Cost of transom extensions for 39’ catamaran?

[CaptainPete222]

I’m interested in extending the transoms of my 2016 Lagoon 39. I read another thread that had an excellent discussion about the pros and cons of catamaran transom extensions, but all discussion on pricing was either DIY costs or costs for work done in foreign countries. I’m hoping to hear from anyone who had the work done professionally in the US and, if so, what the costs were.

[smj]

Originally Posted by CaptainPete222

I’m interested in extending the transoms of my 2016 Lagoon 39. I read another thread that had an excellent discussion about the pros and cons of catamaran transom extensions, but all discussion on pricing was either DIY costs or costs for work done in foreign countries. I’m hoping to hear from anyone who had the work done professionally in the US and, if so, what the costs were.

We had transom extensions done to our Seawind 1000 about 10 years ago and the cost was about $10k, same holds true for a couple of other friends that had the same thing done. I’m sure the costs have gone up since.

[CaptainPete222]

Originally Posted by smj

We had transom extensions done to our Seawind 1000 about 10 years ago and the cost was about $10k, same holds true for a couple of other friends that had the same thing done. I’m sure the costs have gone up since.

Thanks. I know it was 10 years ago, but do you mind me asking if it was it done on the east coast of the US and, if so, who did the work for you? I’d like to find a yard that has done the work before.

[smj]

Originally Posted by CaptainPete222

Thanks. I know it was 10 years ago, but do you mind me asking if it was it done on the east coast of the US and, if so, who did the work for you? I’d like to find a yard that has done the work before.

Yes, done on the east coast. Mine were done in Fl and the contractor has since passed. Two others I know of were done in NC and the contractor has recently retired, both guys were pretty talented but not really to hard of a job.

[Ifitsworthdoing]

Following as also interested in this topic (am about to commission our boat build but based in Europe). I understand extending the immersed hull will make for a higher displacement hull speed as well as creating added internal space, but assume the manufacturer/yard would have to have the boat’s official seaworthiness assessment redone? That might be just as costly as the actual physical work …

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by CaptainPete222

I’m interested in extending the transoms of my 2016 Lagoon 39. I read another thread that had an excellent discussion about the pros and cons of catamaran transom extensions, but all discussion on pricing was either DIY costs or costs for work done in foreign countries. I’m hoping to hear from anyone who had the work done professionally in the US and, if so, what the costs were.

Well you can extend that swimming house boat to 50ft and it won't sail a knot faster. Lagoon are not good sailing cats and the 39 is the worst of all of them.
Sorry thats not personal but the 39 sucks big time, have 2 buddies which sold their 39 within a year.
I have a 40ft Lavezzi, we tried my 8m round sail on his 39...mine is doing 6-7kn with 10kn straight downwind, his 39 did struggle to hit 3kn....Parasailor 120sqm mine does 10kn with 12kn of wind, his 39 did make hardly 6kn in same condition. My downwind sails which I know well, in quite new conditions and both manufacturers said they work on the 39 Lagoon too. So we tried them on his 39 Lagoon as he was interested to see how they work and what he should get for the barefoot route.... Performance was bad and the sail back wind directly from 110 degrees, which is the chocolate angle for the 39 made hardly 5kn in 12kn of wind. 5 bluewater sailor with each more then 50000sm on board, so we tried all to get that 39 sailing....
Well he sold the 39 quite fast...

[CaptainPete222]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

Well you can extend that swimming house boat to 50ft and it won't sail a knot faster. Lagoon are not good sailing cats and the 39 is the worst of all of them.
Sorry thats not personal but the 39 sucks big time, have 2 buddies which sold their 39 within a year.
I have a 40ft Lavezzi, we tried my 8m round sail on his 39...mine is doing 6-7kn with 10kn straight downwind, his 39 did struggle to hit 3kn....Parasailor 120sqm mine does 10kn with 12kn of wind, his 39 did make hardly 6kn in same condition. My downwind sails which I know well, in quite new conditions and both manufacturers said they work on the 39 Lagoon too. So we tried them on his 39 Lagoon as he was interested to see how they work and what he should get for the barefoot route.... Performance was bad and the sail back wind directly from 110 degrees, which is the chocolate angle for the 39 made hardly 5kn in 12kn of wind. 5 bluewater sailor with each more then 50000sm on board, so we tried all to get that 39 sailing....
Well he sold the 39 quite fast...

Haha, yeah, I knew what I was getting into with the L39. You don’t have to look much farther than the weight to sail area ratio. But, to be fair, the FP Lavezzi is just a slightly faster “swimming houseboat.” The earlier model FPs were pretty lightly built; the weight is half the L39. Because of the weight, a L39 can carry far more sail area safely than any comparably-sized FP. The added weight of the L39 in light winds is a huge difference, but, in anything 15 or above, the weight is far less of an issue. I blew by a later model FP 40-something in 18 knots of wind flying my Code 0 and a full main. The FP can’t/shouldn’t have that much sail out in 18 (with higher gusts). The relatively heavier weight of the L39 also makes the ride considerably smoother than the similarly-sized FPs I test sailed. So, for me the decision was between faster and more uncomfortable (FP 40) vs slower and having a happier crew when we get to our destination. All boats have their trade offs.

