NMEA - WIFI - Connectivity

[georgy.goshin]

Originally Posted by RenoirIII

Greeting All,
My aim is to have a wifi system where I can view all data on a tablet at my nav station.

Any advice would be enormously appreciated...

Renoir

Onwa KC-2W

[RenoirIII]

Well thanks for all these suggestions and advice. I actually did have a Yakbitz multi directional NMEA to WIFI bridge that I forgot to install on my old boat Lowrance elite. It had a wiring diagram and seemed very easy to setup (but never did).

However, can someone explain how this bridge is connected to my E80 Classic?
Do I need the SeaYak ST1 to NMEA to USB bridge and how do I convert this to WIFI?
Do I need to get an additional Yakker for the AIS and how does this connect?

I'm just coming to grip (I think) with SeaTalk. I was looking for a box with SeaTalk on it but now I think this is just the system (backbone) itself: correct?

A schematic would help enormously...

[belizesailor]

My suggestion is you contact YakBitz directly for specifics, very helpful and knowledgeable support.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by RenoirIII

Well thanks for all these suggestions and advice. I actually did have a Yakbitz multi directional NMEA to WIFI bridge that I forgot to install on my old boat Lowrance elite. It had a wiring diagram and seemed very easy to setup (but never did).

However, can someone explain how this bridge is connected to my E80 Classic?
Do I need the SeaYak ST1 to NMEA to USB bridge and how do I convert this to WIFI?
Do I need to get an additional Yakker for the AIS and how does this connect?

I'm just coming to grip (I think) with SeaTalk. I was looking for a box with SeaTalk on it but now I think this is just the system (backbone) itself: correct?

A schematic would help enormously...

No one can answer this question without a diagram of your system.


If you have all the SeaTalk linked with the E80, and if the E80 has an NMEA0183 talker port, then most likely the E80 multiplexes everything itself and you just need to connect the multiplexer or a simpler 0183-to-Wifi device to this port. That port may be connected to your VHF, but that's OK -- you just connect the VHF to the talker port on your wifi device (or multiplexer).


Some Vesper AIS units will put 0183 data over Wifi, but then you will need to get the network data onto it.


Again, we need to see a diagram of what is connected to what on your system.


You also need to think about what software you will use on tablets to use that data, and you need to think about exactly what you want the system to do.


As one example -- if you are using Ipads, then you can use INavX to do plotting plus display different kinds of network data (depth, wind, boat speed, AIS, etc.). However, you will have to buy separate cartography for the tablet (in any case and with every program). But there are many choices, all with different pluses and minuses, so you will have to choose yourself.


No tablet system I know displays engine data, and although there are 0183 sentences for some engine data, I will bet you dollars to doughnuts your network doesn't have any engine data on it. Nor would I try to put engine data on an 0183 network; I would go straight to NMEA2000 if you want to do that.

[Dockhead]

By the way, instead of a tablet (or in addition to a tablet), you might consider a mini PC at the nav table with a proper monitor. Then you can run OpenCPN, which can use any kind of cartography, which is free, which is immensely powerful. Tablets are great for carrying around with you, anchor alarm in your bunk, under the spray hood in bad weather, etc., but it is hard or impossible to do real navigation on them. If you have room at the nav table for a decent sized monitor, this is an entirely different story.


At my nav table, I have BOTH a plotter (8" B&G Zeus) AND a minicomputer with 23" monitor running OpenCPN. OpenCPN is an absolutely fantastic tool with which you can do almost any navigation job you can do on paper, and to boot has a vastly better AIS display than you can get on a plotter.


You will not be able to display your radar any way except on your proprietary MFD, but some newer radars can be displayed on computers or tablets. My B&G 4G radar for example can be controlled by and displayed on OpenCPN.




In addition to the minicomputer, I do have a tablet (8" rugged waterproof Samsung) which I use under the spray hood, in my bunk, etc. I use the Navico Go Free system which allows me to remote control my MFD's. But I don't use this all that much compared to the minicomputer, which is a fundamental tool which I use more or less constantly.

