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Kenomac 04-11-2015 08:14

Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I just got back from the dentist office where I had my six month cleaning... Just a cleaning that took 40 minutes.

$270 !!! Probably because we have excellent dental insurance. :rolleyes: In Spain and Italy, I think the same procedure would only cost maybe... 35-45 euros.

Since I returned from the Med two weeks ago and rejoined the treadmill life in America amongst the pajama people, I once again can't help but notice how ridiculous the prices are that we pay for everyday, necessary stuff. Back on the boat, I get by on just 10 euros a day for everything! Two hundred gallons of diesel lasts us over two months on the boat; here.... I go through more gasoline that that... just driving back and forth to work.... to make money... to buy gas, heat, food, pay taxes, pay for insurance and car repairs.:facepalm:

And my wife thinks we can't afford to retire? How can we afford to keep working?

I just needed to vent.:biggrin:

cabo_sailor 04-11-2015 09:01

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I feel your pain. 😩. Just don't get ME started

Rich


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pete33458 04-11-2015 09:03

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Maybe your dental hygienist is trying to save up enough money to buy an Oyster 53?

Cheechako 04-11-2015 09:15

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pete33458 (Post 1953781)
Maybe your dental hygienist is trying to save up enough money to buy an Oyster 53?

More likely her boss saving to go shoot Lions or Rhinos in Africa!

IdoraKeeper 04-11-2015 09:15

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
That's it, the entire country has is caught up in Oyster mania. Just like when cab drivers are giving stock tips, when your dental hygiene person is planning on getting an Oyster 53 trouble is right around the corner. :-(

a64pilot 04-11-2015 09:18

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Yeah you didn't get any bite wing X-rays or a Panarex for only $270 though.
I go to a family friend that my Father helped him get his practice going, even then a mouth guard to help stop me from grinding my teeth was at least a grand, I used to make them myself as a kid, you take an impression, pour the impression with stone and trim the model and put the model on a little vacuum machine that heated the plastic, then you slapped the plastic down on the model and turned on the vacuum to suck it to the model.
Couple of bucks materials and maybe an hours labor, for a grand and that being the "family and friends" price? Truly if I had know I was going to be charged I would have said no thanks.

But back to the topic, I have run the "numbers" ad naueseum (sp?)
and I cannot see that us continuing to work is doing us any good at all, it's almost all eaten up by the "system" of buying automobiles, clothes, insurance, etc. etc. required to work.
As soon as I can get our youngest in College, I'm gone, and truthfully I may not make it that long, but until then I have to maintain a house and all that goes with it here in this town so she can go to her Senior year in the same school

Haylands 04-11-2015 09:26

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Tell me about it... gas in the US is $0.73 per ltr in the UK it's $1.73 per ltr... I drive a V8 Range Rover that does 13mpg and I did 15,000 miles last year!!! We have noticed that items in the US are usually much less in $ than they are here in so with 1 1/2 $ to the everything is just so much more here....

I'll get my teeth sorted before we come though... $270 does seem rather steep....:thumb:

s/v Beth 04-11-2015 09:28

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Someone can't see me for under 500.00. And that is aprox. one third what the hospital charges. I think it is ridiculous. I would do it for free, and in Wyoming we did it for barter.
Just saving my clams to retirement. 3 years now.

Cheechako 04-11-2015 09:33

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Big profit over peoples health is always a dubious ethic. Why not charge for Firemen? Charge for Police protection too!

Mike OReilly 04-11-2015 09:46

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I agree Ken. It costs a lot of money to work, and to simply exist over here in our high-priced North American economy. Getting off the wage-slave tread mill removes a large amount of embedded expenses: houses, cars, insurance, taxes, clothes, transportation, entertainment... all these things can be eliminated or reduced significantly once you step away from the tread mill.

People say they can't afford to stop working. I look at all the associated costs, and say I can't afford TO work.

Boatguy30 04-11-2015 09:54

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako (Post 1953792)
More likely her boss saving to go shoot Lions or Rhinos in Africa!

I'm sure kens dentist is the safari type.

Kenomac 04-11-2015 10:11

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30 (Post 1953833)
I'm sure kens dentist is the safari type.

He's a charter guy, told me about his one week summer charter aboard a 43ft mono with two other couples. Sounds cozy.