As to why all your experienced crew couldn’t squeeze more than 5 knots at 110 AWA in 12 knots, I don’t know what to say other than that’s pathetic. Unless the 5 of you are extremely overweight or the bottom was covered with barnacles, sailing at 110 with a Code 0 in 12 will be around 6.5-7 knots. At 15 you’ll hit 7.5, 18 will give you 8 and change. Granted, that’s hardly anything to get excited about, but something was wrong with the L39 you sailed.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by CaptainPete222

Haha, yeah, I knew what I was getting into with the L39. You don’t have to look much farther than the weight to sail area ratio. But, to be fair, the FP Lavezzi is just a slightly faster “swimming houseboat.” The earlier model FPs were pretty lightly built; the weight is half the L39. Because of the weight, a L39 can carry far more sail area safely than any comparably-sized FP. The added weight of the L39 in light winds is a huge difference, but, in anything 15 or above, the weight is far less of an issue. I blew by a later model FP 40-something in 18 knots of wind flying my Code 0 and a full main. The FP can’t/shouldn’t have that much sail out in 18 (with higher gusts). The relatively heavier weight of the L39 also makes the ride considerably smoother than the similarly-sized FPs I test sailed. So, for me the decision was between faster and more uncomfortable (FP 40) vs slower and having a happier crew when we get to our destination. All boats have their trade offs.

As to why all your experienced crew couldn’t squeeze more than 5 knots at 110 AWA in 12 knots, I don’t know what to say other than that’s pathetic. Unless the 5 of you are extremely overweight or the bottom was covered with barnacles, sailing at 110 with a Code 0 in 12 will be around 6.5-7 knots. At 15 you’ll hit 7.5, 18 will give you 8 and change. Granted, that’s hardly anything to get excited about, but something was wrong with the L39 you sailed.

No code 0, the standard jib and main with 110 degrees. Wasn‘t overweight, well within specs. He has a code 0 but we needed the bowsprit for the downwind sail comparison so it was not rigged.
Nothing was wrong with the L39, hull quite clean. Sailed it also in more wind and it was the same crap. Been on a friends L380 which sails much better and is 0,5t lighter then the L39.

We just collect all downwind sails from 7 different buddy boats all in the range of 38 till 44 ft cat and monos (mine was the only lighter one below 9T, rest where between 9-15t) to just compare how much effort they are to rig, how they are controlled and how they perform. And my friend offered his L39 as the Test Platform were all manufacturer of sails confirmed it works with this cat…so we had a fair comparison and all the owners of the downwind sails knew their sails and how they perform on their boats.

Yes my Lavezzi is lighter and has also much slimmer hulls and 92sqm of sail area. A 55sqm main and 37sqm jib. It’s the low budget performance cat of the mass production one, not really a house boat as you said, not as fast as the real Performance cats true…. sails well in light and strong winds….reef from 20kn AWA on like a 380 Lagoon does too. Yes much more motions then a heavy cat, true too and I was aware of that before buying it.
For the test that didn‘t count much as we strictly used all the downwind sails on the L39 to compare.
My 8m round sail pulls a 14t 44ft dufour mono with 7-8kn in 12kn, my lighter Lavezzi does the same 7-8kn (with oversized 17x15 3 blade fixed props, with new folding props I will do 9-10kn now) but the L39 struggeled to get 5kn in the same conditions with this same sail. I bought the 8m round sail for my former 13t longkeeler mono ketch, just transferred it to my lighter cat were it works perfectly too. Flew it in 8-35kn AWA so far with the Lavezzi.
But I have oversized 2x Volvo D2-50 with 17x15 3 blade fixed propellers instead the 13x11 which cost me more then 2kn speed at the mo. Will change soon with FFOF props

But you won‘t gain anything more then 0.2kn with a hull extension on your L39…wrong hull shape, sail to weight ratio, bad mast&boom location, ratio jib to main…..the L39 just don‘t give you more.
A Seewind 1160 or a Mahe 36 will profit from 3ft more length, Speed gain around 0,5kn but much less Hobby horsing and that’s why most owner doing it, not for speed
Wanted a Mahe ( couldn’t find anything in 2years)and would have extended it by 3ft, all pre checked and calculated by 2 boat builders.
My Lavezzi has more or less the same living volume then a Mahe and is effectively 39ft long at the waterline.

[CaptainPete222]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

No code 0, the standard jib and main with 110 degrees. Wasn‘t overweight, well within specs. He has a code 0 but we needed the bowsprit for the downwind sail comparison so it was not rigged.
Nothing was wrong with the L39, hull quite clean. Sailed it also in more wind and it was the same crap. Been on a friends L380 which sails much better and is 0,5t lighter then the L39.

