Beneteau 393 vs Gemini 105Mc?

[Dooglas]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Care to provide info on why you think this rather than a random statement with nothing to substantiate it? (honest question)
I know of several in the PNW and haven't heard where they have difficulty.

Honest answer. I have limited experience with cats, so I will not comment on their capabilities. Have sailed a couple (Lagoons) in the Caribbean and crewed on a powercat (PDQ 34) in the Northwest and on the Gulf Coast of Florida. My comment (and I essentially made it above) was that while cruising the more exposed waters of the Northwest and BC, I rarely see a cat - sailing or power. Yes, they are common enough in the inside waters of Puget Sound and the Salish Sea. When it comes to the OR/WA Coast, the outside of Vancouver Island, the Broughtons, and further North - they are far less common with the offshore Glacier Bays being the boat I have seen most often.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by Dooglas

Honest answer. I have limited experience with cats, so I will not comment on their capabilities. Have sailed a couple (Lagoons) in the Caribbean and crewed on a powercat (PDQ 34) in the Northwest and on the Gulf Coast of Florida. My comment (and I essentially made it above) was that while cruising the more exposed waters of the Northwest and BC, I rarely see a cat - sailing or power. Yes, they are common enough in the inside waters of Puget Sound and the Salish Sea. When it comes to the OR/WA Coast, the outside of Vancouver Island, the Broughtons, and further North - they are far less common with the offshore Glacier Bays being the boat I have seen most often.

I wasn't referring to your comment as you provided at least a basic assessment why you preferred the Bene. But...

While not the ideal boat for bashing to weather...I don't think the Bene is either.

Sailing to windward... depends on conditions. With boards, I'll bet the Gemini outpoints the Bene assuming it's not steep 3-5' chop.

As far as not seeing a lot of them? I might have thought the same 10yrs ago on the Great Lakes but they are starting to become much more common. I suspect it has to do with them being newer and reality is most new boat buyers still have to work, so don't have the time for more extensive cruising...hence you see them sailed more locally. On the other hand your full keel boats tend to average 30+ years old and are bought by a different buyer who can't afford a newer cat (obviously talking averages not specific individuals).

Then again the OP needs to chime in what his idea of an Alaska trip is. If he's looking for an expedition type cruise, he probably should be looking at a heavily built rugged boat. He'll sacrifice comfort 90% of the time to get it but as with everything, there are always trade offs.

[docrn]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

I wasn't referring to your comment as you provided at least a basic assessment why you preferred the Bene. But...

While not the ideal boat for bashing to weather...I don't think the Bene is either.

Sailing to windward... depends on conditions. With boards, I'll bet the Gemini outpoints the Bene assuming it's not steep 3-5' chop.

As far as not seeing a lot of them? I might have thought the same 10yrs ago on the Great Lakes but they are starting to become much more common. I suspect it has to do with them being newer and reality is most new boat buyers still have to work, so don't have the time for more extensive cruising...hence you see them sailed more locally. On the other hand your full keel boats tend to average 30+ years old and are bought by a different buyer who can't afford a newer cat (obviously talking averages not specific individuals).

Then again the OP needs to chime in what his idea of an Alaska trip is. If he's looking for an expedition type cruise, he probably should be looking at a heavily built rugged boat. He'll sacrifice comfort 90% of the time to get it but as with everything, there are always trade offs.

Funny that you should say that. I am going to look at the Gemini in a couple
weeks but I did happen to see a Tayana 37 in my price range. If the owner is willing to work with me this thread may have not been necessary. Having a boat that’s paid for sure bumps up my timeline and makes my plans much more realistic.

As far as my Alaska trip goes I plan to take a year or two off and sail to Hawaii and then North to Alaska and slowly make my way south. I might try to find temporary work in my field (I’m an RN) as we travel but I’d like to spend at least a year in Alaska. Dark cold winter days and all.

I like the idea of a heavier displacement boat but every time I think I’ve found “the one” there always seems to be some insurmountable stumbling block. Of course my small budget doesn’t help the situation but such is life.

Also we do plan to frequently sail the Oregon coast. This is not done much as currents, wind and wave conditions aren’t conducive to a relaxing trip. There aren’t many good ports and bar conditions change every 5 minutes. My parents home is on one of the coastal rivers and they have deep water frontage with a sizable dock that we hope to visit as many times as we can over the next few years before we leave on the “big trip”. That means sailing out the Columbia and South to Florence and eventually back to Portland again. I see the Tayana or similar vessel being the boat of choice for this. Not that we couldn’t or wouldn’t do it in the Gemini or B393, I just think we enjoy the trip more in a heavier boat.

Whatever the boat I’ll just be glad to be finally be on our own boat again and not having to mow the lawn.

