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Old 31-03-2012, 04:37   #1
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Wind Gen Excess to Where?

So went with a 24v Air Breeze wind genny.
Plan is run it into a Morning StarMPPT and feed 12v to my bats.4 6v Trojans.Approx 450 amp hrs.Turn the internal reg. up to max in the AB and when bats are to float let the solar pick up the rest.
I think this will work but have ben wrong before
Now if and i hope when this happens the AB will freewheel as i am told.....if i don't eather A..hit the off switch or B...dump the load somewhere.
I have a small hot water heater on board.
Plan is......
Changing the element in HW heater to 12v and dumping excess with a manual switch.......as in you leaving the boat and bats are close to full so manually switch it over.or.gee,it's freewheeling.and switch it.Not realy worried about heated water but is a option.
Will this work?If not why not?
Thank You
Mark
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Old 31-03-2012, 05:23   #2
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Where do you find a 12V element?
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Old 31-03-2012, 06:05   #3
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

They’re actually quite common:

Southeast Marine Services :: Solar, Wind and Water Power :: Diversion Loads :: 12 volt DC 600 watt water Heater Element

1Tu9 30'/9M Tilt Up Tower for Xl1

Diversion Loads @ Survival Unlimited.com - Water Heater Elements, Air Heaters, DC water heaters, DC air heaters

12 Volt DC Water Heating Element
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Old 31-03-2012, 06:08   #4
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

You are the Master! From now on when I search anything instead of saying I'm going to "Google it" I will say that I am going to "Gord it" LOL
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Old 02-04-2012, 02:02   #5
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Quote:
Originally Posted by travler37 View Post
............Plan is run it into a Morning Star MPPT ............
Don't do it - MPPT controllers are only for Solar. If there is no load on the Wind genny it can generate very high voltages that may blow the diodes.

If you have a wind regulator (whatever sort) and a Solar how does either one know when the batteries are charged - they can get confused by the volts coming from the other charger and switch to float. There are combined wind and solar chargers that will control both.

The simplest answer is to follow the KISS principle and have no controller and lock of the blades when you know the batteries are 100% charged - which will not be very often if you are cruising all the time. When you leave the boat tie off the wind genny and let the solar do all the work.
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Old 02-04-2012, 02:47   #6
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

I found a good read, Coleman Air, about wind generators and their opinion on charge controllers though, they are used to much larger generators that are usually found on boats. They prefer to connect the gen. directly to the battery and then allow a predetermined value to be set in the controller to "dump" the excess. They did caution me that a smaller amount of water, ie 6 gallons, could be heated very high in a short amount of time. I was told to be sure the pressure valve outlet was routed outside of the boat just in case of going off.
Anyway some good information to consider.
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Old 02-04-2012, 02:50   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailinglegend

Don't do it - MPPT controllers are only for Solar. If there is no load on the Wind genny it can generate very high voltages that may blow the diodes.

If you have a wind regulator (whatever sort) and a Solar how does either one know when the batteries are charged - they can get confused by the volts coming from the other charger and switch to float. There are combined wind and solar chargers that will control both.

The simplest answer is to follow the KISS principle and have no controller and lock of the blades when you know the batteries are 100% charged - which will not be very often if you are cruising all the time. When you leave the boat tie off the wind genny and let the solar do all the work.
Multiple charge controllers connected to a battery don't get confused. It's the battery that determines the charging voltage not the charge controllers.

Dave
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Old 02-04-2012, 04:54   #8
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

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Multiple charge controllers connected to a battery don't get confused. It's the battery that determines the charging voltage not the charge controllers.

Dave
I have seen two wind controllers that dump their charge because the solar is pumping an absorption voltage into the battery and the wind regulator decides it's time to dump its load.

"It's the battery that determines the charging voltage not the charge controllers. "

This is incorrect. The battery determines the charging current, and the regulator can be set to different charging voltages depending on the type of battery - sealed or open flooded.

If the regulators are different they will almost certainly drop down to float mode at different times as neither of them is measuring the current that is actually going into the battery. They will work together most of the time but a dedicated wind and solar charger with two inputs and one voltage sensing wire will be more efficient.
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Old 02-04-2012, 05:05   #9
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PEACETIME View Post
I was told to be sure the pressure valve outlet was routed outside of the boat just in case of going off.
Why??
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Old 02-04-2012, 05:10   #10
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Make sure the12v elementwill actually fit the water heater my similar plans were foiled when I looked at the nonstandard element on the water heater
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Old 02-04-2012, 06:24   #11
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Quote:
Originally Posted by travler37 View Post
So went with a 24v Air Breeze wind genny.
Plan is run it into a Morning StarMPPT and feed 12v to my bats.4 6v Trojans.Approx 450 amp hrs.Turn the internal reg. up to max in the AB and when bats are to float let the solar pick up the rest.
I think this will work but have ben wrong before
Now if and i hope when this happens the AB will freewheel as i am told.....if i don't eather A..hit the off switch or B...dump the load somewhere.
I have a small hot water heater on board.
Plan is......
Changing the element in HW heater to 12v and dumping excess with a manual switch.......as in you leaving the boat and bats are close to full so manually switch it over.or.gee,it's freewheeling.and switch it.Not realy worried about heated water but is a option.
Will this work?If not why not?
Thank You
Mark
Your whole set up dose not make sense
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Old 02-04-2012, 08:06   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailinglegend
I have seen two wind controllers that dump their charge because the solar is pumping an absorption voltage into the battery and the wind regulator decides it's time to dump its load.

"It's the battery that determines the charging voltage not the charge controllers. "

This is incorrect. The battery determines the charging current, and the regulator can be set to different charging voltages depending on the type of battery - sealed or open flooded.

If the regulators are different they will almost certainly drop down to float mode at different times as neither of them is measuring the current that is actually going into the battery. They will work together most of the time but a dedicated wind and solar charger with two inputs and one voltage sensing wire will be more efficient.
A LA battery presents such a low impedance that it determines the voltage. The charge source for example in a discharged battery unless it was huge could not raise the terminal voltage. When the battery reaches absorption its impedance rises and hence the terminal voltage rises. The battery will only do so when it has the appropriate state of charge. It doesn't matter how many charge sources there are one of them will supply the absorption current and depending on the impedance will share that charging current with the other sources.
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Old 02-04-2012, 10:18   #13
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Go for it!

After installing LiFePo4 cells and making the boat's refrigeration energy efficient, I have extra solar power.
The 120 volt Ardic tank heater element has a thermostat in the middle of it so it's not directly replaceable with anything I have found, so I decided to try running the inverter to heat water.
I know it's not as efficient as straight 12 volts, but it works!
I'm currently using up the extra Aerogel from the fridge project to insulate the hot water tank for better holding time.
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Old 02-04-2012, 10:26   #14
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

Mark, make sure you set the toggle up so that the AirBreeze doesn't have a chance to freewheel. It seems that you'll want the self-regulator to stall once the batteries are topped up, regardless of whether the water is hot enough.
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Old 02-04-2012, 12:30   #15
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Re: Wind Gen Excess to Where?

AFAIK the AB wind genny has a built in reg. HOWEVER, if you want to dump the energy to the waterheater, nice idea, but I would use the 120 or 220 volt element anyway. All you need is a cheap contactor, double pole with the same voltage coil as the elements rating. Connect the 12v excess to the NC terminals, and connect the incoming AC to the incoming NO terminals, AND the coil, Connect the load (element side) to the NO AND NC terminals. When you make the 220v/120v switch, the coil will pull in, disconnecting the 12v side, and connecting the AC side, and when you switch off, it defaults back to 12v.
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