Ticket for no whistle in dinghy??

[DGH]

I thought it was an international standard that life jackets have a whistle???

[StuM]

Originally Posted by DGH

I thought it was an international standard that life jackets have a whistle???

Define Lifejacket


The more generic term is Personal Flotation Device (PDF)



A whistle and a light are both requirements for a SOLAS compliant life jacket, but that is very different to state/national requirements in most places for PDFs, especially in sheltered waters.


The majority of approved leisure PFDs do not meet many of the other SOLAS requirements either.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by DGH

I thought it was an international standard that life jackets have a whistle???

Nope.

https://www.westmarine.com/recreational-life-jackets

Actually almost none of them do in the USA.

Also, the intention is that the whistle is for the boat, not an individual. Silly stuff

[StuM]

Originally Posted by StuM

The more generic term is Personal Flotation Device (PDF)

A whistle and a light are both requirements for a SOLAS compliant life jacket, but that is very different to state/national requirements in most places for PDFs, especially in sheltered waters.

Doh! Too much time working with computer documents!

Obviously should be PFD not PDF

[BlueH2Obound]

Originally Posted by revere

I was in Annapolis a couple of years back and the Coast Guard stopped me in my dink .. He trite to write me a ticket for anything he could find. He asked for my life jackets and when I took them out he said they probably have holes in it which they didn't. Then he noticed there wasn't a whistle attached. And he was proceeding to write a ticket but I told him I have a horn does that count. At that point he proceeded to put his face right up to mine and told me in no uncertain terms to Not blow the horn. So he just gave me a certificate that said I was in compliance and I went on my Merry way. Two days later when I was cleaning out the Dink I went to test the horn and guess what it didn't work hahaha on him

The tone of your post is that you somehow got over on the Coastie. Yet you openly admit that your safety equipment has been non-functional for up to 2 years, or more, and somehow feel PROUD of that?!?
Shame on YOU for not ensuring your safety equipment was operational . . .

[Van Der Beek]

Don't call them cops, let alone peace officers ok
They are revenue agents out there stealing peoples hard earned money! That's it.

It.

Is.

THEFT!

For an actual crime to be committed there needs to be an injured third party, if not no crime has been committed, but hey, government just had to come up with victimless 'crimes' so that they could proceed to steal peoples money. That and to control them like puppets and be in a position to usher in more of them, as to arrest life itself.

Point is, no actual crime has been committed, what has happened is that an act, statue, rule or regulation has been broken. And ALL those are there to replace actual law (in this case the constitution) with the will of government!

Now I'm not saying that ALL acts, statues, rules and regulations are stupid. But things have definitely gotten way out of hand, no?

You see, the ONLY law of the land is the Constitution, anything that steps outside of that document is by default...unlawful.

Not that most people these days care about either that or the Constitution, heck, we even have people out there protesting freedom of speech because someone voiced an opinion that hurt their feelings! Just goes to show how messed up things truly are, including these peoples very mindset.

You didn't have a whistle onboard? HOW DARE YOU.
Now I'm not gonna give you a verbal 'warning', nah, I'm gonna steal your money instead. Because you have committed a 'crime', you sir are a criminal.



Welcome to clown world.

[AA3JY]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Redneck, could you please cite these cases for us? 4 deaths in a year (or more... you say "at least 4" in the same area is kinda terrible, and all close to shore, too. I can but wonder how they happened, and if having a whistle or other gear on board would have affected the outcome.

Jim

Good question..without cited references it’s validity can be questioned...

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by AA3JY

Good question..without cited references it’s validity can be questioned...

True. And if I can’t survive in my dinghy, with no other traffic on the water, in good weather, on a flat calm morning, going 300 feet from boat to dinghy dock, with 2 life jackets, a VHF, cell phone, chart plotter and oars...

Well, just maybe I have no business out on any boat.

Redneckrob absolutely crucified me for saying I had GPS position data issues passing by the United Nations building in a different thread. He demanded proof and video evidence. Demanded I go on a special trip to get him proof.

Well, where is his proof on this claim of how dangerous it is to take a dinghy ashore to a dinghy dock in a protected harbor? All these deaths in Maryland from the same? Where’s the proof?

[Lihuedooley77]

Pretty simple....

Follow the safety equipment regs, have the proper safety gear on board, and be a responsible skipper since you are responsible for the vessel the people on board, yourself and others.

