Shipping a sailboat from New England to BVI’s

[CaptainDenver]

My family and I have recently purchased a 52’ sailboat currently located in ME. We plan to keep it on the New England coast for the coming Spring and Summer Season. As for Winter, we are hoping to get it down to the BVI’s, but likely will not have the time to make the passage ourselves.

Would anyone be willing to share their experiences with shipping vs paying a skipper for delivery under sail? We are struggling to estimate which option would be more cost effective.

[Lake-Effect]

I can tell you which option would be more fun...

[billknny]

It's really hard to imagine that shipping would be cheaper for such a relatively short run. Especially since it is unlikely that the boat will end up exactly where you want it and will need a delivery on one--or both ends--of the trip anyway.

[hpeer]

As I recall there was a thread here about a year ago where some numbers were bandied about. IIRC it was pretty much a was but for a lii in never run. Again, IIRC, fees were roughly $100/day for Capt and $50/day for crew plus all expenses.

But I’m 68 and my memory sucks.

Just guessing there would be a lot of difficulty in arranging the shipment because it’s an unusual route and relatively short and there are not a lot of options.

Again guessing you would have far more options were you to seek a delivery Capt and crew.

HOWEVER your schedule implies moving South during hurricane season. Or waiting until after when there weather generally is lousy.

I’m also assuming that at 52’ it’s not an ICW friendly boat.

Good luck and please report back.

[jt11791]

In my experience captains are more like $300/day, but I'd guess this will still be much cheaper than shipping.

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Denver.

[LittleWing77]

Contact Snore or Auspicious on this Forum. They're both very experienced, busy delivery captains. One or the other of them should be able to deliver her for you.

Just a curiosity question: Do you have a place arranged to keep her in the BVIs?

Good luck,
LittleWing

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by LittleWing77

Contact Snore or Auspicious on this Forum. They're both very experienced, busy delivery captains. One or the other of them should be able to deliver her for you.

Thank you LittleWing.

Originally Posted by CaptainDenver

My family and I have recently purchased a 52’ sailboat currently located in ME. We plan to keep it on the New England coast for the coming Spring and Summer Season. As for Winter, we are hoping to get it down to the BVI’s, but likely will not have the time to make the passage ourselves.

Would anyone be willing to share their experiences with shipping vs paying a skipper for delivery under sail? We are struggling to estimate which option would be more cost effective.

I'm more than happy to help with advice. If you decide to deliver the boat on her own bottom I'd like the opportunity to bid. That is the only quid pro quo for helping.

For budgeting purposes a fully crewed delivery for me would be between $7500 and $8000US from Newport to BVI. That is day rate, food, C&I fees, and transportation but not fuel. This is NOT an estimate. It's a budgetary estimate from staring out the window for a few seconds and adding up numbers in my head. Other skippers may be cheaper or more expensive than I am. I'm in the upper middle of the price range - I don't do superyachts - I top out around 75 or 80'.

Transport by ship is going to be $20,000 to $30,000. Seven Star from Newport to St Thomas would be about $23kUS. Lots of departures from Fort Lauderdale. There is only seasonal service from Newport. Loadout and offload is non-trivial. If you can't be there at both ends you'll want to hire someone to look out for your interests. I'm not trying to talk you out of that option. There are some attractive benefits to shipping but you pay for it.

I've done a lot of commercial and military work as a naval architect so I can speak to the shipping process as well as delivery on own-bottom.

If you have general questions I'm happy to help here where the information might be of benefit to others. If you want to get into details you can drop me a line at dave@auspiciousworks.com.

[Zzmeyer]

I'd listen to Auspicious. His delivery estimate is much more in line with what I've paid in the past than some of the earlier posts. In the past week I got a quote to deliver my Saona 47 catamaran from La Rochelle to Fort Lauderdale by sea. $23,000 including insurance and expenses by delivery captain and crew. I got a quote by ship at $30,000 (loading, unloading, insurance). The reason that they are close is the distance is long and they are shipping a boat load of cats almost every week from France to US East Coast.

[Clivevon]

Hi. Another factor apart from cost is that you won't learn anything about your new boat by sending it on the deck of a ship. Whereas if you have a professional delivery crew sail her down to BVI it will be a good sea trial & the feedback you will get from the skipper at the end of the trip will probably be very useful.
Assumes your boat is in good seaworthy condition& well up for the trip,otherwise problemsenroute could end up being very costly.... Ask me how I know.....
Boat will need a thorough check over beforehand - not just a normal survey ....
Including all the parts that a survey won't reach.
I havenoadvice on timing because no experience of those waters. But general idea would be to fit the trip to the weather.
You might crew yourself partway,provided you are up to delivery crew bashing on?
Make sure your sails,rigging & engine are all up to the job, especially engine, as the trip will probably be tougher on the boat than your own cruising schedule,maybe ?

[wolfesmy]

Just something to consider, why not sign up with something like the Salty Dawg Rally. They travel in groups to BVI, or Antigua at the end of October. Great organization with tracking and weather support. There is also an available Crew bank if you need extra hands.

I've crewed a number of times and it works really well.
It would need a 10 to 12 day commitment from you to make the passage.

