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Old 25-01-2014, 04:53   #31
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Hi.

I'd go for Furuno for the Radar. and learn to read one....
I've been on fishing boats. a lifetime on yacchts and a few yrs on game boats.

The Furuno 16 mile Radar (2 and a bit grand. around 27ft up your mast will give you around 8 miles max. An antenna siting on a 9 ft pole on transom will be lucky to give you 4 miles or less on a bumpy day.
and the Furuno WILL give you 12in mooring boys at 2 in morning in pissin' rain. I know.
they are about the best.

Furuno and Garmin will last forever. I still have a 12model H Held GPS here.
Icom radio and you'll be set.

You want reliability. Furuno. Garmin, and Icom. are the ONLY ones that will give it to you on a long term basis. (and Koden sounder \Codan HF radio
Pick models to suit yourself.
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Old 25-01-2014, 05:03   #32
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My Garmin 4foot open array failed after 3 years !


I've found little difference in the big four

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Old 25-01-2014, 05:44   #33
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

I think what maka17 was trying to say is that each of these companies had bread and butter products that they developed that were the class of the field. Furuno=Radar Garmin=GPS and Icom=Radios. Its also my view.
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Old 25-01-2014, 14:52   #34
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

We traveled the Canadian Maritimes last year with a Simrad 4G. Wonderful resolution - we could often see a separate blimp for the dingy being towed behind its mothership. Great system. Oh, at home we can see our own mooring bouy. The 4g is about twenty feet up the mast.
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Old 28-01-2014, 16:09   #35
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Ive been totally happy with the furuno navpilot. Their customer service has been top notch going above and beyond what one would accept as normal. I had a recent failure of the hydraulic drive unit and I can say the same thing about the accusteer hydraulic pump. When I called customer service to inquire about the servicability of the pumpset they were great. After telling the service rep its been in service for 8 years and 20k miles he said its probably the brushes are worn out. He then told me how to check the brushes and said if theyre worn out just call back and hed send me a set. If it was another failure besides brushes he said send it in and hed let me know what needed to be replaced before work commenced.Typically a 1 day turnaround, In other words they dont treat their stuff like throwaway nonserviceable junk and my 8 yr old pump is no where near out of date, My 2 cents.
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Old 28-01-2014, 18:46   #36
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Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
I think what maka17 was trying to say is that each of these companies had bread and butter products that they developed that were the class of the field. Furuno=Radar Garmin=GPS and Icom=Radios. Its also my view.
Yes but in practice this isn't so, Furunos reputation comes from much higher speced commercial radars and icom is often surpassed by standard horizon.

Various tests ( like on Panbo) show little difference in the radars from Garmin , Raymarine , furuno and Simrad especially towards the higher end. Clearly one would chose a radar to stay within the same company family to gain the benefits of integration. Hence the decision on radar is mostly determined by the brand of MFD chosen

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Old 07-02-2014, 12:38   #37
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

I have heard that even using NMEA 2000 compatible devices, sometimes certain systems don't want to talk to one another. For example, using Raymarine equipment with Furuno, etc.

Is this the same case for B&G and Simrad? I assume that because they are essentially the same equipment but just rebranded, that there will be no issues using a Simrad autopilot with a B&G MFD, and Simrad AIS. Or am I wrong?
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Old 07-02-2014, 14:18   #38
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

I was taking to Navico tech support this morning about that. Simrad and B&G pilot computer, AC12 and AC42, are the exact same one, hardware and firmware. The only difference is that Simrad still can be ordered with Simnet cable. This is the same thing with all those accessories, RC42, RF25, etc.

Simrad is fading down Simnet and all their NMEA2000 equipment now have Micro-C part number.
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Old 15-02-2014, 17:20   #39
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

I thought I'd post in this thread instead of starting another one, but I have a few more questions regarding B&G/Simrad...

It seems they are about to launch their new line of chartplotters, The Zeus2 and NSS evo2, respectively, and I am seeing alot of discounts and rebates going on for the Zeus Touch and NSS evo models. Are the differences worth waiting for? I tried to ask around at the boat show">Miami boat show but it seemed like I couldn't get any answers from people who were even working the event... go figure. I am planning on purchasing a whole suite of electronics in the next month, but is it worth waiting a few more months until the new MFD's are released? I know the new systems will be a first generation and therein lies a concern with bugs/problems. I am just wondering to pull the trigger on a discounted/outgoing system or buy all new.
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Old 15-02-2014, 17:56   #40
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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I am planning on purchasing a whole suite of electronics in the next month, but is it worth waiting a few more months until the new MFD's are released?
Yes, definitely. It is even much more worth it to wait another couple of years!