His office staff seems to consist of just as many people dealing with insurance as hygienists cleaning teeth. Everyone there seems to be on the same American treadmill as us.

I looked at the bill again, it did include an annual wing bite X-ray... whatever that is, along with some smile photos... in case I get into an accident and they need to rebuild my face.

weavis 04-11-2015 10:29

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Europe is not cheap. Some places in Europe are cheaper than other places in Europe but in general, overall its on a parallel to the USA.

I had one filling and an extraction in Florida 4 years ago and it was $600. 16 minutes tops.

I just paid $40 for descaling here in South England.

I believe Dockhead will be paying close to or over $30K a year for his mooring in the Hamble area.
An average 'cheap' starter home here is from $400K
Rents for a 3 bedroom houses start at $1K a month.
Food is expensive.
Riding the bus here is double what it costs in Wales.
Alcohol is expensive.
Rates (taxes) on houses is expensive.
Gasoline is unbelievable.

I need $38K just to cover my basic costs per year, house, car, food, utilities etc AND I will pay tax on that figure. Stick a boat in the mix and then add more thousands to the yearly cost.:facepalm:

Remember that I am single. The cost will rise for two about 50%

Many people dont earn that much and have to share.

Its not cheap most places.

For the record, my medical insurance in the States for PRACTICE in California including malpractice made me stop doing certain procedures and tests.

My dentist here says it costs him $560 an hour per chair to operate, and that is before profit.

ShaktiGurl 04-11-2015 11:14

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
To be accurate though, if your good insurance is like my good insurance, they negotiated that bill by 50% and since it is preventative, it cost $0 out of pocket.
But any major dental work will cost and there is something like a $1500 cap on all dental benefits.

It's benefit/health insurance sign-up season and it's nearly as confusing as tax season.

LakeSuperior 04-11-2015 11:57

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Talking with the bartender in Norway 4 years ago. He claimed to be making $130,000 per year. The reason I believe him was that a beer was $13.00. And, it was not a high end high volume pub.

Boatguy30 04-11-2015 12:14

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I know a guy owns a sailing school as a retirement business in Chicago. They have like 15 boats, must cost him a fortune to run the place. I'm sure there is some profit, but a lot of "wheel spinning"

I was talking with him and he asked what I was doing. I'm 37 and people really don't understand when I say I'm mostly retired. They all assume I was in software or dot.com or whatnot. Nope, just working on boats, living cheap, some real estate investing.

My wife even has gone back to work part time after 8 years, really got it made now.

It would cost me a fortune to go "back to work" and I figure with most folks under 50 having like almost no retirement savings. Something's gotta give somewhere.

Boatguy30 04-11-2015 12:22

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
There are probably plenty of bar tenders making 100K plus in many cities in the U.S.

Boatguy30 04-11-2015 12:23

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I got on this thread cause I thought it was someone selling a bunch of boat stuff real cheap....

LakeSuperior 04-11-2015 12:38

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30 (Post 1953979)
There are probably plenty of bar tenders making 100K plus in many cities in the U.S.

You may be right but a newly minted mechanical engineer can be had for between 60 and 70K.

Prairie Chicken 04-11-2015 13:05

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
"If you're not making money, you're spending money." I don't know who coined that phrase, but it sure is true. As soon as you don't have to go to work, you can get all those things & jobs done that needed doing before, all of which cost money.

Having said that, you certainly do eliminate a lot of expenses by not working. Travel to/from work, business attire, lunches &/or coffees, parking, etc., etc.

The only safe place is at sea. You've got to cast off!
Well, as long as you don't go shopping on the web... :facepalm:

colemj 04-11-2015 16:59

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenomac (Post 1953751)
Two hundred gallons of diesel lasts us over two months on the boat

And you are the one claiming catamarans just motor all the time? We don't go through 200 gal of diesel in a year, and we are at it 365 days (and have two engines and a generator).

Mark

Kenomac 04-11-2015 17:05

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by colemj (Post 1954180)
And you are the one claiming catamarans just motor all the time? We don't go through 200 gal of diesel in a year, and we are at it 365 days (and have two engines and a generator).

Mark

Most of the diesel is used by the generator, the rest is used to motor on calm days at 6 knots. Just as soon as the wind picks up to 6 knots... the sails go up.

On our last diesel fill up, we had actually gone 60 days using only 150 gallons and covered nearly 1000 miles including three days of Force 7 to force 9 weather. We sail as much as possible. The boat only uses about 1 gallon per hour, less when motor sailing.

