Gemini Legacy 35 & Seawind 1160 CE class?

[smj]

[QUOTE=catama;3295110]In the light of this comment's responses, I believe Oceanis 38.1 is safer than both legacy 35 and 1160 Lite. I'm still learning, so my mind, sure, will change a lot in time, but if I had to make decision as of today, I'd choose a 38.1 over 35 and 1160; the cheapest catamaran I would buy would be a Lagoon 40. If a Lagoon 40's life time ownership costs cloud be afforded, then it would be a good option. If one could only afford 35 or 1160 - and safety is a concern - , then 38.1 would the way to go for that budget.[/

No doubt from this post you are still learning. Good luck and a bit of advice, start of with a smaller inexpensive sailboat, whether multihull or monohull.

[lyl]

[QUOTE=smj;3295127]

Originally Posted by catama

In the light of this comment's responses, I believe Oceanis 38.1 is safer than both legacy 35 and 1160 Lite. I'm still learning, so my mind, sure, will change a lot in time, but if I had to make decision as of today, I'd choose a 38.1 over 35 and 1160; the cheapest catamaran I would buy would be a Lagoon 40. If a Lagoon 40's life time ownership costs cloud be afforded, then it would be a good option. If one could only afford 35 or 1160 - and safety is a concern - , then 38.1 would the way to go for that budget.[/

No doubt from this post you are still learning. Good luck and a bit of advice, start of with a smaller inexpensive sailboat, whether multihull or monohull.

smj, I'm sailing dingies these days and doing stupid things that I'm so glad I'm not doing them in the middle of some open sea environment. I'll eventually figure things out. In the meantime, learning from others' experiences wouldn't hurt, I assumed. I ask alot, bluntly say my thoughts regardless how novice they are, and gotten laughed at a bit; better than making an expensive purchasing mistake when the time comes.

[lyl]

Originally Posted by sailjumanji

Dude, a "Catalina 315", or a Seawind 1160 or 1260? Other than the fact that they both float in the water, they are so very different. You really need to think about what you want to experience.

sailjumanji... multihull or monohull, is there a right answer to that question? I'm way at the very beginning of the process and still learning. IMO, whenever I'm ready, 315, 355, legacy 35, 1160, or anything will do the job for me. Whatever I can get my hands on, I'll enjoy it and make the best of it. At this moment, I read about them as much as I can, and try to learn people's real life experiences on them. Sorry, if my naively novice questions are way out there.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by catama

In the light of this comment's responses, I believe Oceanis 38.1 is safer than both legacy 35 and 1160 Lite. .

depends how you define safety. Personally I am keen on boats that dont sink.

[lyl]

Originally Posted by Factor

depends how you define safety. Personally I am keen on boats that dont sink.

How a boat handles the bad weather conditions, not the aftermath.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by catama

i asked them, and they blew me off. i don't blame them though; it's not a question on the sane side.
TY again...
I'm thinking i shall start with a monohull anyhow...

If you are buying new, it's a perfectly reasonable question if the boat is going to live and be registered in Europe. I would assume if they can't/refuse to answer, that it probably isn't certified.

I know 10yrs or so ago, Gemini's could be CE certified. They made a few minor modifications as an option package. Very simple stuff easy stuff but if you didn't get it from the manufacturer, it was a huge hassle to modify and certify it later.

Later, they got out of the European market and no longer offered it. I haven't been following lately, so I don't know if they got back into the European market again.

Something similar could explain the inconsistent answers from Seawind. If it's an optional package, some boats will have it and others may not.

[sailjumanji]

Originally Posted by catama

sailjumanji... multihull or monohull, is there a right answer to that question? I'm way at the very beginning of the process and still learning. IMO, whenever I'm ready, 315, 355, legacy 35, 1160, or anything will do the job for me. Whatever I can get my hands on, I'll enjoy it and make the best of it. At this moment, I read about them as much as I can, and try to learn people's real life experiences on them. Sorry, if my naively novice questions are way out there.