And as to the genius poster who had the harbies or whoever tell him not to sound off that canister style air horn....for knowledgeable people and seaman, and captains, we are aware of donkey breath turkeys pointing that canister horn at a person for funny ho'ho's, and activating it in a persons face. That brilliant move can wipe out human hearing, and shows total ignorance. Try it on yourself, and see how it feels.


What is up with having to comply with safety equipment or other regulations. One of the items on my pre sail inspection before departure is safety equipment, operational and up to date , and inspected. That goes for the vessel and the dink gear as well.

Sailing motor and motor vessel capt, for 30 plus years, world wide....I have had one boarding USCG), Catalina Is. Calif, in U.S.A , and one in Mexico, ( armed uniformed men with automatic rifles ). And a close following harbie patrol boat in Newport Harbor. Calif.. I was not in a dingy riding or fishing .
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Avalon Catalina Private instruction on a 32 ft. sailing vessel. Couple from Denver who wanted to get into sailing. Two day training sail..About a 5.5 hour SAIL over to Avalon, Catalina. Before we were set to depart back to Newport Bay, I had them practice anchoring, and as were were hauling up the hook by hand, the wife says...OH GOODY HERE COMES THE COAST GUARD. ( I looked up, it was the weekend warriors on their two week active duty tour )

The Coasties, uniforms, , hand guns, and a shot gun, pull up along side. They ask to come on board. I am a vietnam vet, and a lic. USCG merchant marine officer for vessel up to 100 tons. I look at their officer and see he is packing a semi auto, Colt 45, another coastie has a shot gun.

I Told them that they could come on board, but that shot gun was not coming along with them. ( The shot gunner stayed on board. Also, I asked officer, if he knew how to break down that 45 and clean it.He said Yes sir. COME ABOARD.

Now the fun starts, they are going thru every inch of our vessel, and once in the engine compartment the LT. looks at me, and says. YOU DO NOT HAVE A FLAME ARRESTOR.

Me : " LT. that is diesel engine. " He does not care about that , and he is going to issue a citation. " Go ahead, but when I report to the Coastie office, it is not going to be so good for your fitness report. "

I explain that flame arresters are on gas engines that have a carbourater, diesel engines have injectors and run on heat of compression. NO CARB. Hence no flame arrester.

So, he gives up on that one, and issues a citation for not having a NO DISCHARGE PLACARD visible. OK, I take the citation, put it in the chart table, bid them a good day, and sail back to Newport Beach. The boat is one of of our many sailing club boats that are on lease back from a private individual to the club. I give the citation to my boss, He puts up a placard, and lets the coastie know, and that was that.
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Turtle bay, Baha Ca. , Mexico. Delivery, about 1100 miles, from Cabo to L.A. harbor.

Fuel and water and R and R break after the first four days. After driving off a scumball pirate who tied to board the new Ericson 37... by pointing a hammer cocked back flare gun dead at his chest, well that is a whole other story. For the complainers out there a flare gun is on the safety equipment check list. This puppy was not a plastic red toy it was an old metal very pistol, and looked like a shot gun barrel .

All that is over. The next day we were boarded by what looked like Mexican marines, with assault rifles for an inspection. No problemo, we were polite, they were polite and mostly they were looking for drugs and armementos. Every thing was cordial and ended making friends. No complaining, no sniveling, just another small adventure to note in the log.
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NEWPORT BAY: Advanced lesson 45 foot sailing vessel, headed out to sea. About 6 members on board. UNDER SAIL ( Main and genoa ). The red harbie boat comes zooming up to just off our stern. Speed limit in the harbor is 5 mph or no wake. They are maybe 5 feet max off our stern keeping pace.

So, instead of going ballistic, I told the crew, roll in the jib to 100%, move the sheet bock forward... that slowed us down a bit, still kept our way on, continued on with the lesson, and the harbies pealed off.
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No sniveling, no outrage, just handled the situations, which were a lot more interesting than sitting a dingy, and not having the proper safety equipment, which is actually for the safety of the people on board the dingy.

At no time have I ever sniveled or cried about my constitutional rights. If I was getting a traffic ticket, or what ever, or have my vessel boarded, I am strong enough that I do and not have to go ballistic .

As to police, sheriffs, highway patrol Usually, I am the one responsible for the problem, and I just take care of it, and life is good.

Deflecting the situation on to the police officers, or harbies, or what ever, I do not do that. The one responsible is usually the one looking back at me in the mirror .