[Dooglas]

Originally Posted by docrn

Also we do plan to frequently sail the Oregon coast. This is not done much as currents, wind and wave conditions aren’t conducive to a relaxing trip. There aren’t many good ports and bar conditions change every 5 minutes. My parents home is on one of the coastal rivers and they have deep water frontage with a sizable dock that we hope to visit as many times as we can over the next few years before we leave on the “big trip”. That means sailing out the Columbia and South to Florence and eventually back to Portland again. I see the Tayana or similar vessel being the boat of choice for this. Not that we couldn’t or wouldn’t do it in the Gemini or B393, I just think we enjoy the trip more in a heavier boat.

I have always liked the looks of the Tayana 37 and it has a solid reputation. And that IS a boat I see in the less protected waters of the Northwest and BC. Good luck with this one. I think it would serve you well.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by docrn

Also we do plan to frequently sail the Oregon coast. This is not done much as currents, wind and wave conditions aren’t conducive to a relaxing trip. There aren’t many good ports and bar conditions change every 5 minutes. My parents home is on one of the coastal rivers and they have deep water frontage with a sizable dock that we hope to visit as many times as we can over the next few years before we leave on the “big trip”. That means sailing out the Columbia and South to Florence and eventually back to Portland again. I see the Tayana or similar vessel being the boat of choice for this. Not that we couldn’t or wouldn’t do it in the Gemini or B393, I just think we enjoy the trip more in a heavier boat.

If the goal is to regularly cruise in tough conditions, I wouldn't recommend either.

They would both likely survive. Boats will almost always survive more than the crew can handle and I've heard some pretty bad stories where a Gem survived fine. But you will get beat up in the process with either.

[NormanMartin]

I have sailed both models quite a bit as a professional delivery captain and sail-trainer. For coastal work, I'd take the Gemini. They are sensitive to overloading. The user groups are super helpful. If you like, I will link you up with them.

Reply by private message.

[docrn]

Update:

We went with the 393. Deep keel stack pack version which I think is the preferred configuration for the boat. Has a few other nice upgrades like a larger 56hp yanmar and a featuring prop. Not particularly impressed with the 36gal fuel tank but I think we can come up with a solution to bring a little more fuel. I guess I have some time to figure it out.

[Vasco]

Good choice. [emoji1]

[NormanMartin]

DOCRN:
Well that's great news. Always good to learn someone is taking action to go.

I have skippered the charter version of the 393 and expect you will like th boat for living aboard. As I recall, the galley is a delight to work in.

As info: I just delivered a Ben 43 from Newport to BVI. Light air most of the way so we motor-sailed a lot. Burned about 1/2 gal per hour at RPMs to make 6.5 knots. #% gal should take you pretty far.

Have fun...
Norm

[canyonbat]

I can’t speak to the Gemini as we have no experience but I would be very sure I have a home for her before purchase. The PNW has not embraced cats like other cruising grounds and many marinas still have narrow fairways and slips. Cats and other big boats are often relegated to limited side ties that fill early in the high seasons. I would also be sure I understood how the boat will handle motoring dead upwind in the short square waves created in the wind over current situations you often run in to up there. Our Beneteau 40 is ok but not great in those conditions as she tends to pound a bit.

[canyonbat]

Originally Posted by docrn

Update:

We went with the 393. Deep keel stack pack version which I think is the preferred configuration for the boat. Has a few other nice upgrades like a larger 56hp yanmar and a featuring prop. Not particularly impressed with the 36gal fuel tank but I think we can come up with a solution to bring a little more fuel. I guess I have some time to figure it out.

Oops - just saw that. Good choice, you will like it. Don’t stress too much on the fuel capacity. The most fuel we put in during our Alaska trip last summer was 33 gallons. That was after 254 miles under motor. I have some spreadsheets I can send of performance, stops, etc. if you are interested. Drop me a pm.

[scuba0_1]

Step 1 buy the boat. Now go sailing. Great job.

[docrn]

Thanks for the replies!

Now I need to get the boat to Portland. Not sure this is the best time of year to take the trip south from Seattle...

[B23iL23]

Good choice and nice config. Deep keel and stack pack is a great combination and will perform nicely.


Do sweat on the tank. Use it for a season and then decide if you really need to upgrade to (says he with the 300 gal tank!)

Originally Posted by docrn

Update:

We went with the 393. Deep keel stack pack version which I think is the preferred configuration for the boat. Has a few other nice upgrades like a larger 56hp yanmar and a featuring prop. Not particularly impressed with the 36gal fuel tank but I think we can come up with a solution to bring a little more fuel. I guess I have some time to figure it out.

[docrn]

1 year update:

We love the boat. After spending 6 months familiarizing ourselves with the her on the Puget Sound we sailed it home to Portland Oregon. The boat handled the trip down the coast beautifully and aside from an issue with the marine heads on the boat I have zero complaints with the 393. She's reasonably quick and sails to weather well.

My only "problem" at the moment is that sailing the Columbia River is boring! Not really any place to go and the tacking back and forth gets old after awhile. We are really missing the Seattle area and I'm counting down the days (530) until we are allowed to return!