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-   -   It Starts with Training (https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f129/it-starts-with-training-68282.html)

VirtualVagabond 17-09-2011 05:21

Re: It starts with training .
 
Sailing is a bit like posting on a forum... any idiot can have a go, and if you totally cock it up, everyone around you will let you know and point you in the right direction... :whistling:

I don't know what you've been drinking, Domenic, but make sure you lay off that jungle juice at least 48 hours before you plan to take your boat out... https://www.cruisersforum.com/images/...n_rolleyes.gif

coyfish9906 17-09-2011 05:47

Im one of those greenhorns....im buying a 24' bristlol next wk and never ever raised a sail in my life ....yet....
I know I will be okay because I have a leg up on most new sailers. I can navigate, I know the rules of traffic, I can operate and care for any diesel engine out their and many more skills I've picked up from being a commercial fisherman. I started that job with out ever steping on a boat. When anyone is called to sea, it takes a certain constitution to enjoy it and learn from it. No amount of training could prepare you for 30' seas or what u should do when your adrift....experience can and unless things have changed there's only one way to get that..
Also I have tried to crew on other ppls boats but if seems no one would be willing to take me on with the little exp I have, so what can you do but do it you're self...

lorenzo b 17-09-2011 06:23

Re: It starts with training .
 
I bought my very first boat at age 65, a 63 ft, 70 ton steel shrimp boat, and was very pleased at how graciously other boaters stayed clear while I learned to steer the damn thing up and down the ICW. The only things I hit were some anchored barges, channel markers, and one old dock. Still floating and getting a little better every day.
Gotta love that steel.

Rakuflames 17-09-2011 06:24

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by coyfish9906 (Post 777076)
Im one of those greenhorns....im buying a 24' bristlol next wk and never ever raised a sail in my life ....yet....
I know I will be okay because I have a leg up on most new sailers. I can navigate, I know the rules of traffic, I can operate and care for any diesel engine out their and many more skills I've picked up from being a commercial fisherman. I started that job with out ever steping on a boat. When anyone is called to sea, it takes a certain constitution to enjoy it and learn from it. No amount of training could prepare you for 30' seas or what u should do when your adrift....experience can and unless things have changed there's only one way to get that..
Also I have tried to crew on other ppls boats but if seems no one would be willing to take me on with the little exp I have, so what can you do but do it you're self...

Personally I think that's a great size to start with. I started with a 25'. I could single-hand her sooner and I learned a whole lot just from sailing her. Then something really hairy would happen. After I stopped shaking I'd compare what I did to what I should have done, and my sailing skills improved.

coyfish9906 17-09-2011 06:36

Lol I've done my share of shaking. My first trip out to sea..we were purse saining for squid at night, 100 miles off shore and my skip charged me with being the skift driver, towing the net off the stern and then towing the boat when they shut down the auxiliary. Two inches of diesel was floating in my skift and u had to pull a shoe string to shut her off. Lol she caught fire while I was towing her, at nite. No radio and nothing but a line to pull my self back to the boat.
I think I put the flames out when I wet my pants...lol not to hi jack the thread. Just thought id share that..

osirissail 17-09-2011 06:43

Re: It starts with training .
 
There are as many different ways to get into sailing/cruising as there are different makes/models of sailboats. Generally they all work out in the end. Many of the new sailboats are really power boats with masts to make them look like sailboats or at least that is what the new owners think as they motor around and never raise the sails. Whatever works for you . . .
- - I would recommend starting "small" with a dinghy or cubby size sailboat for those with a very limited budget who want to sail but cannot take the "plunge" right away into a large boat. For limited budget sailors, getting experience under your belt first will help when it comes time to buy "that boat" in that you will have experience in what you really want in the boat and not waste precious resources on something that is not appropriate to your needs.

s/v Moondancer 17-09-2011 06:57

Re: It starts with training .
 
Domenic,

I find it quite amazing that people who would want their, doctor, dentist, lawyer to be well trained and experienced are happy to get on a boat with someone who has no training or experience.

We live on a boat in the Caribbean and frequently meet people who have 'bitten off more than they can chew' and have scared the hell out of themselves.

As to sailors who learned in small boats and graduate to bigger boats...they are the sailors who can put a big boat on a mooring under sail, get it back in its slip when the engine quits without calling Sea Tow, or nail a MOB under sail in any conditions.

Well said Dominic! I hope that at least some beginners will take note.

Domenic 17-09-2011 07:04

Re: It starts with training .
 
