Hunter, Catalina, Benneteau Debate

[Tetepare]

MichughV you can’t use a 432 for fair comparison. The stars aligned with that one. How about the 370? Or worse the 350? Same style, didn’t come close to hitting the same mark.

[MicHughV]

Yes, the 432 is a sweet boat. Mine originally came with a Volvo diesel, but the previous owner replaced it with a Yanmar, otherwise I would have walked away. I don't have in-mast main either, but do have the stack pack.

I have friend that had ( doesn't have it anymore) the 350. I sailed with him out in the ocean one time, but didn't like it.
For one, it had the in-mast furler, which I hate, and hated even more, when we had a lot of problems with the one on that 350 that day.
As for the rest, it seemed like Beneteau was trying to fit too many things inside that boat and it had a cluttered feel to me. I only sailed on it that one day.
At one time, I did consider the 473, the big brother of the 432, but the boat simply did not appeal to me. The 432 is in that sweet spot, not to big, not to small. Most 473's were dragging their transom in the water, due to weight placement, which was not good, considering it is a planing hull per se.

For the same reason, I didn't like the Catalina 470. The interior seemed out of proportion to my eye, but the smaller Catalina's are nice. I've sailed on quite a few of them.

As for Hunter, the B&R rig is not for me, swept back spreaders, in-mast furling, tiny headsail, etc. is not my thing. I think Hunter squeeze an amazing amount of stuff inside their hulls, but their hulls also seem very high out of the water. Any hunter I ever saw, was a wild bronco at anchor. Some friends of mine have one, a 430 and they have learned to live with these things.

All things considered, I thought the Bennie was the best pick for me. It certainly is a pleasure to sail. The Bennie is my 3rd boat, so I had a pretty good idea of what I liked and didn't like.

[sailtheworld79]

Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3

But eventually he'll grow up, and you'll have to provide substance with your opinions.

I used to own a Catalina. So I have a little experience with that brand, and it was a decent boat for it's price. Also, because of how many there were out there, it was easy to get parts or find users who had sorted out problems or figured out good modifications. Maybe that's true of the other brands mentioned, but likely to a lesser degree.

Still, if you're going to choose to respond, please let it be to the second paragraph of that post, which was the actual point of it.

So the point here, the only point is the objective recklessness of Group B build quality over the last 25 years. Yup, they put the same bits on them from the same third party sources. However, to the best of my knowledge only Group B lags their iron keels directly to the bottom of their “let’s see how thin we can make this” hulls with bolts that turn into piles of corrosion when immersed in salt water. Group B doesn’t tab their bulkheads. The interiors are straight from an IKEA warehouse having a clearance sale! It’s a boat built to get you to BUY it, not a boat built to LAST. As to the grounding issue that was brought up a few posts back; if you’re crossing oceans - or hell - crossing bays on a boat that can’t survive a grounding or can’t be properly repaired when it does hit the bottom (and everyone eventually hits the bottom) then how can we claim it’s a well built? It isn’t. Do Hunters have a more sporty motion in a chop? Some do, yes but the way will take an absolute thrashing and continue on. Group B you get one chance and one only. A good friend of mine and fellow delivery skipper just got pulled off of one in the Gulf Stream off South Carolina because the hull liner let go of the hull!! Yup, great boats 🤣🤣🤣

[letsgetsailing3]

Originally Posted by MicHughV

There should really be price point to this debate, ie, you could likely lump Honda, Toyota, Nissan in the same group, but BMW, Porsche and Mercedes belong in another. Ferrari and other exotics in yet another group. Then you get the outliers, Oyster, Halberg Rassy, etc..

Hunter, Catalina and Beneteau do belong in one comparison group, but price should be a factor as well.

Finally, there is no telling what attracts a person to a particular boat, any more than why some people like blondes and others brunettes. Some people buy a boat because they like the color of the cushions, others like a boat because it might have twin helms, etc.

So boats are the BMWs, and Mercedes in this conversation? Which boat is the Porsche?

[MicHughV]

I believe Hanse and Dehler are German boats....I read where Hanse is the second largest sailboat builder in the world. I don't know too much about Hanse or Dehler, but they appear to be in line with Beneteau, but that is my observation only...ie, mass produced.

I have friends that drive Porche's. As far as they are concerned, there is no other automobile that compares. I've always been a big fan of Halberg Rassy, but like Porche's, they require a very healthy and fat checkbook, so I can admire either only from afar..

[sailtheworld79]

Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3

So boats are the BMWs, and Mercedes in this conversation? Which boat is the Porsche?