Good luck and maybe we'll see you in BVI.

Cheers and good luck.

[Auspicious]

Since I jumped in, more thoughts triggered by other posts.

Originally Posted by Zzmeyer

The reason that they are close is the distance is long and they are shipping a boat load of cats almost every week from France to US East Coast.

Which leads to the point that if boats are being delivered in one direction (new Fontaine Pajots from France to the US) there is the opportunity for savings on backhauls. You aren't going to get that opportunity for summers in New England and winters in the Caribbean.

Originally Posted by Clivevon

Another factor apart from cost is that you won't learn anything about your new boat by sending it on the deck of a ship. Whereas if you have a professional delivery crew sail her down to BVI it will be a good sea trial & the feedback you will get from the skipper at the end of the trip will probably be very useful.

Agreed. You may get a verbal report or something more substantive. I provide a spreadsheet with failures and remediation. We try to fix things so they stay fixed without shortcuts but sometimes getting through safely is the best you can do. You may also get a list of recommendations. I prioritize mine.

Clive's point on surveys is more on point than he may realize. Providing a copy of your latest survey to the delivery skipper is hugely helpful. That said, I have a long list of things that make a difference that surveyors just don't look at. There's a rant there.

Delivery skippers have different views on sailing owner aboard. I'm a big fan - it's an opportunity for everyone to come out ahead. There is always a discussion before dropping lines about who is in charge. I'd point out that if you feel the need to hire someone there really shouldn't be any question about who is in charge. *grin* Owners always get heard (so do crew on my boats) and an owner may say "based on what you say about the weather maybe we should spend the winter in the Florida Keys instead of the Caribbean."

Only mildly to this point but there are important considerations about endpoints. Ultimately you have to get skipper and crew on and off the boat and owners on at the end. Think about airports. Story: a customer wanted his boat moved from Charleston SC to Staten Island NY. He thought moving it himself to Beaufort NC would save him a couple of days of my time. It didn't. Adding up his transportation, my transportation (anyone who has flown into New Bern will understand), and provisioning leaving from Charleston was cheaper. The new(ish) Enterprise Rent-a-Car in Morehead City helps but we're not talking about a lot of money.

The point about the impact of failures is very relevant. Another story: Bradenton to Annapolis we had a major rigging failure and limped into Stock Island just East of Key West. We got sorted out and it was clear a permanent solution was not realistic in Key West. Shipping times were high, local expertise was not great, and transportation for crew timing out was very high. We worked out an expedient (lots of Dyneema) and sailed to Ft Lauderdale in about a day-and-a-half. Good services, good shipping, good transportation, better cost of living. Permanent solution there and a new crew to get us back off the dock. There is a much longer and more entertaining version of this story but it requires adult beverages. *grin*

Originally Posted by wolfesmy

Just something to consider, why not sign up with something like the Salty Dawg Rally. They travel in groups to BVI, or Antigua at the end of October. Great organization with tracking and weather support. There is also an available Crew bank if you need extra hands.

I've crewed a number of times and it works really well.
It would need a 10 to 12 day commitment from you to make the passage.

The Salty Dawg and Caribbean 1500 are a great time. I know the Knowles and support them. For a delivery it is just another expense for the owner with little value-added unless they will be aboard to enjoy the entertainment, the seminars, and the weather service. A good (<- opinion) delivery skipper IS your weather service. I have stories on this subject as well, including Martinique to Annapolis, Annapolis to BVI, and others.

[gsuescum]

Originally Posted by billknny

It's really hard to imagine that shipping would be cheaper for such a relatively short run. Especially since it is unlikely that the boat will end up exactly where you want it and will need a delivery on one--or both ends--of the trip anyway.

Exactly what I was going to write.

Delivery will cost anywhere from $7-15k+

[Cheechako]

Shipping by land is a ton of work. I have shipped twice, both times some damage occurred. Pulling, launching, derigging, rigging. Big boats sometimes even need the pulpits etc removed. That wont get you to the BVI's anyway. Hire a good skipper.

[Zanshin]

I just shipped my Jeanneau 57 from the BVI to Newport (I would have sailed, but she's missing a mast post-Irma and I wanted the repairs done outside of the BVI) and the cost was just over 22K$. That was a special deal, I had shopped around with several shippers and the average prices were significantly higher.

This run is pretty easy on the boat, so the wear-and-tear is going to be minimal (assuming you do prudent weather planning) so sailing her down on her own hull is going to cost you about 50% of what shipping her is going to cost.

A note on shipping - if you can't be there for the loading and unloading processes, you will have to hire someone on either end to do this for you. Import and Export fees will apply in addition to the shipping costs, as will insurance.
The "shipping dates" are quite fluid, I ended up waiting 6 days in the BVI between the original planned date and the actual loading date - and you NEED to load on schedule or the demurrage fees for a single day will eat up your whole $20K! Same thing on arrival, the cargo ship arrived 5 days later than the date specified after the cargo ship left the BVI. Those delays might cost you extra if you have (paid) crew waiting.

Talk with SVAuspicious offline and he'll assist you.