Is radar like the extinct typewriter?

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Eyeback

To all you folks who are acting "holier than thou," with their radar, can you please explain to me why it is that all these ships with their fancy radars seem totally surprised when I call them up on the radio and point out that they are sailing straight towards my boat. Could it be that ships don't look at their radars anymore and they rely on their AIS instead?

Surely you jest. How on earth would someone on the bridge of a mega ton ship know when you were going to tack. If you had a good reflector they would see you. They can't make abrupt turns. Sometimes the law of gross tonnage makes common sense. Now I expect a whole bunch of nonsense about COLREGs.

[Tia Bu]

I think this is a very good thread. These kinds of discussions have a lot of use for a lot of people over the years, and not just for the original poster.

I, too, put in a lot of miles and years without radar. I found AIS to be very, very useful, and I still do.

Before a cruise to New England this summer, I bought a used Garmin radome on Craigslist for $300 and hooked it up to my Garmin chartplotter. I did enjoy having it. Strangely enough, while it was nice to have in the fog, I can't say it was a life-changing improvement in the fog, at least for me.

The most use was in traffic in good visibility. I found I could switch to the "Cruising" screen on the Garmin, sort of an old-fashioned radar display. Using the variable bearing line, I could tell very, very quickly whether a boat or ship was on a collision course or not, and then I could switch to another target and do the same. It was also nice to see how far away that squall really was, and which way it was moving.

For what that's worth... It was worth $300, I think . I'm not sure it would be worth $2000- at least to me. Get AIS first. Radar is nice to have.

[DDabs]

screw fog, radar is amazing at night time. Worth it just for that. If you can't afford radar, don't bad mouth it just to make yourself feel better...

[Tia Bu]

I found it was nice to have at night, too. But it was not a life-changing experience. And you certainly don't need it to sail in the dark.

[markpierce]

Haven't sailed at night with radar while being mostly a daysailerr. but that technology has been handy in locating the entry to Mare Island Strait entry (toward home port). Frequently monitor the radar and observe the blobs from radar returns of various boats/ships. Unfortunately, many small boats and flotsam don't show.

[boatman61]

Each to their own I guess.. never use radar.. never wanted it.
Sailed all over the place on the Mk 1 eyeball.. as for the port channel marker at Bonifaccio.. it sits on a rocky outcrop.. definitely bigger than any size Oyster.

[jkindredpdx]

Originally Posted by Eyeback

To all you folks who are acting "holier than thou," with their radar, can you please explain to me why it is that all these ships with their fancy radars seem totally surprised when I call them up on the radio and point out that they are sailing straight towards my boat. Could it be that ships don't look at their radars anymore and they rely on their AIS instead?

I don't think anyone is being holier than thou. RADAR is a tool, among many, that fulfills a particular function. Each of us chooses where to invest and we live, hopefully, with the consequences of our informed decision.

[markpierce]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Each to their own I guess.. never use radar.. never wanted it.
Sailed all over the place on the Mk 1 eyeball.. as for the port channel marker at Bonifaccio.. it sits on a rocky outcrop.. definitely bigger than any size Oyster.

How prominent/strong is your radar signature? How big is your "blob" on others radar?

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Each to their own I guess.. never use radar.. never wanted it.
Sailed all over the place on the Mk 1 eyeball.. as for the port channel marker at Bonifaccio.. it sits on a rocky outcrop.. definitely bigger than any size Oyster.

Not the same channel marker. Why would we sail towards the rocks during a gale? The marker pictured in the radar screen on the video is the one below the goto point in the screenshot on this post.

[Pizzazz]

Just want to add on the night use of radar. I can't imagine sailing at night without radar. You have to be on watch all night. With radar on one can just go to sleep down below and wake up 1 hour before arrival. You can even steer the boat from below (via the autopilot) to avoid traffic. Clearly, it is not a good idea to do this in the middle of a shipping channel or close to the marina on a Sunday evening but in many cases there are just a couple of boats in a big see. I know you are supposed to keep watch 24/7 but many people do not. There is no way I would be able to fall asleep below without a radar (say with AIS alone).

