and the separation that can follow. Stabil does not claim that it does.
* Stabil and other effective additives contain anti-oxidants, just like those the gasoline manufacturers add, but in higher doses. If you limit the air intrusion by keeping the tank very full, it is enough.
* The fire national code discourages storing boats on land with mostly MT tanks. Many marinas have the same policy.
* Drain jerry cans completely.
* Keep dingy gas in a small 1-gallon can (or smallest practical container for your engine) so that you can go through it more quickly. Easier to pour, anyway

Better yet, where the water doesn't turn solid, run all year!
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Old 05-12-2009, 17:22   #22
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Ok so you just about fill it up, don't put additives wait till spring and hope for the best? Tonight in Fort Worth, it will be 35 or less, have not lost a thing on the lake, need to stay near the TV and the fire. Just put a new spin on fuel filter in the spring and go right along...
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Old 05-12-2009, 17:26   #23
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Mule,
Run the fuel out of lines to your engine before you lay up. Then, hope for the best for what's left in the tanks.
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Old 05-12-2009, 17:30   #24
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Just for information about where I live. There are no marinas within 100 miles. You have to buy fuel from service stations. This might be true of other forum contributors as well. The Feds/State has forced us to use a fuel that is damaging to some systems without telling us the hazards. We don't all have new or newer boats!!
Shame on them.
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Old 05-12-2009, 18:43   #25
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When I was maintaining fuel sites for the City they first started the use of biodiesel and that raised hell with all their trucks. The filter companies must have profited well for a couple years until they finally came up with a good formula.
But we the public had to pay for all those filter changes. The feds experimented at our expense and it was them that forced us to start buying oil offshore.
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Old 05-12-2009, 19:32   #26
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No, that is not exactly what I said.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mule View Post
Ok so you just about fill it up, don't put additives wait till spring and hope for the best? Tonight in Fort Worth, it will be 35 or less, have not lost a thing on the lake, need to stay near the TV and the fire. Just put a new spin on fuel filter in the spring and go right along...
I said that additives will not help with e-10 phase separation. That is true.

However, anti-oxidation additives (like in Stabil, Techron, and Seafoam) are very good, and I would add those. Anti-oxidants are added at the refinery to meet ASTM storage stability standards, but the dose is not enough for a small tank across the winter. Thus, the need for a "booster, described above.

By the way, to all, running the fuel out of the carb until the engine stops only makes it worse; what is left in the carb (about 1/2) dries and turns to gum. Either do nothing (in which case it may not dry out at all, if the period is not too long) or drain the carb using the drain screw provided (better).
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Old 05-12-2009, 20:21   #27
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Please try whatever works for you but if you leave fuel anywhere where it comes in contact with fiber or rubber or fiberglass you are in for a surprise. It won't be a good surprise.
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Old 06-12-2009, 11:28   #28
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The worst thing is the EPA wants to kick it up to 15%..............

Dealer Outlook » Blog Archive » Don’t be fooled: The E15 fight ain’t over!
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