Considering a Catalina 30 "Project."

[Locutus]

Asking price is $2000. Pretty low but a newly remanufactured Atomic 4 would be roughly $5000 and new mainsail and jib together would probably run $3000 to $4000. So that's $10,000 to $11,000 total with new engine and sails.

That's if there's nothing else wrong with it. It also needs new dodger canvas.

Alternatives include throwing a 10-20 HP outboard on the transom (Used for about $1000) and craigslist/ebay used sails (maybe $1000 if I can find them). That would make it operational for about $4000 total. I could probably buy a nice Catalina 27 for that.

But a quick web search reveals nice Cat 30s in good condition run between about $12,000 to $28,000 in my neighborhood. So I dunno. I'm not in a hurry except for the Beagle issue.

[Wayfarer1008]

As everyone points out Catalina 30's are a great live aboard for up to a couple of people and condition is everything. Cruising wise many have been sailed to Hawaii and down the west coast but I have yet to hear of a circumnavigation. Parts for any year /model can be found through Catalina Direct so replacing or repairing the boat is not that difficult.
Since these boats were built in mass build quality can be an issue so shop around and try and find one that is well taken care of. If it has an atomic 4 motor replacing it is an option but like the boat the Atomic 4 motor is really common and there are specialty shops that do nothing but deal with these motors.

[alansmith]

Loc, if you were so unfortunate to make the mistake of buying this useless hull....once you started blowing cash out the wazoo...it would be the wife howling and yapping at you...you would have no respite....ever...

That hull is not worth a nickle. What this guy is trying to do is avoid having to pay scrapping it. It is that simple. He is waiting for the right fool to come along and take his wreck off his hands....so he can avoid the cost of cutting her up and hauling her to the dump. That will cost him plenty even if he does his own whack job.

This is an old joke....do you know where the word "BOAT" originates from? It means "Bring On Another Thousand"....in your situation it would be like Bring On Another Ten Thousand.

I bought a 30 foot Sharpie for 5K. Simple boat and classic design. I have worked hard on this boat to restore her. I am easily 20K into her with yard bills, products, new engine, enlarged motor well...and I still haven't finished her. There are dozens of things yet to be bought like navigation gear, radios, safety equipment, proper gear for staying warm and dry...dingy...on and on. Can you imagine what your expenses would be with a boat that has been sitting in salt water for a year?

The last thing...when a guy tells you there is a "serious buyer" showing up later in the day....know one thing....He is full of you know what....

Many C.F. members will tell you this...there is no such thing as a cheap boat. Either you buy a boat that has already had all of the work done...or you will have to do all of the work...the best way...and you will see it over and over again...guys will spend 50k dollars rebuilding systems on boats that they bought cheap....and sell the boat for 30k a couple of years later. It happens every day...year after year...decade after decade...forever....It is the absolute truth.

So, why did I not buy a completed boat? Because I love the process of taking something old and making it new. Why do guys buy old beat up houses and spend years doing it? Why do guys buy old car wrecks and building a classic? Yup, there are idiots like me everywhere. But I can afford to do it and I like trailerable watercraft. I live in California. I can sail the San Juans and be back home in two weeks. Latter in the season I can sail in Sea of Cortez and be back home in two weeks...yes, I will lose 4 days to travel. I don't have the comfort of a 40 footer...but I have mobility and low cost of ownership. Cheep arse here....smile

[Brewgyver]

As others have said, the Catalina 30 is a great boat, but this one is most likely a bad deal.

However, as you continue your search, the C30 is out there in its thousands, something like 6,600 of them were made. Most of the earlier (Mk I) boats had the Atomic 4. DO NOT let that put you off an otherwise good deal. The A4 is very reliable, easy to work on, lightweight, and above all QUIETER than any diesel I've ever heard. I've had my A4-powered C30, hull 825, for five years, it'll be 40 next year, and I love it. I had to replace the manifold ($200 on eBay) and exhaust "elbow" (~$75 for 316 SS pipe and fittings) a couple of years ago both of which were probably original, not bad for raw water cooled.

I would not buy a C30 with the 2 cylinder diesel, they are under-powered against anything but flat calm.

Shop around, there are good buys out there. It may take a few months to find yours, but you'll be happier.

Good luck!

[Suijin]

Just to expand on my previous post, the sweet spot for buying a boat value wise is a well maintained boat that has been recently refit and is now for sale due to unforeseen circumstances (health issues, change of plans, etc.). The seller will never get the money out of it that they recently invested, not even close.