If I am responsible for whatever, I admit it , take my lumps and not to the same dumb thing again. But, if I am totally in the right, then I stand my ground.

As to not having the proper safety equipment, that is on the person sitting in the dink, or on board a vessel that is being safety checked and inspected.

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by Lihuedooley77

At no time have I ever sniveled or cried about my constitutional rights.

That's good, no man would ever resort to such behavior.

All you have to do is to exercise those rights and challenge anything that attacks those rights and or the constitution.

As for peace officers they have sworn a duty to protect it, you can't protect it if you don't support it.

Many of them need reminding.

[thinwater]

a. How can we expect a rational policy from the government after reading 150 plus opposing, often whining, posts about a whistle? We, as a people, are an argumentative lot. Why would anyone be surprised that there are law we disagree with? I would be stunned if it were otherwise. I'm OK with that.

b. The word "rights" tends to be a lot like the word "fair;" it means whatever the speaker wants it to mean. And as we have learned, the Constitution is not so simple as it appears, to point where learned men don't agree about what it says, or perhaps what they choose to believe it says.

I'd focus on trying to be nice. It's a start and it is hard enough.

[Lihuedooley77]

Not following my own rules, and rules of common sense as to safety has ended up in problems. For the first sea story, I doubt you would get a ticket, but might be a god plan to avoid..

You might even would have wanted a harbie near by ;

British Virgin Islands, sopers hole, sailing club cruise with about 10 boats, party time, rumming, and full on dingy races. Good time ashore sucking up Pain Killers at Pussers Company dock side bar as well as on board friends boats.

Dark of night, strong winds and strong current heading out to sea. We hop in our dink and bid adios and dink away from their boat to find ours. We are some distance out away from the rest of the fleet moored in Sopers Hole. They are all mored toward the closed end of the harbor, our Jenneau 36 was moored much further out .

There is a strong venturi, where the wind funnels between hills.

Rattle , bang, shake, choke, cough. The dink outboard settles into dead silence. I try to restart it, No luck, I look in the gas tank, look nearly empty.

Now, remember, night time, out going current and strong winds. We are away from the other boats, no flashlight, no handheld VHF radio, no extra fuel, and NO OARS. We are being pushed at a good rate of speed toward the open end of the harbor, out to sea, by the wind and current. No one would probably even miss us. Not good.

I quickly added up my dumb ass mistakes. The oars usually in the dink, I removed and secured to the cabin top hand rails to keep them from possibly getting tossed out of the dink due to the rough seas and the passage to Sopers.

I keep trying to start the out board, and looking for some how stopping the dink,or we will be out on a dark, wild ocean, at night, with no other land to smack into.

" Look, on last mooring can, with a floating painter ! ". I reached out into the water and grabbed the line, and secured our dink. Now what, I looked into the dink fuel tank, and there was a little fuel along the bottom of the tank. Picking up the tank, I held it at an angle to send most of the remaining fuel running over to the side where the fuel up take was located.

I held the tank up, We got the outboard going, and returned back in the mooring field, staying close to other boats and made it to our boat.

Remember , when I mentioned, admit to your own mistakes, and do not make the same one again. Never ever over many years since then did I run out of dink fuel.
And, we always make sure the oars are on board. We also carry a flashlight, and of course life jackets. Plus, getting up there in sunsets, we still party , but not to the extent of those younger years.


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Runawy, dink motor, full ahead, and flat frozen jammed !!!.

Marina Cay, BVI. Beautiful day, Lots of boats in the moorings, perfect day in Paradise. What could go wrong ?

We needed to top off fuel and water and get icd at the Marina Cay docks. I wanted to know, if they had cleats or bollards, as the wind was very strong blowing off the docks and I wanted to be prepared to move fast. No one was manning the dock shack.

So, pretty simple, I will dink over to the dock for a quick look, find out on my own, and head back to the boat . No worries. Note, the charter co dink was old and the outboard ancient, and had been giving us some stuck throttle problems , but just momentarily .