We just collect all downwind sails from 7 different buddy boats all in the range of 38 till 44 ft cat and monos (mine was the only lighter one below 9T, rest where between 9-15t) to just compare how much effort they are to rig, how they are controlled and how they perform. And my friend offered his L39 as the Test Platform were all manufacturer of sails confirmed it works with this cat…so we had a fair comparison and all the owners of the downwind sails knew their sails and how they perform on their boats.

Yes my Lavezzi is lighter and has also much slimmer hulls and 92sqm of sail area. A 55sqm main and 37sqm jib. It’s the low budget performance cat of the mass production one, not really a house boat as you said, not as fast as the real Performance cats true…. sails well in light and strong winds….reef from 20kn AWA on like a 380 Lagoon does too. Yes much more motions then a heavy cat, true too and I was aware of that before buying it.
For the test that didn‘t count much as we strictly used all the downwind sails on the L39 to compare.
My 8m round sail pulls a 14t 44ft dufour mono with 7-8kn in 12kn, my lighter Lavezzi does the same 7-8kn (with oversized 17x15 3 blade fixed props, with new folding props I will do 9-10kn now) but the L39 struggeled to get 5kn in the same conditions with this same sail. I bought the 8m round sail for my former 13t longkeeler mono ketch, just transferred it to my lighter cat were it works perfectly too. Flew it in 8-35kn AWA so far with the Lavezzi.
But I have oversized 2x Volvo D2-50 with 17x15 3 blade fixed propellers instead the 13x11 which cost me more then 2kn speed at the mo. Will change soon with FFOF props

But you won‘t gain anything more then 0.2kn with a hull extension on your L39…wrong hull shape, sail to weight ratio, bad mast&boom location, ratio jib to main…..the L39 just don‘t give you more.
A Seewind 1160 or a Mahe 36 will profit from 3ft more length, Speed gain around 0,5kn but much less Hobby horsing and that’s why most owner doing it, not for speed
Wanted a Mahe ( couldn’t find anything in 2years)and would have extended it by 3ft, all pre checked and calculated by 2 boat builders.
My Lavezzi has more or less the same living volume then a Mahe and is effectively 39ft long at the waterline.

I’m inclined to agree the transom extensions won’t give me the half knot that would greatly improve how the boat moves through the water.

I now understand why you and your friends were only getting 5 in 12 at 110: The L39 is pretty much dead in the water without the Code 0. It’s not an optional sail; it’s absolutely necessary in under 15 to get anywhere. Even with the Code 0, I need to run a diesel in under 10 to satisfy my desire to get where I want to be in a reasonable amount of time. But running a diesel when I want some added propulsion isn’t that big a deal for someone like me who’s content to island hop around the Bahamas. Again, trade offs…

[Mike Laing]

Regarding the sailing performance of the Lagoon 39, before dissing it too much, you may want to check out the results of this year's ARC. These are independent hard facts, gained under a number of sailing conditions

https://www.worldcruising.com/arc/ar...x?eventid=132#

[smj]

Originally Posted by Mike Laing

Regarding the sailing performance of the Lagoon 39, before dissing it too much, you may want to check out the results of this year's ARC. These are independent hard facts, gained under a number of sailing conditions



https://www.worldcruising.com/arc/ar...x?eventid=132#

So the Lagoon 39 finished 25th out of 28 catamarans on actual time

[Sail IC]

A friend in a Lavezzi won class b in the ARC 2017. Smallest boat in class b, lowest engine hours, still finished first over water. Beating other boats over water like Seawind 1160, outremer 45 and some catana 471. Finished one day behind an outremer 5x.
On corrected time, all multis, he finished second after a TS42 with a racing crew.
Not bad for a floating swimming pool.

[smj]

Originally Posted by Sail IC

A friend in a Lavezzi won class b in the ARC 2017. Smallest boat in class b, lowest engine hours, still finished first over water. Beating other boats over water like Seawind 1160, outremer 45 and some catana 471. Finished one day behind an outremer 5x.
On corrected time, all multis, he finished second after a TS42 with a racing crew.
Not bad for a floating swimming pool.

The Lavezzi finished 7th out of the 25 catamarans that completed the race, not bad at all. Strange as the Outremer 45 and Catana 47 were at the bottom of the fleet. Maybe some treat this as a race and others treat it as a rally.

[Sail IC]

Originally Posted by smj

The Lavezzi finished 7th out of the 25 catamarans that completed the race, not bad at all. Strange as the Outremer 45 and Catana 47 were at the bottom of the fleet. Maybe some treat this as a race and others treat it as a rally.

Agree. As you wrote the boats, or crew rather, in the ARC are sail differently. Some are racing and some probably only there for getting across and for the social. Anyhow, well sailed, I think the Lavezzi i sailing quite well. This Lavezzi that I know had some really good sails even if the guy is not a racer.

[jmh2002]

It's also one of the reasons and a good reminder why the ARC is not a good way to compare performance between different boats.

Some are racing, some are rallying, and some are just getting to the other side in the company of other boats.