Good Summary of Beneteau Strengths...

[docrn]

I have a 393 that I am currently living on and sailing the inside passage. I’d very much like to sail her to Florida but am thinking about selling here in the PNW and buying a different boat that is already located there. Not because I don’t think the boat can make the trip but only because the 6.5’ draft is too deep for the Gulf Coast and ICW which is where I plan to retire.

Just like any other boat we set up our 393 for voyaging and upgraded what we thought needed upgraded. Replaced all thruhulls and sea cocks with new Groco bronze (Beneteau has a known issue with the factory thruhulls with some years of boats as does Halberg Rassy). We beefed up the chain plates for the backstays by making new ones that attach to the transom as opposed to the factory location which was through the deck (work done by Brion Toss).
We also added a furling drifter and inner solent stay for a storm staysail (both from Hasse) as well as added a 3rd reef to the main giving us some options.
Naturally we replaced the 20 year old standing rigging and bought all new running rigging. I’ve sailed our 393 in some decent size gales and have yet to feel like I couldn’t take her around the world if I wanted to. Would I prefer an Explocat? Yes, of course but the 393 will do the job as long as the skipper doesn’t do anything stupid. Same can be said for the captain of the Explocat.

Point is, set up the boat for the type of sailing you are doing and make smart choices and you will very likely survive in spite of the fact your doing it on a death trap Beneteau, Hunter, Catalina, whatever…. Lol. People do it everyday in production boats and live to tell the tale (rolls eyes).

[Sailor Sailor]

Originally Posted by Sailing Hanse37

This sort of entries on the forum is so ridiculuous. Maybe started by a frustrated owner of an old derelict boat i guess ?

Thanks for writing that I am a frustrated owner of an derelict boat, although I don't feel that way. I see my boat as beautiful for its age. I posted exterior and interior photos in albums on my profile page for anyone to see.

Further, you can criticize Sabre all you want and I won't take it personally or resort to ad hominin attacks.

BTW, the article in the link is by Yachting Monthly, a British/Wales registered company, not an American one, and the facts of the abandonment of the Beneteau 393 and rescue by the U.S.C.G. appeared on the owner's blog, the subject of a separate thread on this listserv. No one is making this stuff up.

[Happ]

Fact is you can sail a Sunfish across an ocean in the right weather. it‘s when the sh*t hits the fan that you want an ocean capable boat. With todays weather predicting software, modern communications it is easier and safer to cross an ocean then ever before.

When I last sailed from the east coast to the USVI’s we had a weather router. When an unexpected low developed he advised us to duck into Bermuda. We were sailing a 57’ Jeaneau that was pretty new. We did and sat for 1 1/2 days before carrying on.

[merrydolphin]

As a US Sailing instructor that has certified many hundreds of students from sailing the bay to crossing oceans. Many have asked me can I take this “ Hunter, Benny,Jenny etc accross the ocean? The answer is yes, you can. Are there better boats to do so?” Yes there are. One of the boats in our fleet was a Caliber 40LRC. A “proper” cruising boat. But it was one of the least popular boats in our 50 boat fleet. Why? It wasn’t as fast or fun to sail. And it was more difficult to handle in a marina. It wasn’t as comfortable inside or out. Etc. but it was well built and designed for cruising, carried 240 gal of diesel!

I could always tell when boats were truly not designed for long range cruising when I was down in the Caribbean, or Mexico and other distant cruising grounds. Their decks were LINED WITH JUGS EVERYWHERE. Bright yellow ones, and blue ones. Sometimes with color coordinated lashings. Quite pretty. The rails and side decks lined with them. They didn’t have proper tankage.

A long range cruiser has proper tankage and storage. It’s entire volume is not taken up with luxury apartment like accommodations. But proper storage and tankage. And most tankage is down low where it belongs, not under all the births and settees. Open all the storage lockers and oops, there are pumps in this one, and tanks in this one and batteries in this one etc. And that’s ok! If that’s what you want. They will both do the job, but one is designed to do mainly one job and one for another job. But you CAN cruise both. And some ( if you can afford them) can do both pretty darned well.

The ones that bother me are the ones that are not honest. Eg. Island Packet is MARKETED as a purpose built long range cruiser. It doesn’t sail all that well so you know that your are going to be doing some motoring and yep, Jerry jugs all over the deck! Oh we carry 56 gallons of diesel in the tanks and another 55 in Jerry jugs! Not very long range cruiserish. In todays modern world, you can make fresh water, but I have never seen a Diesel Maker before.