The problem is the same with all consumer electronics - as soon as you buy something, they make it better and possibly cheaper - and it will have features you wished you had waited for. You can only be on the top of the curve for a few months before you are a has-been again.

The solution is to buy something that meets your requirements and then stop looking at the new stuff. You will never know what you are missing.

The Zeus 2 and related Navico products were announced three or four months ago - I'm surprised you can't find info on them. I recall the B&G included several very nice sailing functions, but I don't know if those will also be available on software updates to their recently previous stuff.

That is the question you want to ask them.

As for bugs - it is highly unlikely that these new models have completely new software. It is far more likely that they are running the same software as they older models with some new features. I wouldn't call that first generation. Besides, the way this works now is that bug fixes, etc are released quite regularly and are easy to apply. We bought some of the very first Triton MFD's that shipped with pre-release software. We have updated them 4 times in 2 years, and it takes 5 minutes.

As to your previous post regarding mixing brands in NMEA2000 - the one single company I would be concerned with is Raymarine, and only with their autopilots there. RM still stubbornly uses proprietary instructions for their autopilots. This is an industry shame and they should be punished for it by refusing to purchase any of their products. Aside from that, the rest of their equipment is fully N2K compliant and won't have any problems working fully with other vendor equipment.

AFAIK, all other vendors now are fully compatible communication-wise with each other. I think there is something fishy with one of Garmin's sensors, but I forgot which one, or what the problem is. Maybe the wind sensor?

We have Furuno, Maretron, Actisense, Simrad (before full B&G integration), B&G and Airmar NMEA2000 stuff all acting seamlessly and fully together with no problems.

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Old 15-02-2014, 18:11   #41
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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Originally Posted by DDabs View Post
I have heard that even using NMEA 2000 compatible devices, sometimes certain systems don't want to talk to one another. For example, using Raymarine equipment with Furuno, etc.

Is this the same case for B&G and Simrad? I assume that because they are essentially the same equipment but just rebranded, that there will be no issues using a Simrad autopilot with a B&G MFD, and Simrad AIS. Or am I wrong?
This has not been my experience at all. I have a mixture of N2K devices of different brands in my boat and they work fine together. I think vendors just like to try to scare you into buying all their stuff.

What IS a potential pain is configuring and updating devices. Many don't require any configuration at all, like a GPS, but some do. An example is a tank level sensor that needs to be calibrated. That sort of configuration seems to all be proprietary to each vendor. To configure Maretron's stuff you need (at least at initial setup) a Maretron display or PC tool to configure it. Same is true with other vendors too.

My only advice when setting up an N2K system would be to look at which devices need configuration, and be sure you have a way to do it. And be sure you have a way to update their firmware, because that happens.

Now, before people jump in and say this is why N2K has failed, let me point out that the same is true for 0183 devices, and for all forms of proprietary systems, so it's not a step backwards, just a step forwards that hasn't been taken yet.
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Old 15-02-2014, 18:19   #42
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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To configure Maretron's stuff you need (at least at initial setup) a Maretron display or PC tool to configure it. Same is true with other vendors too.
Just to clarify, the Maretron PC software that does this is free.

I can also configure and calibrate our Airmar depth and speed N2K transducers from any other MFD device or computer using free Actisense, Maretron or Airmar software, so at least these play very nicely with others.

But outside of that, yes, device calibration is still one sticky area with N2K. However, things like chartplotters, etc don't really need calibration or configuration from other components.

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Old 15-02-2014, 19:20   #43
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

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Just to clarify, the Maretron PC software that does this is free.
True, but you need one of their USB or Ethernet to N2K interface boxes for it to work. If you already have one for other needs then there is no incremental cost to load and run the software. But for some number of people the only reason they would need one of these interfaces is to run the config software.

These are not insurmountable problems, but can lead to unexpected cost and frustration if you haven't thought it through up front.
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Old 15-02-2014, 19:44   #44
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Ah yes, you are correct - I forgot that I have their USB interface for other reasons.

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Old 15-02-2014, 20:24   #45
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Re: Furuno, Simrad/B&G or Ray

Mark, thanks. For what I intend to use the software for, I don't think I need the latest and greatest. I don't think I'm going to need the B&G software for all of the sailing functions. The tack lines and all of that are really cool features, but I'm really just concerned with the charts and radar. The AP will most likely be Simrad and therefore I'm thinking that I will do everything Simrad, including the MFD and instrumentation. I like the IS20 analog wind gauges that match the AP24, rather than the digital Triton gauges. For some reason I do not like the wind gauge to be digital.
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