However, that is the best value based on what you get for your money and how it translates into resale value. A boat's value declines over time. The graph of that is slopes interspersed with flatlines, with the flatlines being refits. If you buy one right after the refit, you have a bit of flatline to enjoy.

However the other concept of value is how much you get for your money. It's true, a $2000 boat seems mighty tempting, and if you have the skills, temperament, aptitude and love for the work entailed you can buy a $2k boat, put $10k into it and maybe have a $15-20k boat. But the amount of work requires is beyond considerable.

Another concept of value relating to boats is having something that you can sail and that does what you want it to do. I have plenty of friends who have bought *&#^kickers and done the minimum simply to have something to day sail, race a bit and get them out on weekends. Their boats look like crap but no one cares because they are machines for a purpose and with a big grin on your face going 7 knots on a gorgeous day with a cooler full of beer the cracked gelcoat and ratty sails really don't matter.

[Rumbottle]

I purchased a Catalina 30 in Dec.1979, located at Anacapa Marina, north of LA. It was 12 months old at the time. I was 35, was a Master Mariner (Ship's Captain) and had done a large amount of ocean sailing.
I fitted heavier rigging, strengthened the chain-plates, fitted wind-vane self-steering and sailed it, via Panama, Mobile and across the Florida pan-handle to Fort Pierce and UK. Because of business commitments I later shipped the yacht to Singapore where I was working, replaced the Atomic 4 diesel with a Nanni 10kw, and from Feb '86 to Dec '87 sailed around the world via Cape Horn & UK. Terrible weather at Cape Horn. Rolled off the Grand Banks in a freak wave, which flooded the cabin, badly damaged the rigging, broke the boom & tore the sails. Jury rigged and sailed to UK (engine not working, starter motor didn't like being submerged for 4 hours).
Great boat to live onboard, sailed with spinnaker using self-steering. Averaged 5.1 knots over 29,996 nautical miles. Still have her.
Frank Butler (then MD of Catalina Yachts), with legal considerations in mind, was concerned when he heard I was going to UK and did not recommend taking the boat deep-sea. However he was extremely helpful. He would no doubt have been even more concerned if he knew that it would some-day sail around Cape Horn.
The Catalina 30 GRP lay-up was solid, hull about 1.25" thick. I believe the later Catalina 30's were much lighter lay-up. The 2 cyl. Nanni did a fantastic job, 5.5 knots in calm weather (didn't need an engine when there was a wind blowing) and charged the batteries at 0.75 liters/hr fuel consumption.
Outboards on yachts bigger that about 23 feet are a real worry. They get wet by sea-water, damaged, stolen and dont work when you want them to.
Diesels are more reliable and the fuel is not nearly as volatile as petrol.
Dont forget, you get what you pay for.

[Wayfarer1008]

Great story ! with buying older boats and fixing them up. on the west coast Cal 20's are probably one of the most common boats out there and are regularly competitively raced with 10 to 20 boats in a fleet. Beside being called sea cows "For their leisurely pace" they are called 2/20's because to take it from being a run of the mill boat worth about $2,000 dollars to make it competitive craft its not uncommon to spend over $20,000 setting them up. In the end they are only worth 2,000 even with all of the upgrades. Something like a Catalina 30 can be a real hole in the water if its old and warn out. Save your money and fine one in good shape. You will be so far ahead in the end.

[japtenks]

Originally Posted by Rumbottle

I purchased a Catalina 30 in Dec.1979, located at Anacapa Marina, north of LA. It was 12 months old at the time. I was 35, was a Master Mariner (Ship's Captain) and had done a large amount of ocean sailing.
I fitted heavier rigging, strengthened the chain-plates, fitted wind-vane self-steering and sailed it, via Panama, Mobile and across the Florida pan-handle to Fort Pierce and UK. Because of business commitments I later shipped the yacht to Singapore where I was working, replaced the Atomic 4 diesel with a Nanni 10kw, and from Feb '86 to Dec '87 sailed around the world via Cape Horn & UK. Terrible weather at Cape Horn. Rolled off the Grand Banks in a freak wave, which flooded the cabin, badly damaged the rigging, broke the boom & tore the sails. Jury rigged and sailed to UK (engine not working, starter motor didn't like being submerged for 4 hours).
Great boat to live onboard, sailed with spinnaker using self-steering. Averaged 5.1 knots over 29,996 nautical miles. Still have her.
Frank Butler (then MD of Catalina Yachts), with legal considerations in mind, was concerned when he heard I was going to UK and did not recommend taking the boat deep-sea. However he was extremely helpful. He would no doubt have been even more concerned if he knew that it would some-day sail around Cape Horn.
The Catalina 30 GRP lay-up was solid, hull about 1.25" thick. I believe the later Catalina 30's were much lighter lay-up. The 2 cyl. Nanni did a fantastic job, 5.5 knots in calm weather (didn't need an engine when there was a wind blowing) and charged the batteries at 0.75 liters/hr fuel consumption.
Outboards on yachts bigger that about 23 feet are a real worry. They get wet by sea-water, damaged, stolen and dont work when you want them to.
Diesels are more reliable and the fuel is not nearly as volatile as petrol.
Dont forget, you get what you pay for.

