Catalina smile or something more?

[Dpmmvc]

I’m in the market for a Catalina 30. I’m attaching a picture of the largest Catalina smile I’ve seen in person. This boat is in nice condition other then this keel smiling at me. Should I be worried ? The owner said they’ve fixed the crack but it keeps coming back🤔

[LittleWing77]

That is NOT a "Catalina Smile" . If it was a smile, it would be along the join of the keel to the hull. That looks like a hard grounding which damaged the keel.

Ask Boatpoker (expert surveyor who is a member of this Forum).

Ugh. Wouldn't touch that one, either.

Best of luck with your boat-shopping,
LittleWing

[GordMay]

The actual keel to hull (stub) joint can be surprisingly low down. This may, indeed, be a true Catalina Smile.
➥ https://www.google.com/search?q=cata...w=1348&bih=588

[tkeithlu]

Whatever it is, they didn't "fix it" if it "keeps coming back." Walk on this one.

[rosatte]

they can be repaired with GFlex but that’s a big smile may be from a grounding check keel bolts

[NewCatGuy]

Looks very much like a smile, and “ fixing” it is a relative term. I’ve fixed them and they stay fixed, and I’ve fixed them and they don’t. The only true way is to drop the keel, which virtually no one ever does.

[Cheechako]

That's not a Cat Smile. The smile would be fore and or aft of the keel on the hull.

That's just a joint for the ballast to the keel stub it appears. It does seem a bit more prevalent than most. But it could just be something they filled the gap with in the past, like thick epoxy, and now it's peeling/flaking up.

It may need tightening of the keel bolts and recaulking, or it may need more like dropping the ballast, rebedding and checking the bolts. More likely just the former and may only be cosmetic.

[PHR]

Yeah, that's a not-good boat to buy unless you want to continue throwing money down the same hole.

[Brewgyver]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

That's not a Cat Smile. The smile would be fore and or aft of the keel on the hull.
(snip)

No, the Catalina Smile IS at the hull to keel joint.

[Brewgyver]

When I looked at one of the pics, I instantly thought "no, that's too low." Then I took a look at the other pics. This is the Wing Keel version, which can make the joint look very low. The camera angle is also misleading in a couple of the pics, it's better to take the picture at 90 degrees from the length of the boat, at the same height of the crack, with a standard (50 mm, more or less) focal length lens, and far enough away to see several feet fore and aft of the keel in frame.

It most likely is Catalina Smile, and as has been mentioned above, sometimes the keel has to be dropped to effect a lasting repair.

If I were otherwise considering that boat, I'd take a couple of good pics and send them to Gerry Butler at Catalina, or to a local yard that's done a lot of them.
Edit: most of the busier yards on the West Coast will have done a lot of them.

[Empty Pockets]

Originally Posted by Brewgyver

If I were otherwise considering that boat, I'd take a couple of good pics and send them to Gerry Butler at Catalina, or to a local yard that's done a lot of them.
Edit: most of the busier yards on the West Coast will have done a lot of them.

Frank Butler, or Gerry Douglas. And that’s exactly what I’d do. You’ll be surprised how quickly you have your answer. And if all it is is the keel/hull joint, and you like the boat, it’s a fairly straightforward repair.

[Dpmmvc]

The owner of the boat emailed be a survey that was done in 2017 that confirms it’s a Catalina smile. Any idea now on repair cost for something like this??

[Dpmmvc]

Survey says! “Refair keel/hull joint”

[George DuBose]

Unless you do it yourself, dropping the lead ballast from a keel stub is a pricey operation. On many vintage sailboats, it is a good idea to know the condition of the keel bolts. What material are they made from and are they cast in "J" bolts or threaded rods.

That keel looks for sure that it needs attention, rebedding at the least. Get the seller to knock a grand or two to cover the keel repair properly.

[gonesail]

not sure about a catalina smile but that keel looks like it may have had a grounding. be careful.