Many people in Socal go to Catalina island at night and a good number of them sleep through some part of the night. On one occasion the radar showed a large object in my way. Nothing on the AIS. I woke up but did not get out of bed. When I were about 3.5 nm to the object I heard on the VHF "This is US warship bla bla... stay 3 nm away from me. She switched on the AIS briefly then went silent again. You bet I jumped into the cockpit at light speed then. I could not see anything. No lights, no AIS, just a blip on the radar.

How about we discuss how to best use radar, settings, controls, etc. This could be very helpful.

Sent from my MotoE2(4G-LTE) using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

Just want to add on the night use of radar. I can't imagine sailing at night without radar. You have to be on watch all night. With radar on one can just go to sleep down below and wake up 1 hour before arrival. You can even steer the boat from below (via the autopilot) to avoid traffic. Clearly, it is not a good idea to do this in the middle of a shipping channel or close to the marina on a Sunday evening but in many cases there are just a couple of boats in a big see. I know you are supposed to keep watch 24/7 but many people do not. There is no way I would be able to fall asleep below without a radar (say with AIS alone).

Many people in Socal go to Catalina island at night and a good number of them sleep through some part of the night. On one occasion the radar showed a large object in my way. Nothing on the AIS. I woke up but did not get out of bed. When I were about 3.5 nm to the object I heard on the VHF "This is US warship bla bla... stay 3 nm away from me. She switched on the AIS briefly then went silent again. You bet I jumped into the cockpit at light speed then. I could not see anything. No lights, no AIS, just a blip on the radar.

How about we discuss how to best use radar, settings, controls, etc. This could be very helpful.

Sent from my MotoE2(4G-LTE) using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

You or others "sleep through some part of the night" on your way to Catalina Island? It's a major shipping channel for Los Angeles Harbor, San Pedro and Long Beach.

Unbelievable.

[Pelagic]

If I could only have ONE piece of marine electronics for coasting anywhere in the world 24 hrs a day...... it would be a good Radar with good operators.

Properly tuned, it could probably find Boatie's floating eyeball after he was run over by a tug and barge in the fog...

[J Clark H356]

This is river cruising on the TennTom waterway. Sequence of photos starting at 6:16 AM last one at 6:58 AM. I have both radar and AIS and radar sees the bank, AIS sees the tows just around the bend, . And is extremely helpful when approaching a tow at night or in fog. Sometimes you get caught in fog when you don't expect it. With both, I was at ease.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Snowpetrel]

I am pretty comfortable with not having a radar on a yacht.

I use them all the time on bigger Comercial vessels, and now I find the small yachtie units a bit irritating with the poor bearing discrimination and crappy detection. Its nice to simplify life without more electrical gadgets ruining your night vision...

On a smaller boat like a W32 the weight and windage becomes a factor. AIS and chartplotters have certainly helped erode the radars importance.

I did find a radar useful in southern patagonia at night a few times when the plotter was miles out due to datum errors. But I would have coped without it ok.

I think that, and one late night entry into a coral reef are the only two times I can remember radar being particularly useful. In both occasions I had a choice not to enter if I didn't have a radar.

Its possible in both occasions that slightly foolhardy decisions were made due to having a radar onboard?

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by Snowpetrel

Its possible in both occasions that slightly foolhardy decisions were made due to having a radar onboard?

Very good points about the fact that you always have options and that sometimes having a Radar will lead you to make a night entry when prudence tells you otherwise.

BUT, I think that awareness is from your many years at sea both commercial and pleasure.:thumbup:

I also get frustrated with the small radars after using the latest IMO classed powerful S & X bands on huge displays.

However, i think that is a matter of scale....and SOP for a small craft.

Here in the Philippines, i mostly run at night manually tuned to a 3 or 6nm range, spotting the unlit fishing bancas and fish attenuation floats with the radar, while my partner as lookout protects her night vision.

Also for seeing, tracking and preparing for rain squalls far ahead, when I Range-up.

I am comfortable leaving tropical anchorages at night with Radar and parallel indexes making the majority of a repeat passage in the coolness of night, to arrive early the next day at our destination to enjoy a quiet day monitoring a new Anchorage before going to bed.

Each to their own, but early years blind piloting along the BC inside passage in zero visibility fog, has given me a great comfort level with Radar, that I don't feel with any other instrument.