Rumbottle,

Care to share more about what you did, or other sea stories, and pictures of your boat?

Thanks

[Island Time O25]

Originally Posted by Locutus

Asking price is $2000. Pretty low but a newly remanufactured Atomic 4 would be roughly $5000 and new mainsail and jib together would probably run $3000 to $4000. So that's $10,000 to $11,000 total with new engine and sails.

That's if there's nothing else wrong with it. It also needs new dodger canvas.

Alternatives include throwing a 10-20 HP outboard on the transom (Used for about $1000) and craigslist/ebay used sails (maybe $1000 if I can find them). That would make it operational for about $4000 total. I could probably buy a nice Catalina 27 for that.

But a quick web search reveals nice Cat 30s in good condition run between about $12,000 to $28,000 in my neighborhood. So I dunno. I'm not in a hurry except for the Beagle issue.

As someone who's been there done that I will say that this boat does not sound like a good deal even for FREE.

Unless you are handy with mechanical/electric and fiberglass work AND have plenty of time to do the work it will be a money pit from day one. If your budget does not allow for a decent $10K 30 footer (any 30 footer on the market today for say $20-25K or less can probably be had for around $10K.

Let's see:
1. new diesel (would never even consider A4 on a sailboat) - $10K installed.
2. Set of decent used sails - at least $1-2K, new ones $4-6K
3. Electronics - $5K
4. Electrical work (most likely after beaching) - $5-7K
5. Dodger/bimini top - $3-5K

So you're looking at $12-16K for items 1+2 and that will only get you in the water. Items 3-5 will add another $12-17K if you want to be safe and comfortable on the water. So we're talking $25-30K spent on the "free boat" and its value at that point may be $10-12K, $15K if you're lucky.

My experience with anything sold for under $30-50K is that you can offer no more than 1/2 of the asking price and you will still be the only one of all who came to look who offered anything. Unless of course it was a $50K boat priced at $25K but they rarely are. More likely the seller will price a $30K boat at $50K and leave room for negotiation.

[Locutus]

Thanks for the additional comments. Food for thought.

I've decided against pursuing this C30. Never mind the logistics of actually getting the necessary work done, I'd be into it over $10,000 by the time I got it into operating condition. Might as well buy one in good shape.

I may look at a Catalina 27 this weekend instead. But I found out that the marina I was interested in renting a slip has a lower size limit for live-aboards. Minimum registered size (on title) must be at least 32 FT. I'm not planning to live aboard but want that option available. So that eliminates both the C27 and C30, at least at that marina.

The C27 I'll be looking at is a 1973 model and comes with a 2004 Yamaha outboard motor to fit the factory motor well. The seller says that when he bought it the interior was stripped for racing, and he salvaged the interior out of another C27 and reinstalled it in this one. Makes me wonder, but the price is pretty good at $2500.00. Comes with two sets of sails.

[Jim Cate]

Comes with two sets of sails.

Just a comment: this statement usually means one set of newer sails (note that this does not mean NEW at all, just newer than the old sails), and the old set which were so badly worn that they were replaced. They have zero value.

Many newbies are confused and mislead by such statements.

Jim

[Peregrine1983]

Sounds like a headache boat... What's your budget? If you provide that people here can probably point you to a boat you'll be happier with.

[JPA Cate]

How about having some ear plugs custom made for you? That should be a lot less than this Catalina.

The Catalina in question, underwater for a year, bulkheads shot to pieced. Pfui, not even on a cold day you know where. Really, the OP can do much, much better!

Ann