Do you use a Daytime Black ball at Anchor?

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by chrisr

i cannot believe that a thread on such an inconsequential subject has now passed 67 pages / 1002 posts !

maybe it's covid, but surely there is something more interesting in your lives ?

cheers,

Since you obviously found this subject interesting enough to click on it and actually added to the high number of posts by making one of your own, are we to conclude that you have nothing more interesting in your life? Or possibly you do have lots of other more interesting things going on but had just a few minutes to kill so logged onto CF to amuse yourself, just like the rest of us occasionally do? Myself, I was awakened in the middle of the night by an air bubble causing my water pump to run constantly so I had to get up and turn on a faucet to get it to stop running and then didn’t feel sleepy, so….

If you find a subject uninteresting, then don’t click on it! I’ve never understood posters who log on, click on a thread, and then make a post announcing that they think the thread is boring or it’s time for the thread to be closed. Wouldn’t it be easier to just click on “unsubscribe” and let others who feel differently continue on with their thread that is no longer of interest to you?

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by capn_billl

[…]Next time I anchor, I'm going to hoist it,(right next to the pirate flag), for no other reason than it's good seamanship.

You do realize that hoisting the Jolly Roger allows anyone to open fire at you, board you etc.?

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

Since you obviously found this subject interesting enough to click on it and actually added to the high number of posts by making one of your own, are we to conclude that you have nothing more interesting in your life? Or possibly you do have lots of other more interesting things going on but had just a few minutes to kill so logged onto CF to amuse yourself, just like the rest of us occasionally do? Myself, I was awakened in the middle of the night by an air bubble causing my water pump to run constantly so I had to get up and turn on a faucet to get it to stop running and then didn’t feel sleepy, so….

If you find a subject uninteresting, then don’t click on it! I’ve never understood posters who log on, click on a thread, and then make a post announcing that they think the thread is boring or it’s time for the thread to be closed. Wouldn’t it be easier to just click on “unsubscribe” and let others who feel differently continue on with their thread that is no longer of interest to you?

i contributed usefully to this thread a couple of times very early on. since then i've ignored it

was simply expressing my surprise that such a minor inconsequential molehill has grown to such a mountain

here in australia we often say aussies would bet on anything...even 2 flies crawling up a wall. on the other hand it seems cf members will argue about anything...even the colour of their balls

it was this willingness that amused me...not the subject

sorry if this offends you

cheers,

[BigBoater917]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

I'm having trouble seeing the anchor ball in the pictures, but I think I see a big anchor chain bridle. I also see a wake from the barge, and it tells me how the sailboat skipper got into trouble.

Yep, the ebb tide ate them up.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

At least half of the sailboats had some or all of their sails up but not a cone in sight all day, and yet there was no confusion as to right of way.

"Right of way" - really?!?!
IME, in US waters sailboaters motoring with sails up mistakenly believe they are not power-driven vessels, and generally stand-on when they shouldn't - probably trying to assert their imagined "right of way."

[Hydro]

The anchor ball/lights etc go hand in hand with making way and underway.

UNDER WAY AND MAKING WAY DIFFERENCE

If no anchor ball visible, one could assume they are “underway” or “making way” and you would need to use caution.

[s/v Jedi]

Nope, no anchor balls

[thinwater]

Not denial, I swear, more like sharing the work load.


I checked government boating safety sites for several nearby states. They talk about running lights, lights on ships (towing), and anchor lights, but none mention day shapes or black balls.


* Does your state mention day shapes in boater safety pages and hand-outs?
* How do you feel about that? Seems like no mentioning something you do every day is a big miss. Seems odd to mention anchor lights and then not mention day shapes. They receive equal time in COLREGS. What does that imply?

Discuss.

[Mike OReilly]

Once again I'll draw a parallel between those who take a hard legal line on black water dumping, and those who insist the only right answer is to use the anchor day shape. In contrast we have those who see no practical justification for sticking to the letter of the law in either case.