FYI: The cost for diesel in Italy is currently $8 USD per gallon after currency exchange. We use as little as possible, but as you've posted elsewhere... sometimes the wind isn't blowing.

colemj 04-11-2015 17:43

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
150 gallons is good for 900 miles of full motoring at your fuel usage and assuming 6kts.

So you mostly motor all the time? Or does having a sail up while motoring count as sailing?

Or is it all used up running AC on the hook 24/7?

Just trying to determine where you have it over all the catamarans...

Mark

Boatguy30 04-11-2015 17:56

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I think it is time for different debate rules. Time to hide from reality and attack the media!

Kenomac 04-11-2015 18:25

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Back on topic....

We live on the hook 6 months of the year in the Med for roughly 10 euros per day plus the cost of diesel. At home here in Whoville, MA USA, I'm finding the prices of many everyday services to be ridiculous relative to the necessity/enjoyment factor, such as $270 for a dental cleaning performed by a hygienist.

Seems like much of the money we make ends up going directly to the cost of going to and from work, auto insurance, health insurance, auto repairs etc. .. Costs which we don't have whilst cruising.

Maybe it's time to retire?

carstenb 05-11-2015 01:13

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
The biggest problem with just opting-out and leaving is what happens when retirement age (65+) comes around.

Years ago I was telling people here in Denmark that when we reached retirement age there would be no (or little) social security for us (Denmark as some of you may know calims to be a cradle to grave social state).

Everyone laughed and said I was nuts. Well it is now 35 years later and guess what - Danish social security is paying out leas and less each year and I would hate to have to exist on what I could get.


The problem is worse in other countries.

So what do you do to insure your old age if you jump off the merry-go-round at a young age?

I don't have an answer and I agree that going to work, paying taxes and expenses associated with living on land means you don't have much left out of your paycheck.

Just for information - Danish personal tax is 56% (highest rate kicks in at about $60k) + 8% flat tax of all income. Add to that realestate tax and 25% VAT and uncounted duties, single point taxes on many goods and you can see the reality here in Denmark.

Of course we do have "free" medical care and "free" universties where our students get paid a salary to study

I could keep ranting but I'm getting depressed:peace:

weavis 05-11-2015 01:57

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by carstenb (Post 1954384)
The biggest problem with just opting-out and leaving is what happens when retirement age (65+) comes around.

Years ago I was telling people here in Denmark that when we reached retirement age there would be no (or little) social security for us (Denmark as some of you may know calims to be a cradle to grave social state).

Everyone laughed and said I was nuts. Well it is now 35 years later and guess what - Danish social security is paying out leas and less each year and I would hate to have to exist on what I could get.


The problem is worse in other countries.

So what do you do to insure your old age if you jump off the merry-go-round at a young age?

I don't have an answer and I agree that going to work, paying taxes and expenses associated with living on land means you don't have much left out of your paycheck.

Just for information - Danish personal tax is 56% (highest rate kicks in at about $60k) + 8% flat tax of all income. Add to that realestate tax and 25% VAT and uncounted duties, single point taxes on many goods and you can see the reality here in Denmark.

Of course we do have "free" medical care and "free" universties where our students get paid a salary to study

I could keep ranting but I'm getting depressed:peace:

Poor Carsten....... Watch this and be cheered up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCQ24gXfRrc

lonesoldier0408 05-11-2015 02:23

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Thanks, they do grow so very fast, from this end of the hour glass.


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lonesoldier0408 05-11-2015 02:30

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Before the heart valve problems etc... It was work, home, and little to no savings. Now that I'm physically broken, I'm less financially broke. The difference is fuel consumption and certain taxes.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Boatguy30 05-11-2015 05:00

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I'm confused by his post, seems like he should have gotten the F*** out of there 35 years ago.

I guess he must be a big time tax cheat to have been able to buy a yacht what with all the oppressive taxation taking all the spare income over the last 35 years:)

But most importantly, what does a dental cleaning cost?

carstenb 05-11-2015 06:10

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30 (Post 1954450)
I'm confused by his post, seems like he should have gotten the F*** out of there 35 years ago.

I guess he must be a big time tax cheat to have been able to buy a yacht what with all the oppressive taxation taking all the spare income over the last 35 years:)

But most importantly, what does a dental cleaning cost?

