Inverter or Kipor Generator

[S/V Illusion]

If anyone reading is contemplating buying a Honda 200 genset, Wise Sales is currently selling them for $869, free shipping and no tax. I have no connection, financial or otherwise in this company which can be found with a simple internet search.

[seafox]

They have been using them for years with RVs. Google kipor and you will find heaps of RV forums where they say good things about them. I have no complaints.

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Is that the Chinese knock-off of the Honda? (Which I've heard Honda is furious about since there are legal issues involved?)

Kipor-US doesn't mention where they are made, which makes me think they are cleverly trying to hide "China". Kipor.com's web site is "service unavailable" right now. It would be interesting to hear form someone who has run one for 500-1000 hours, to see how or if they hold up a bit longer.

[seafox]

WWW.KIPOR.COM works fine here.

[Strygaldwir]

I have a Xantrex 2500w inverter. I have a Kipor KGE 3000 Ti generator. I have "blown" 3 electronic coffee makers and a cuisinart food processor using my inverter. They DON'T like the modified sine waves put out by the Xantrex. My microwave doen't like it either, but I have not "blown" it yet, it just makes distressingly funny noises.

So, we run the generator when we are making coffee now. Love it! very quiet, very reliable, very easy to install!

Keith

[oldsalt_1942]

I'm an espresso lover myself and am looking for a solution to running my beloved Krups on my next boat. Those two-part espresso pots make great coffee, but you really need a Sea Swing stove to use when underway. On my last boat I used the so-called French press which many experts say is the best way to make a cup of coffee. Granted, it doesn't taste the same as either the Krups or the two parters, but it is easy to use and they also come in a plastic version which is essential on a boat.

[Microship]

Hey, there's a very nice way to make espresso without all the electricity. Google about for Aeropress, typically about $30. All my espresso machines have been retired now that I have this, and it works just as well on the boat (using a little battery operated frother to make the milk properly fluffy). The grinder needs only a baby inverter, so the whole package is boatable without having to add serious infrastructure.

Cheers,
Steve

[oldsalt_1942]

I have to admit that looks like a pretty neat coffee maker. If my Krups craps (couldn't resist) I'd definately give it a try. The only drawback I can see for someone going long term cruising in out of the way places would be the filters. The french press has a metal filter that's easily cleaned and doesn't need replacing after a cup of coffee.

[Microship]

I use each filter about 4-5 times... I figure the pack that came with it is good for years, and will lay in some deep inventory before heading out. The Aeropress has really gained favor among geeks, and makes excellent rich espresso... and with the small size and nothing to go wrong, definitely boatable!

In the spirit of trimethylxanthine,
Steve

[skipperaris]

Originally Posted by SAADA

my yacht has an 115A alternator and 2 120A batteries for service purposes. My need for 220V is just a couple of minutes and if I run the main engine to load batteries it looks sufficient to maintain them on high charge level.

Your alternator has 115 A maximum output. That is at maximum speed and maximum electrical demand.

When you run your engine to recharge your batteries your alternator will only put out maybe 10 Amps.

Two - exactly two - minutes of 2000 Watts will consume 166 Amps at 12 Volts. In other words 5,5 Ah.

Charging at a mean of 10 Amps will take about half an hour to get your batteries back unless I've made a mistake in my assumptions and my calculations.

You could help by running your main engine->alternator at highish revs while you are using your inverter.

[seafox]

hi there
why does a 115amp alternator only put out 10 amps? Shouldn't it be called a 10 amp alternator?

[GordMay]

An alternator's output is dependent on speed, but this can be deceiving because this output is not linear. Instead, it follows a curve. Each alternator has a unique curve, and at idle small changes in the alternator's speed can make a big difference in its output capacity. Some curves rise abruptly at low speed and level off. This type of winding is more for low speed operation. Other curves rise more slowly but peak at a higher point.

The alternator rotor RPM is not the same as engine RPM. To calculate the actual alternator RPM, determine the ratio between the two pulley diameters.
Ratio = Crankshaft Pulley Diameter/ Alternator Pulley Diameter
Then:
Rotor RPM = Pulley Ratio x Engine Speed (example; 2.1 x 870 = 1827 Rotor RPM)

Output Amperages may also vary, based on ambient temperature*, battery type, battery condition, wire size, and a variety of other factors.

* The cold rating is for an ambient air temperature of 77 deg. F (25C). The hot rating is for an ambient air temperature of 200 deg. F. (93C).

See also: “Alternator Specification Basics”
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...sics-2532.html


These curves (below) are for a 150 Amp Alternator. Note the (hot & cold) speeds at which it actually puts out 150A.

[hellosailor]

Amplifying what Gord said: Some "automotive" alternators have a mximum shaft speed as low as 8,000 RPM. Others, literally, more than twice that. They are not all the same, and each one has a maximum sustained speed rating. Matching up the alternator, and pulleys, so that it gives high output at low RPMs without burning up at sustained high RPMs (i.e. running in a storm) can be a good trick. Running an alternator too conservatively, can mean you'll never see more than half-power at idling speeds, if that much. A marine diesel may idle at 500RPM and top out at 4000 RPM, while a car engine may run from 500-7500RPM, so the alternator curves must be quite different to match up to the operating conditions.

Then there is the charging logic used in each regulator, that varies as well. Automotive regulators are designed so they will not cook the battery, they assume the major drain willbe the starter itself and that the battery is never deep cycled. (oops.) They WILL put out high capacity when they first start, typically taking some ten minutes to replace the energy used in starting the engine. But once the battery gets up to 80-90% capacity, they ramp way down, based on voltage alone, and put out low amperage for a very long time.

As opposed to a more complex marine regulator, which typically uses a 3-stage algorithm and works better simply because someone spent more money building more brains into it.

[Bleck]

Originally Posted by oldsalt_1942

I have to admit that looks like a pretty neat coffee maker. If my Krups craps (couldn't resist) I'd definately give it a try. The only drawback I can see for someone going long term cruising in out of the way places would be the filters. The french press has a metal filter that's easily cleaned and doesn't need replacing after a cup of coffee.

The nespresso cofe machine has a metal filter only and individual aluminium caps doses. the good thing is the coffee wil mantein there flavor during months
Regards
Carlos

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

... Running an alternator too conservatively, can mean you'll never see more than half-power at idling speeds, if that much. A marine diesel may idle at 500RPM and top out at 4000 RPM ...
... Then there is the charging logic used in each regulator, that varies as well ...

Assuming a typical 3:1 pulley ratio, we can see (on the Zena curve) that this alternator would put out only about 30 Amps at a 500 RPM engine idle (1,500 Alt’ Rotor RPM), or about 20% of Rated output.

[MidLandOne]

If one has the luxury of choosing a suitable alternater and engine then it is possible to get pretty much full output from the alternater from fast idle to max engine revs without exceeding the alternater's max rpm.

We have a 105A large frame Leece-Neville on a 2,900 max revs engine which achieves that. At normal idle output is not much down on max.

Not so easy to achieve if retrofitting and one has a high reving turbo'ed engine though .