After checking out the dock cleats or whatever, I add twist on some power to dink back to the boat. The engine jams hard into all ahead full and I am roaring thru the anchorage. I come around into the wind, and close aboard and yell for Erica..
' GET UP TOPSIDE ! "

I have now blown past at light speed, making all kinds of engine roaring noises. No doubt entertaining the whole anchorage. Around again, now Erica is up on the starboard side. ' THROTTLE STUCK ..FULL POWER...GET READY TO TAKE THE DINK PAINTER ON MY NEXT APPROACH. "

I do not want to use the emergency shut down, concerned when trying to restart, roar instantly at full power. Buy Sunail a new outboard motor. Me and the dink are hauling okole, big wake, and plenty of loud.

I am turning for my final approach and will pull the emergency shut down cord and use my fore reach to slide up to the hull and Erica can toss me one of the dock lines. .

Pretty simple. Well, remember when is said it was a windy day. I think I have my approached planned perfectly. Maybe I did , if there had not been wind, and the non streamlined hulls of the rubber beast.

That sucker comes to a dead stop, too far away. Erica throws the line, but about one foot too short on the lenght I am floating back back astern. So, I have oars. But alas, there are no oarlocks, so I sit up at the bow of the dink and try to paddle hawaiian style.

But, I am making zero head way, and still drifting away. Erica needs to drop off the mooring and come and save my sorry butt. However, i noted a fellah from one of our neighboring boats, get into his dink and head over.

I just grab on and we motor over to our boat, and get the dink tied up and me on board. THANK YOU.

Now, how could I have avoided all that mele. Simple, approached from up wind, shut the outboard down a few feet away and drifted with the wind, smack into our boat.
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We get squared away for sailing and head for Sunsail, Roaod Harbor, Tortola, and report our dink problem over the VHF. We arrive at the marina docks , and they gave us a brand new dink with a brand new motor. We kept it light, and funny, kind of like telling the above, and all worked out well. Soon we were out of there headed for the Willy T at Norman Island.

Point being, getting back to the subject.....following procedures for safety equipment can make a big difference ...Ordeal or An Adventure. We do not go ape nuts over problems. And find it is best to follow set procedures, and avoid or handle it when the meard hit the fan.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by Chotu

True. And if I can’t survive in my dinghy, with no other traffic on the water, in good weather, on a flat calm morning, going 300 feet from boat to dinghy dock, with 2 life jackets, a VHF, cell phone, chart plotter and oars...

Well, just maybe I have no business out on any boat.

Redneckrob absolutely crucified me for saying I had GPS position data issues passing by the United Nations building in a different thread. He demanded proof and video evidence. Demanded I go on a special trip to get him proof.

Well, where is his proof on this claim of how dangerous it is to take a dinghy ashore to a dinghy dock in a protected harbor? All these deaths in Maryland from the same? Where’s the proof?

Well the separate incidents were named by others in this thread, but if you'd like to read the specific details they're here:
https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/...701-story.html
https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/...dja-story.html
https://www.eonline.com/news/1137541...wning-accident

You see, this is how you substantiate a statement. Something that you've yet to do in the previous thread you referenced. When you provide that substantiation I'll graciously say that you were correct and I was wrong (and report it to my former CG colleagues because if true it has real-world implications). Will you afford me that same courtesy I wonder?

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

For an actual crime to be committed there needs to be an injured third party, if not no crime has been committed

When my crew and I had to put our lives in danger searching for morons who didn't follow safety regulations is wasn't a "victimless crime".

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

You see, the ONLY law of the land is the Constitution, anything that steps outside of that document is by default...unlawful.

Not that most people these days care about either that or the Constitution, heck, we even have people out there protesting freedom of speech because someone voiced an opinion that hurt their feelings! Just goes to show how messed up things truly are, including these peoples very mindset.

I've noticed that people who most cite the Constitution tend to have the most abysmal understanding of the Constitution. There's that pesky 10th Amendment, you know the one that says "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

When my crew and I had to put our lives in danger searching for morons who didn't follow safety regulations is wasn't a "victimless crime".

No one forced you to put your lives in danger in the first place, and if it wasn't for those 'morons' out there you and your crew wouldn't have much of a job.

Not sure not having a whistle in a dinghy would result in you having to put your lives on the line, let alone that stealing the dinghy owners money would prevent it.

Originally Posted by redneckrob

I've noticed that people who most cite the Constitution tend to have the most abysmal understanding of the Constitution

Indeed they often times do, they also tend to be rather selective (no surprise there) Some even protest it, which demonstrates their severe ignorance.

It's like rights, strictly speaking you wouldn't need a permit to exercise a right, if you did it would no longer be a right, but a privilege.

But I'm digressing.