I did get out several times (lived in the US and the Netherlands). As a result I was able to earn a fair amount of money at reasonable tax rates (all very legal by the way).

Just had my teeth cleaned - DKR 300 (roughly 40 USD):biggrin:(note the shining teeth)

Boatguy30 05-11-2015 06:18

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
While the salary to attend college seems a bit much, investing in the future generation seems to be a better plan then spending over 1/2 your money on wars and new hips for 90 y/o like we do here.

Boatguy30 05-11-2015 06:19

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Of course, then they get Viagra at full retail price once the hip is back in shape.

carstenb 05-11-2015 06:51

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Back on topic

Why do things cost so much? It is just part of functioning and being part of the society.

Some bail out and go sailing - some bail out and go live in the mountains. Amounts to the same thing

You can also do some of this within land-based society.
1- Rent an apartment with as many sq. feet as your boat
2- buy a bicycle and not a car
3- grow you own spices in the windowsill
4- buy meats etc in huge portions when on sale and pressure cook and can
5- etc

It won't get you quite as far down but close and if you figure in boat repair, I'll bet you can live on the same (say $3000 per month or less)

LakeSuperior 05-11-2015 07:08

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
A 50 lb bag of rice is 60 bucks. That will keep anyone going for a few months.

Kenomac 05-11-2015 07:26

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by carstenb (Post 1954505)
Back on topic

Why do things cost so much? It is just part of functioning and being part of the society.

Some bail out and go sailing - some bail out and go live in the mountains. Amounts to the same thing

You can also do some of this within land-based society.
1- Rent an apartment with as many sq. feet as your boat
2- buy a bicycle and not a car
3- grow you own spices in the windowsill
4- buy meats etc in huge portions when on sale and pressure cook and can
5- etc

It won't get you quite as far down but close and if you figure in boat repair, I'll bet you can live on the same (say $300 per month or less)

I'm going deer hunting up in Maine later today for a few days. $114 for a hunting license, plus $15 to the sports store to tag the deer and $85 to the butcher shop if needed. $3 for the sabot slug.

I ride a bicycle over 5000 miles per year, but it's kinda difficult to get to work on one December through April when I get out at midnight 15 miles away from home.

We own a condo that's located in a commercial office building we own and operate as a business.

Doing all the right things, but.... It still ain't cheap. Mostly, the cash gets eaten up by high insurance costs which total over $53,000 for medical, property, property tax and auto ($35,000 medical, $15,000 property tax, $2,000 property insurance, $1,200 auto insurance)

Auto repairs always seem to hit when we just get ahead of the game. Most of the time, I drive a 13 year old Dodge Neon... Not exactly a luxury car. Last week, the rear brake pads fell off; I didn't even know that could happen. Cost me half a nights wage to get it fixed. Drove home like Fred Fintstone.

jwing 05-11-2015 09:08

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
I'm not one of the cool kids so I don't understand the term "pajama people.' Who are they and why are they called pajama people?

jongleur 05-11-2015 10:10

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior (Post 1954517)
A 50 lb bag of rice is 60 bucks. That will keep anyone going for a few months.

'Til it ruins your teeth...

Kenomac 05-11-2015 10:29

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jwing (Post 1954607)
I'm not one of the cool kids so I don't understand the term "pajama people.' Who are they and why are they called pajama people?

The "pajama people" infest the inner city no income housing apartments, walking around in their pajamas all day, EBT card in one hand, Free Obama cell phone in the other on their way to either Walmart or the closest ATM machine.

Most have never worked a day in their life... basically retired at age 15 and financed by US government handouts and selling drugs. Heroin is the local drug of first choice.

Mike OReilly 05-11-2015 10:29

Re: Stupid, Ridiculous Prices for Stuff
 
Yes carstenb, sure sucks to live in Denmark which consistently scores in the top five in various international economic/social/health/lifestyle analysis:facepalm:. However, I do agree with you that relying on our various national pension plans to support a wealthy, or even comfortable retirement, is probably folly.

I agree that it is possible to live a frugal lifestyle in a rich country, but it is a lot more difficult compared to living in a less-wealthy location. Its the nature of capitalist economies. Prices are largely set, not by any inherent value in the item or service, but by how much people are willing to pay. Those with lots can pay lots. Those with little can only pay a little. Go where people pay little.


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