[Sailorman97]

Originally Posted by merrydolphin

...
I could always tell when boats were truly not designed for long range cruising when I was down in the Caribbean, or Mexico and other distant cruising grounds. Their decks were LINED WITH JUGS EVERYWHERE. Bright yellow ones, and blue ones. Sometimes with color coordinated lashings. Quite pretty. The rails and side decks lined with them. They didn’t have proper tankage.

A long range cruiser has proper tankage and storage. It’s entire volume is not taken up with luxury apartment like accommodations. But proper storage and tankage. And most tankage is down low where it belongs, not under all the births and settees. Open all the storage lockers and oops, there are pumps in this one, and tanks in this one and batteries in this one etc. And that’s ok! If that’s what you want. They will both do the job, but one is designed to do mainly one job and one for another job. But you CAN cruise both. And some ( if you can afford them) can do both pretty darned well.

The ones that bother me are the ones that are not honest. Eg. Island Packet is MARKETED as a purpose built long range cruiser. It doesn’t sail all that well so you know that your are going to be doing some motoring and yep, Jerry jugs all over the deck! Oh we carry 56 gallons of diesel in the tanks and another 55 in Jerry jugs! Not very long range cruiserish. In todays modern world, you can make fresh water, but I have never seen a Diesel Maker before.

Again, horses for courses. My Idylle 1550 had tankage for 400 us gallons of water. Who needs 400 gallons of water? It has 120 gallons of diesel. I am toying with converting 2-75 gallon water tanks to fuel for that time we are going to need it.

I know someone in the Caribbean with 300 gallons of diesel. He never keeps it filled. Says it goes bad as it ages. There is something to this but I am not sure how much. The diesel in my current tank is 3 yrs and seems to burn fine. Not planning on filling up soon.

As for everything being before the floor, how realistic is that? I have 1 fuel tank, a motor, 3 tanks, all in the floor. We have 150 us gall of water above the floor. There is no more room in the floor.

A boat is a collection of compromises. I too would not want to sail sailing slug, nor would I want to live and sail on a Hullmaster 31. Others do and they own them


I remember when the Beneteau Oceanis series came out and everybody disparaged them. Yes they were bendy and you could not keep the cupboards closed in big waves but those boats are still here and still sailing

[merrydolphin]

Originally Posted by Sailorman97

Again, horses for courses. My Idylle 1550 had tankage for 400 us gallons of water. Who needs 400 gallons of water? It has 120 gallons of diesel. I am toying with converting 2-75 gallon water tanks to fuel for that time we are going to need it.

I know someone in the Caribbean with 300 gallons of diesel. He never keeps it filled. Says it goes bad as it ages. There is something to this but I am not sure how much. The diesel in my current tank is 3 yrs and seems to burn fine. Not planning on filling up soon.

As for everything being before the floor, how realistic is that? I have 1 fuel tank, a motor, 3 tanks, all in the floor. We have 150 us gall of water above the floor. There is no more room in the floor.

A boat is a collection of compromises. I too would not want to sail sailing slug, nor would I want to live and sail on a Hullmaster 31. Others do and they own them


I remember when the Beneteau Oceanis series came out and everybody disparaged them. Yes they were bendy and you could not keep the cupboards closed in big waves but those boats are still here and still sailing

Yes, still lots of old Benny’s out there sailing. I did just what you are taking about on my Kelly Peterson 44. It came with 250 water and 125 fuel. I took one of the water tanks, a 75 gal one and converted it to diesel. Dried it out best I could then filled it with diesel. Plumed in a 12V transfer pump and and a little water separator filter but never really collected much water from it. That was good. done. Worked the 8 yrs that I had that boat. Sounds like you have tones of tankage but just need to convert some to Diesel. And no, not a problem for diesel it sit for years. In fact it is better to keep it full to keep down condensation.

Wow 400 water! And 150 above the soul. Hmmm do you need them. Maybe just as stand by emergency water or be like Chichester and convert one to Wine! Ha ha.
My last boat was my favorite, a Cal ll-46. Loved it. 220 water 270 fuel all under the soul. Full walk in engine ROOM with full headroom, workbench with vice and drill press. 8kw gen. 20 gph Water maker and all batteries and pumps in the engine room where they belong. No lockers with any equipment or tanks.