RAKUFLAMES, lets put your theory to the test. You’re on the East Coast. You decide to buy a sailboat, and sail across the Atlantic ocean. The boat is 45’, equipped with everything including a lifelong pass to Disney World. You hire a guy from one of the local sailing schools to sail with you for two weeks. The first week you, and three friends watch, and make notes of everything the Master Skipper does. The second week the Master Skipper turned the vessel over to you, and your friends, and corrects any mistakes you make. At the end of the two weeks, he gives the four of you a Sailing Certificate trimmed in gold, with a big seal, and his signature. As you’re stocking the vessel with food stuff for the Grand Adventure, four young women ask if they can sun bath topless on your 45’ dream boat. Four days later your ready to set sail…the young girls are impressed with your sailing certificates, and ask if they can sail to Europe with you. You agree, and at dawn on the out going tide, you leave the harbor, and enter the Atlantic Ocean…You don’t know everything, but your motto is, “Learn as you go.”
Three days out you receive a radio report…a 300 mile wide hurricane is heading North , by North West at 16 miles per hour, and has a wind speed of 160 MPH. 12 hours later, your vessel is within the storm. You, and your trusty crew of three, and three young girls fight the weather for the next 24 hours…your doing great…learning as you go. You lose all power, nothing works. You are fighting the sea with sail, and two weeks of traing under your belt. You agree with your three friends when they say, “We have to get the hell out of this.”
So here is my question; How do you locate your position in the storm, and which way do you sail to get out of it? Learn as you go, right?

Just to be a butt head, lets make the three gals 17, and their fathers cops.

hoppy 17-09-2011 07:15

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Domenic (Post 776956)
When ever I hear someone who has never learned to sail, announce, Im buying a forty foot sailboat. Get a young honey, and sail to Paradise. It takes my breath away.

I learnt to sail in a dingy and can see the advantages, but sometimes you just don't have time to do anything except go from zero to hero or become a buddihist and hope you eventually get reincarnated as someone who can take the slow path in a later lifetime. I have noticed in the past few weeks that many bigger boat owners are counting down to death (or retired). At 46 I'm a baby.

I would suggest that people who have never sailed should do a skippered charter on their dream boat or at least one of similar size to see if it comes even close to what they dream it will be like. During the charter you also start to learn some of the basics and then go off and do training appropriate for your dream boat or even hire an instructor to come with you on your new boat

coyfish9906 17-09-2011 07:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Domenic
RAKUFLAMES, lets put your theory to the test. You’re on the East Coast. You decide to buy a sailboat, and sail across the Atlantic ocean. The boat is 45’, equipped with everything including a lifelong pass to Disney World. You hire a guy from one of the local sailing schools to sail with you for two weeks. The first week you, and three friends watch, and make notes of everything the Master Skipper does. The second week the Master Skipper turned the vessel over to you, and your friends, and corrects any mistakes you make. At the end of the two weeks, he gives the four of you a Sailing Certificate trimmed in gold, with a big seal, and his signature. As you’re stocking the vessel with food stuff for the Grand Adventure, four young women ask if they can sun bath topless on your 45’ dream boat. Four days later your ready to set sail…the young girls are impressed with your sailing certificates, and ask if they can sail to Europe with you. You agree, and at dawn on the out going tide, you leave the harbor, and enter the Atlantic Ocean…You don’t know everything, but your motto is, “Learn as you go.”
Three days out you receive a radio report…a 300 mile wide hurricane is heading North , by North West at 16 miles per hour, and has a wind speed of 160 MPH. 12 hours later, your vessel is within the storm. You, and your trusty crew of three, and three young girls fight the weather for the next 24 hours…your doing great…learning as you go. You lose all power, nothing works. You are fighting the sea with sail, and two weeks of traing under your belt. You agree with your three friends when they say, “We have to get the hell out of this.”
So here is my question; How do you locate your position in the storm, and which way do you sail to get out of it? Learn as you go, right?

Just to be a butt head, lets make the three gals 17, and their fathers cops.

In theory anything is possible. Like I said, it takes a certain constitution to do these things, learn from it and enjoy it. Did your school teach you to be level headed and to stay calm when something bad was happening? Even if they did it took you going through it your first time to build your confidence to do it the next. No amount of certificates can save your @$$ when the sea takes you for a ride,

Domenic 17-09-2011 07:21

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by s/v Moondancer (Post 777110)
Domenic,

I find it quite amazing that people who would want their, doctor, dentist, lawyer to be well trained and experienced are happy to get on a boat with someone who has no training or experience.

We live on a boat in the Caribbean and frequently meet people who have 'bitten off more than they can chew' and have scared the hell out of themselves.

As to sailors who learned in small boats and graduate to bigger boats...they are the sailors who can put a big boat on a mooring under sail, get it back in its slip when the engine quits without calling Sea Tow, or nail a MOB under sail in any conditions.