Just like cars you can speak objectively as to which is the “Porsche” among sailing yachts. The Porsche would be the Swans, Hylas, Passport, Outbound, HR class of boats. I’d love to include Oyster in that group but a keel came off of one of those in the not to distant past so I can’t.

[sailtheworld79]

So gents, beyond pointing out all of the inherent bad points of any boat built by Group B in the last 25 years I had also hoped this might be somewhat educational. Educational in the sense that if you own a Group B boat (I know there are more than one here) you might come to understand the flaws in the build quality of your own boat and not push the boundaries. The margin for error in said boats is pretty near zero. One misstep, one rough passage, one hard grounding and that could very well be the end for you. And again, this is why I think Cat’s and Hunters are pretty good boats for a working man. They may have skimped in some places, they may not be as pretty, but when it counts you aren’t going to break it.

[AKA-None]

Well I like my little c&c :-)

[Networker]

Originally Posted by sailtheworld79

That you chose a Benneteau means that you are utterly ignorant as to the way they are built and got sucked into marketing BS. Doesn't matter how you kitted it out, it's still a recklessly engineered boat. There's an old adage that states a fool and his money are soon parted and when you go to sell that boat in a 5 or 10 years for a tiny fraction of what you paid for it you'll regret your decision. You'll regret it even more if the keel fails while you're crossing a large body of water. Best of luck to you Mr. Millionaire!!

You just have to be realistic. First of all, one can count on one hand the number of keels falling off any boat by any manufacturer in the last decade, Oysters included. As long as you inspect it annually, and keep the rigging and keel healthy, what actual problem could you have? I am not worried about resale value and don’t even care if it sinks, it’s not an investment. It’s a pleasure toy. I’d obviously not like that especially if I’m on it, but the risk of my boat sinking due to inherent flaws is minimized with proper inspections, maintenance, and other upkeep. I mostly worry about the rig coming down, hence why I’ll upgrade it, but an old rig on a 2012 Swan has just as much risk as any other boat.

[sailtheworld79]

Originally Posted by Networker

You just have to be realistic. First of all, one can count on one hand the number of keels falling off any boat by any manufacturer in the last decade, Oysters included. As long as you inspect it annually, and keep the rigging and keel healthy, what actual problem could you have? I am not worried about resale value and don’t even care if it sinks, it’s not an investment. It’s a pleasure toy. I’d obviously not like that especially if I’m on it, but the risk of my boat sinking due to inherent flaws is minimized with proper inspections, maintenance, and other upkeep. I mostly worry about the rig coming down, hence why I’ll upgrade it, but an old rig on a 2012 Swan has just as much risk as any other boat.

I’d love to report this post for the sheer douchiness of it! I think I may have just invented a word 😎

[Networker]

Originally Posted by sailtheworld79

I’d love to report this post for the sheer douchiness of it! I think I may have just invented a word ��

As others have pointed out, proper seamanship, maintenance, and care of the boat matters more than the boat itself. My boat has crossed oceans and will continue to do so given all the upgrades, care and maintenance put into it.

Relax and remember - maintenance; Forget - keels falling off. Do that and someday you can become a seaworthy sailor too someday while not showing your ignorance.

Last point that John Kretschmer told me once, almost all the boats you can think of that are properly maintained, well kept, etc are seaworthy, can survive storms, and will outlast you. NONE, doesn’t matter how expensive or well maintained, can survive rocks. So a really hard grounding or smashing on shore will eat any boat you put there, which once again goes back to seamanship.

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

I have surveyed ...
85 Catalinas
192 Hunters
112 Beneteaus
28 Jeanneaus

Correction !

Todays job makes 113 Beneteau's.

The first 2022 Beneteau Oceanis 54 in Canada

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

Well I like my little c&c :-)

Like MichughVs 432, another boat that approached perfection the C&C27. A local one has been raced for decades and still looks great. Arguably a bit small for cruising though. But they are solid, and fast, and have withstood the test of time quite well.

[Dogscout]

There are some opinions in this thread that makes me question why I ever come to this forum. Thank God I'm not looking for advice on boat construction or quality.

[Rumrace]

I just priced out base models of Marlow Hunter 40 vs Jeanneau 410.
Hunter 40 $247,000. “ nicely equipped “
Cast lead j bolts encapsulated in glass superior material @ 110$ US a pound.

Jeanneau 410 $275,000 “ Sailaway” I don’t think it has a stove. The mattresses are like rocks. And the cheap French use threaded rod in cheap cast iron and hide their shame in Epoxy.

The Beneteau 40.1 is more money than the Jeanneau. ( better mattress tabanac)