Your specs look a little like the Cal. Similar displacement and waterline length. Looks like a nice boat. You even have (or had) a Perkins 4-236. Great engine. After I sold mine with about 15,000 hrs on the engine, the new owner sailed form Mexico to HI to Vancouver CAN then to S. PAC then returned to Vancouver. Same engine still running well. Do you still have it. Fair winds.

[accomplice]

Originally Posted by Sailorman97

Again, horses for courses.

[...]
I know someone in the Caribbean with 300 gallons of diesel. He never keeps it filled. Says it goes bad as it ages. There is something to this but I am not sure how much. The diesel in my current tank is 3 yrs and seems to burn fine. Not planning on filling up soon.

We carry 340 gallons of diesel. We fill up 2-3 times a year. I like not having to come to a dock often. On passage, we can maintain a minimum speed by motoring through the calms, generally without worry about fuel usage. I feel passages are safer by minimizing the time at sea by moving quickly. I haven't had a problem with fuel going bad (on this boat), but if I did I'd install a fuel polishing system.

Every boat is built to a purpose. Some to a price point. Some for sleeping many (think charter), some with a large cockpit for entertaining many, some with an open main cabin for ...? dancing? Others are built to cross oceans, but they give up something for it. Some are built to go fast in light wind, others to be more stable in a blow.

There are always tradeoffs. In an 8kt breeze I got passed by a Pearson 28 this summer! But I've been sailed through F11 storms in which I'd probably not have survived in that Pearson. At anchor, while entertaining, I've often wished for a larger cockpit - but when the cockpit has been filled with water from angry beam seas, I was happy for its size. Who knows, maybe that P28 might've made it through some of those conditions -- but I slept better and was more comfortable knowing I was in the boat I was in.

I used to have a boat much like that P28. I very much enjoyed it for coastal and near coastal cruising. Some take them around the world. I'd rather do it in my present boat, though.

[Jim Greer]

I own a 461 and have had her in 12-14 seas and blowing 30-35 with gusts to 40. We were running almost dead down wind with a reefed genoa only. It was work to keep here on track. The autopilot could not keep up. I did not feel unsafe at any time though. The issue I have is the comfort formula for Beneteau's is relatively low at 23.3 for the 461, they get tossed around easily. I wish I could add 5,000 lbs of ballast to add her displacement to weight ratio. She is ready to get hauled and all her water tanks are empty and she rose 2 inches out of the water. (~1,210 lbs of water) This is over 5% of her displacement. Going offshore next summer to the Canadian maritimes with no fears at all. My next boat will how ever, definitely be heavier.

[MicHughV]

Whoa, whoa, whoa....

As the owner of a Beneteau 423, I originally had some misgivings about the open transom concept, but have since become a convert.
It's a marvelous feature, in my opinion, providing easy and un-encumbered access to the transom, dink, davits, outboard engine, solar panels, and whatever else you might have hanging on the back. Plus getting on and off the boat is a snap.

Being a relatively flat-bottomed boat, a following sea tends to pick the stern up, rather than crawling into the cockpit, but should an errant wave crawl aboard, the sole of the cockpit has a pronounced slope rearward, plus a high cockpit sill, meaning, the water will run out of the cockpit, lickity split, as the transom is wide open, and you won't need to depend on some small diameter cockpit drains.

As far as I'm concerned, it's a fast....very fast ..and stable boat. Almost all of the hull is lwl....so it has a good hull speed, easily reached in most conditions. As far as I'm concerned it is an exceptional fun boat to sail.

For the rest, the boat is well thought out and well laid out. It is a production boat, so don't go looking for fine joinery.

The boat has only one detraction in my opinion. The bilge is a shoe box size indentation in the keel, and it's probably 12" below the cabin sole. If the boat is heeled over, and you take on water for any reason, that water will rush to the low side of the hull and not the bilge, making the bilge pump in-effective. The bilge pump float switch is mounted to the inside hull adjacent to this "bilge". It obviously, won't activate until water is sloshing around in the bilge. The shoe-box sized bilge, obvious does not have room for a standard bilge pump, instead it has "hoses" that lead to bilge pumps elsewhere.

A bilge alarm fitted here is the way to combat some of these shortcomings.

When you get right down to it, Beneteau is tough to beat on a bang for your buck perspective.

[goboatingnow]

Good sea boats too as a general concept. Strong sea worthy , well able in that size to take you anywhere.