Well said Dominic! I hope that at least some beginners will take note.

Moondancer, It's not funny, it's sad...one fellow on this thread even suggested I not drink before I go sailing. Is the SS ship of Fools anchored in these waters?

Rakuflames 17-09-2011 07:28

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by osirissail (Post 777101)
There are as many different ways to get into sailing/cruising as there are different makes/models of sailboats. Generally they all work out in the end. Many of the new sailboats are really power boats with masts to make them look like sailboats or at least that is what the new owners think as they motor around and never raise the sails. Whatever works for you . . .
- - I would recommend starting "small" with a dinghy or cubby size sailboat for those with a very limited budget who want to sail but cannot take the "plunge" right away into a large boat. For limited budget sailors, getting experience under your belt first will help when it comes time to buy "that boat" in that you will have experience in what you really want in the boat and not waste precious resources on something that is not appropriate to your needs.

I personally don't think a dinghy is the way to start. They're too vulnerable if a sudden storm comes up. I started with a 25' boat after a short sailing course and was doing well in no time. I say get a boat with a real keel that's unlikely to tip you over in a strong wind or if you move wrong suddenly.

Rakuflames 17-09-2011 07:33

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by s/v Moondancer (Post 777110)
Domenic,

I find it quite amazing that people who would want their, doctor, dentist, lawyer to be well trained and experienced are happy to get on a boat with someone who has no training or experience.

We live on a boat in the Caribbean and frequently meet people who have 'bitten off more than they can chew' and have scared the hell out of themselves.

As to sailors who learned in small boats and graduate to bigger boats...they are the sailors who can put a big boat on a mooring under sail, get it back in its slip when the engine quits without calling Sea Tow, or nail a MOB under sail in any conditions.

Well said Dominic! I hope that at least some beginners will take note.

I think it takes a LOT of experience to dock a big boat under sail. I don't think the fact that i can't do that yet means I shouldn't be on the water. i should be somewhere Boat US goes when I'm docking. Another option is to have auxiliary power. I know how to put my outboard motor on my dinghy and use it as a tugboat.

You have to know your limitations, but if sailing were restricted to those who can dock a big boat under sail, very few people would be sailing, and when they died off there would be no one left to sail. With my experience, I don't go anywhere Boat US doesn't go.

It takes a long time to acquire some skills. You can get the basic ones pretty quickly. After that, it's important to sail enough that you know your limitations so you can choose trips that don't put you and anyone else on your boat in danger.

boatman61 17-09-2011 07:38

Re: It starts with training .
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Domenic (Post 777114)
RAKUFLAMES, lets put your theory to the test. You’re on the East Coast. You decide to buy a sailboat, and sail across the Atlantic ocean. The boat is 45’, equipped with everything including a lifelong pass to Disney World. You hire a guy from one of the local sailing schools to sail with you for two weeks. The first week you, and three friends watch, and make notes of everything the Master Skipper does. The second week the Master Skipper turned the vessel over to you, and your friends, and corrects any mistakes you make. At the end of the two weeks, he gives the four of you a Sailing Certificate trimmed in gold, with a big seal, and his signature. As you’re stocking the vessel with food stuff for the Grand Adventure, four young women ask if they can sun bath topless on your 45’ dream boat. Four days later your ready to set sail…the young girls are impressed with your sailing certificates, and ask if they can sail to Europe with you. You agree, and at dawn on the out going tide, you leave the harbor, and enter the Atlantic Ocean…You don’t know everything, but your motto is, “Learn as you go.”
Three days out you receive a radio report…a 300 mile wide hurricane is heading North , by North West at 16 miles per hour, and has a wind speed of 160 MPH. 12 hours later, your vessel is within the storm. You, and your trusty crew of three, and three young girls fight the weather for the next 24 hours…your doing great…learning as you go. You lose all power, nothing works. You are fighting the sea with sail, and two weeks of traing under your belt. You agree with your three friends when they say, “We have to get the hell out of this.”
So here is my question; How do you locate your position in the storm, and which way do you sail to get out of it? Learn as you go, right?

Just to be a butt head, lets make the three gals 17, and their fathers cops.

Simple.... Heave to... go to bed... and comfort the girls...;)
Why fight it.... You Know It Makes Sense...

Domenic 17-09-2011 07:39

Re: It starts with training .
 
RAKUFLAMES, I took a second look at my first post...I did say, "Find a small body of water."
You skirted around my question on how to find your location in the storm of storms, and how to get out of it.

Please understand, I am not using you as a target, their are some very stupid people on this thread...maybe just one person can get the sense of what is being said.


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