[Blue2cat]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

Its not you, NMEA protocol uses text based "sentences" which dont support image data. This means you cant communicate the RADAR image data via NMEA, but there are RADAR related sentences which communicate RADAR related info such as EBL and target data.

Maybe I dont understand this comment. I have a B&G radar with chartplotter which uses the NMEA system. Just hooked it up but not run it yet. Bought together so I assume that NMEA does support radar images????

[svmobert]

Originally Posted by Blue2cat

Maybe I dont understand this comment. I have a B&G radar with chartplotter which uses the NMEA system. Just hooked it up but not run it yet. Bought together so I assume that NMEA does support radar images????

The radar and chartplotter can communicate with each other, but not over NMEA. The Radar and Chartplotter communicate with each other over a proprietary (ethernet-based) network, not NMEA. NMEA0183 and NMEA2000 are marine instrument sharing network protocols, but they are not fast enough to transmit full radar data. It's the same for SiriusXM receivers, Fishfinder sounders, and multiple chartplotters sharing charts, etc.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Blue2cat

Maybe I dont understand this comment. I have a B&G radar with chartplotter which uses the NMEA system. Just hooked it up but not run it yet. Bought together so I assume that NMEA does support radar images????

To my knowledge there are no NMEA sentences that transport RADAR image data, only sentences that contain non-image data like EBL, heading, target info etc. RADAR image data is moved separately by proprietary protocols...thus the difficulty in integrating it into open solutions like OpenCPN.

[Cat36Mahalo]

First you need to convert your SeaTalk-1 to SeaTalkNG - Raymarine has a converter for that, then you connect your Vesper to that with a SeatalkNG to DeviceNet cable. As someone mentioned some Vespers will send data via WiFi
If yours doesn’t i like YachtDevices N2000 to WiFi bridge. You can get it with a SeatalkNG end so you don’t need another cable. Total $ is about $400US

[Hans V]

Originally Posted by Cat36Mahalo

First you need to convert your SeaTalk-1 to SeaTalkNG - Raymarine has a converter for that, then you connect your Vesper to that with a SeatalkNG to DeviceNet cable. As someone mentioned some Vespers will send data via WiFi
If yours doesn’t i like YachtDevices N2000 to WiFi bridge. You can get it with a SeatalkNG end so you don’t need another cable. Total $ is about $400US

If you need two separate devices you may be better off with a wifi-capable multiplexer like the above-mentioned Miniplex 3. It does all the conversions, offers filtering and prioritization (if wanted) and puts all the NMEA sentences on wifi for your tablets and phones.

If you buy a wifi-capable AIS unit that outputs all the necessary NMEA data on wifi and you don't have any filtering or prioritization needs, that may be the easiest (but maybe not the cheapest) solution.

[Hans V]

Originally Posted by Cat36Mahalo

First you need to convert your SeaTalk-1 to SeaTalkNG - Raymarine has a converter for that, then you connect your Vesper to that with a SeatalkNG to DeviceNet cable. As someone mentioned some Vespers will send data via WiFi
If yours doesn’t i like YachtDevices N2000 to WiFi bridge. You can get it with a SeatalkNG end so you don’t need another cable. Total $ is about $400US

If you need two separate devices you may be better off with a wifi-capable multiplexer like the above-mentioned Miniplex 3. It does all the conversions, offers filtering and prioritization (if wanted) and puts all the NMEA sentences on wifi for your tablets and phones.

If you buy a wifi-capable AIS unit that outputs all the necessary NMEA data on wifi and you don't have any filtering or prioritization needs, that may be the most KISS (but not necessarily the cheapest) solution.

[Cat36Mahalo]

Originally Posted by Hans V

If you need two separate devices you may be better off with a wifi-capable multiplexer like the above-mentioned Miniplex 3. It does all the conversions, offers filtering and prioritization (if wanted) and puts all the NMEA sentences on wifi for your tablets and phones.

If you buy a wifi-capable AIS unit that outputs all the necessary NMEA data on wifi and you don't have any filtering or prioritization needs, that may be the most KISS (but not necessarily the cheapest) solution.