It's interesting that at least a few here are on one side of the law regarding black water dumping, but on the other with regard to black shape hoisting.

[Spot]

Is a boat, on a trailer, in a driveway, during a tractor pull, in corn country, far inland, considered in a special anchoirage? If not maybe I should hoist...

[team karst]

Over 50 years of boating in FL, and recall only seeing day shapes on inlet dredges. Also, I did a lot of anchoring with divers. At the time, I thought we were good with the Alpha flag and the diver down flag. The Alpha Flag is “limited maneuverability”. Not sure how that one plays in this topic.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Hydro

The anchor ball/lights etc go hand in hand with making way and underway.

UNDER WAY AND MAKING WAY DIFFERENCE

If no anchor ball visible, one could assume they are “underway” or “making way” and you would need to use caution.

Indeed. The purpose of all day shapes and lights is to provide INFORMATION to other vessels about your navigational status and aspect.


Several people have questioned the practical usefulness of anchor balls and motoring cones. Well, when making way through a crowd of boats, wouldn't you like to be able to distinguish at a glance those which are underway, from those which are anchored? With AIS perhaps it's less mission critical, but I remember sailing along the Dutch North Sea coast in the days before AIS and being AWFULLY glad I could exclude those anchored ships with anchor balls, from the list of vessls I needed to do plots on. Vessel with a ball is not going to move; vessel without a ball is underway and you need to follow the collision avoidance protocols. Spending time wondering is precious time taken from doing those plots.


Motoring cone is even more important. I admit to not always using it -- it's a PITA when the motor goes on and off frequently in flukey winds. But if another vessel sees a sail, it will assume you are a vessel under sail, and different rules apply, than would with regard to a power driven vessel. That confusion is harmful and dangerous. The motoring cone declares your status as a power driven vessel -- it's important.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Once again I'll draw a parallel between those who take a hard legal line on black water dumping, and those who insist the only right answer is to use the anchor day shape. In contrast we have those who see no practical justification for sticking to the letter of the law in either case.

It's interesting that at least a few here are on one side of the law regarding black water dumping, but on the other with regard to black shape hoisting.

Well, there are different ways to look at this.


I use day shapes (most of the time) not because they are required by the letter of the law, but because I think using day shapes is sensible and useful and seamanlike. If I thought using day shapes was useless and stupid, and I were navigating in the waters of a country which didn't enforce these rules, then I wouldn't use them. But I don't consider the use of day shapes to be uselss or stupid.


What concerns black water -- my home waters don't restrict discharge of black water except near beaches or shellfish beds. I follow the rules strictly.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Well, there are different ways to look at this.


I use day shapes (most of the time) not because they are required by the letter of the law, but because I think using day shapes is sensible and useful and seamanlike. If I thought using day shapes was useless and stupid, and I were navigating in the waters of a country which didn't enforce these rules, then I wouldn't use them. But I don't consider the use of day shapes to be uselss or stupid.


What concerns black water -- my home waters don't restrict discharge of black water except near beaches or shellfish beds. I follow the rules strictly.

The parallel is that some people report the same regarding black water discharge. Some believe it is harmless, and indeed better to discharge a short length from shore. Others believe this is ecologically bad (useless), and unseamanlike. In the absence of quality evidence, it seems we all choose to believe our beliefs are correct.

Many people, mostly us here in North America, report that the day shapes are useless. I don't think anyone has called them stupid. Others say the opposite. Clearly this one is geographically based, so as with most issues, the sound advice would be to do as the Romans do when in Rome.

[senormechanico]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

If it looks like a ball and is displayed in the forward rigging like an anchor ball would be, yes, I think it would be.

I remember being close up and personal with Lady Washington when she was first built. We went through the Ballard Locks together.
There was a flat black painted RADAR just ahead of the mizzen mast, along with a permanently mounted,flat black painted radar reflector.
When asked why they were painted black, I was told it was "to make her look more authentic to the time period".