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-   -   How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V (https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f14/how-to-repair-alternator-powerline-series-23-5-120-amp-12v-213467.html)

pr2501 02-02-2019 18:10

How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
My boat has a Balmar ARS-4 regulator. If you check the PDF from the link in troubleshooting you will see that regulator provides from 7 to 12 V over blue line to alternator. From there it goes to instrument panel to Tachometer (engine speed rotation display)

In my case I have 1.2 Volts once the ignition is on and not 7-12.
If I disconnect the blue wire from alternator I have then around 6V. Anway is much more than 1.2V and I may presume that regulator works fine and that I must repair the alternator. And as fact alternator is not increasing voltage of system when engine is running.

I have one alternator for spare parts. But I was not checking it for years so I found out today that it was so rusted that rotor was totally stuck. And all bolts did brake when I was trying to open it. Anyway in the end I destroyed everything to get to the diodes. So, ... I think that on my active boat
alternator winding is ok, and that I must have a diodes failure.

If my logic is correct, now I will ask what is the procedure to pull out diodes from the aluminium housing?

Still I can cut them out with grinder. And probably that it would be the less risk of damage.
But maybe I am mistaking. And probably I don't need all 6 of them.

And I was measuring resistance of my spare diodes. And it is around
250 k Ω. Is it a normal reading ?

boatnerd 03-02-2019 02:21

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Did you clean all connection on your balmar plugin harness? Insure you have good voltage at ignition panel relative to battery bank? If alt diodes are blown you can check for amperage leakage on negative ground of battery bank with everything switched off. A blown 200v rectifier diode might draw 2amps. Another useful alternator test is checking field winding for magnetism by turning ingition on(dont start), than with screwdrive test magnetic field on alternator shaft. From experience i would check harness 1st, than remove alternator to have bench tested. Dont remove diodes to test them before your sure its not something else.

stormalong 03-02-2019 02:48

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
If the blue wire from the regulator is the field connection and it is only producing 1.2 volts under load then the regulator is bad, not the alternator.

You cannot test a diode on the resistance scale of a multmeter. Diodes have a voltage drop, about .6 volts that will always produce bogus results on an ohm meter. Does your multimeter have a diode check function? If not measure the forward and reverse voltages by connecting one end of the diode to the plus terminal and measure the voltage from the other end to ground, then reverse the diode. One way should read just a little less that the battery voltage and the other way should read zero volts.

pr2501 03-02-2019 07:11

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Can you explain me pleas how is the princip of alternator? I don' t understand the brushes conection. If one brushe terminal is field which has positive pole how does it work when another brushe is conected to the signal conection on tachometer?

pr2501 03-02-2019 07:30

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
If rotor is conected on one of brushes to the regulator, can I conect the other brushes terminal directly to ground?

pr2501 03-02-2019 07:39

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
In teory when there is a voltage drop because of load on alternator stator, then the regulator increse the current in rotor field. Correct?

How can I electricaly replace the part of system which on my sailing boat is conected to tachometer?

pr2501 03-02-2019 07:40

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Because also my tachometer is not showing engine rotation speed.

kenbo 03-02-2019 07:45

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pr2501 (Post 2817282)
Can you explain me pleas how is the princip of alternator? I don' t understand the brushes conection. If one brushe terminal is field which has positive pole how does it work when another brushe is conected to the signal conection on tachometer?

On your alternator, which is a B type or positive control, the regulator supplies power to the field coil through the positive brush. The circuit is completed via the negative brush which goes directly to ground. The negative brush has nothing to do with the tach signal. If it does on your boat it is installed incorrectly.

The tach signal comes of one of the three stator windings and is proportional to the rpm of the alternator and the number of poles.

kenbo 03-02-2019 07:56

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
I believe your alternator is based on the Delco 10DN. The diodes are a simple press fit, no need for a grinder. Negative diodes are pressed into the SRE case and the positive diodes are pressed into the bridge rectifier.

SteveSails 03-02-2019 09:33

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Before you blame the alternator for the fault follow the troubleshooting procedure in the ARS-4 manual for checking the field wiring. If it fails the magnetic screwdriver test then check the wiring to the regulator and the harness. If it still fails and you think the alternator is bad remove the alternator and bring it to an automotive electric shop and have them test it, they will be able to check the field winding, stator windings and the diodes, even which diode. From some of the things you said, like using a grinder to remove diodes, I think you will be better off to have the shop repair it.

As for the tachometer not working it won't if there is no output from the alternator. The white stator wire is the unrectified AC output and that is used, through the regulator, to run the tachometer. The blue wire is the field wire and does not connect to the tachometer, if it does the wiring is wrong. I think once you solve the root cause of no alternator output your tachometer will work just fine.

wsmurdoch 03-02-2019 10:18

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
As Kenbo said the POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V alternator looks like a Delco 10DN. Alternators in general and that one in particular are covered in the 12V Doctor's Alternator Book one of the best (though older) books on automotive alternators.

https://www.scribd.com/doc/119790895...LTERNATOR-BOOK

Try page 78 and following.

Bill

pr2501 03-02-2019 10:37

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
I did test diodes vith diode function. All ok. I am now for one ore alreday that i am trying to reasamble the alternator. Brushes are making me a problem.

stormalong 03-02-2019 15:19

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pr2501 (Post 2817419)
I did test diodes vith diode function. All ok. I am now for one ore alreday that i am trying to reasamble the alternator. Brushes are making me a problem.

The brushes are held in place temporarily by thin wires passing through small holes in the brush holder.

Put the brushes in place, compress them and pass wires through the small holes - straightened paper clips work good. The end of the wire has to pass through the back of the case so that after the rotor is in the wires can be pulled out.

pr2501 03-02-2019 17:32

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
Thank you.

I drilled a hole to hold brushes with screwdriver. Stormalong I saw your post to late.

Now I am at the beginning. I have also an another regulator on the boat as spare part.

But I am not sure if it is working.

It is one Powermax voltage regulator from Hamilton Feriss.

It has terminals marked with I A S F and an connection on housing.

F is field. What is the rest ?

kenbo 03-02-2019 17:45

Re: How to repair alternator POWERLINE Series 23-5 120 Amp 12V
 
F = field
I = ignition keyed power
S= stator
A = battery positive


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