How are you federating the data from the SeatalkNG-1 network. I assume at a minimum there is water speed and depth, maybe wind. You would need to know much more about the instrument topology to suggest a 183 solution (which would be outdated before it’s even installed.

Additionally the Vesper AIS only transmits a small subsection of PGN, and no engine data

For engine data -if you can’t get CAN data from the engine (yachtdevices has those converters) I have a Nolan’s engineering RS11 but Actisence make a good analogue conversion box also.
Les

[svmobert]

Originally Posted by RenoirIII

Well thanks for all these suggestions and advice. I actually did have a Yakbitz multi directional NMEA to WIFI bridge that I forgot to install on my old boat Lowrance elite. It had a wiring diagram and seemed very easy to setup (but never did).

However, can someone explain how this bridge is connected to my E80 Classic?
Do I need the SeaYak ST1 to NMEA to USB bridge and how do I convert this to WIFI?
Do I need to get an additional Yakker for the AIS and how does this connect?

I'm just coming to grip (I think) with SeaTalk. I was looking for a box with SeaTalk on it but now I think this is just the system (backbone) itself: correct?

A schematic would help enormously...

RenoirIII, the first step to getting answers here is to create a diagram of how your current system is wired.. Once you have that, then others can help with the best approach to augmenting the system to add any features you want, like NMEA WiFi, etc. There are so many variables, for example, the E80 specifically has only 1 NMEA0183 port which is bi-directional. Transmit and Receive are always at the same speed as each other, either 4800(Normal) or 38400(for AIS). Before recommending, as Dockhead suggested, to just put a multiplexer on that NMEA0183 port, and put any VHF on the talker port of the multiplexer, you have to understand how the system functions currently. And a VHF radio does more than listen, it also talks, and you want that data to get back to the E80. just an example, and not to say that Dockhead is wrong, as it could just be that simple, but without a diagram of your current system, there is no way to know for sure.

[Cat36Mahalo]

@sea-tech systems. There is no such thing as bi-directional NMEA 0183. It only works in one direction the Talker to one or many Listeners. A Device like the plotter you mention may have an in and an out but that in no way constrains the ports to talk and listen to a device with both in and out. Additionally the in and out don’t need to be the same speed unless the firmware constrains it to be.

A 0183 “network” is simply one talker and one or more listeners. A older boat may have many 0183 networks. GPS -> chart Plotter + VHF. VHF to chart plotter.

[svmobert]

Originally Posted by Cat36Mahalo

@sea-tech systems. There is no such thing as bi-directional NMEA 0183. It only works in one direction the Talker to one or many Listeners. A Device like the plotter you mention may have an in and an out but that in no way constrains the ports to talk and listen to a device with both in and out. Additionally the in and out don’t need to be the same speed unless the firmware constrains it to be.

A 0183 “network” is simply one talker and one or more listeners. A older boat may have many 0183 networks. GPS -> chart Plotter + VHF. VHF to chart plotter.

Trying to be somewhat simplistic in my previous answer.. Correct, technically NMEA0183 transmits in one direction, but most devices have both a TX and an RX connection because they both provide and consume data.

In the case of the E80, which is the device I was referring to, the speed MUST be the same because that is the constraint on that device. Obviously other devices/systems have their own contraints, some have autosensing port speeds, some are configurable, some have multiple ports each with different speeds, etc..

The point I was trying to make in my previous response is that without knowing how the data flows between the devices on your vessel, you can't simply stick something in the middle and expect it to work. First identify what is talking to what, via which ports/wires, research the specs and constraints of each device, then formulate a plan for how to change it to do what you want. Don't just randomly insert devices in the mix that may or may not do what is needed to keep things talking.

As an example, some NMEA mux's filter out AIS data, others don't support AIS data between NMEA0183 and NMEA2000, some will receive data from NMEA0183 and output it to WiFi, but not back to the NMEA0183 devices, and others send all incoming data out to all out ports (which may not be desirable). This is all I was trying to say.. In addition to highlighting a specific limitation with the E80 that could be pertinent to the solution.