I think I would start by just getting on them. But you also didn't mention your budget. A new 1160 Lite "all in" is going to be $425k plus, by the time you get it to US. And I have yet to see a Lite on the used market, and even the Deluxe 1160's are not frequently available, and both hold their values well. Lagoon's are more available; monohulls even more. Would be good to start at a boat show, which hopefully will resume next year.

[smj]

Originally Posted by sailjumanji

I think I would start by just getting on them. But you also didn't mention your budget. A new 1160 Lite "all in" is going to be $425k plus, by the time you get it to US. And I have yet to see a Lite on the used market, and even the Deluxe 1160's are not frequently available, and both hold their values well. Lagoon's are more available; monohulls even more. Would be good to start at a boat show, which hopefully will resume next year.

Miami boat show has been called of already.[emoji30]

[Yihang]

I wonder if its because Seawind doesn’t have standard escape hatches as basic equipment.

[lyl]

Originally Posted by sailjumanji

I think I would start by just getting on them. But you also didn't mention your budget. A new 1160 Lite "all in" is going to be $425k plus, by the time you get it to US. And I have yet to see a Lite on the used market, and even the Deluxe 1160's are not frequently available, and both hold their values well. Lagoon's are more available; monohulls even more. Would be good to start at a boat show, which hopefully will resume next year.

it's early to worry about the budget, but I'm talking about choices in reach to my purchase power, 'considering the whole ownership costs.'

[lyl]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

If you are buying new, it's a perfectly reasonable question if the boat is going to live and be registered in Europe. I would assume if they can't/refuse to answer, that it probably isn't certified.

I know 10yrs or so ago, Gemini's could be CE certified. They made a few minor modifications as an option package. Very simple stuff easy stuff but if you didn't get it from the manufacturer, it was a huge hassle to modify and certify it later.

Later, they got out of the European market and no longer offered it. I haven't been following lately, so I don't know if they got back into the European market again.

Something similar could explain the inconsistent answers from Seawind. If it's an optional package, some boats will have it and others may not.

I think I'm making too much of these certification details. I live in the US, so CE classes shouldn't be a concern for me.
I only care about the reason why a boat doesn't have a certain level of certification. If it's because it doesn't have this and that details, i don't care then. But if it's because, 'let's say,' it was built with weaker material from get go or the design cannot handle bigger waves at all, then I would think again.
Well, still learning the ABC of the matter as you can probably guess, so there is a long way ahead of me...

[Yihang]

Originally Posted by catama

I think I'm making too much of these certification details. I live in the US, so CE classes shouldn't be a concern for me.
I only care about the reason why a boat doesn't have a certain level of certification. If it's because it doesn't have this and that details, i don't care then. But if it's because, 'let's say,' it was built with weaker material from get go or the design cannot handle bigger waves at all, then I would think again.
Well, still learning the ABC of the matter as you can probably guess, so there is a long way ahead of me...

I've been on CF for 15 years and I changed my mind on what boat I want 3 times in the past 6 months....probably a couple dozen times in the time I've been on here. It's all good fun. But when it comes to buying almost anything floating today will be safe enough. It's almost always the people that abandon ship from fear and discomfort while the boat itself is found floating somewhere months if not years later.

[qwerme]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

I know 10yrs or so ago, Gemini's could be CE certified. They made a few minor modifications as an option package. Very simple stuff easy stuff but if you didn't get it from the manufacturer, it was a huge hassle to modify and certify it later.

The Gemini 105Mc was Cat A, The Legacy is a Category B, the Seawind is Category A

You can look it up on the CE website:

https://www.imci.org/3/product/show/2

[malabarmcgyver]

The Gemini 105M was pulled from certification A. It states that it does not have enough buoyancy to keep vessel afloat when inverted. The 105MC is not listed as certified.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by malabarmcgyver

The Gemini 105M was pulled from certification A. It states that it does not have enough buoyancy to keep vessel afloat when inverted. The 105MC is not listed as certified.

So what is the official stance of those that were sold in Europe and did have the CE Class A cert?

It would be rather awkward to go to someone take their paperwork back and cross it out if it was sold at the time with CE Class A cert that the CE organization agreed with.