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ruby tuesday 26-06-2015 12:34

best asymetric sails for cruising
 
i know - i own a racing yacht of 32feet or so but am finding that i'm sailing solo more and more :)

the boat is really easy to sail despite the winches being in "the wrong places" but i'm looking into getting an asymmetric kite for her.

i've got symmetric ones and use a pole with them without problems - mainly cos i got a raymarine wheel pilot. i've spoken to a few sailmakers but cos the boat was designed and set up symmetric and pole no one is sure of what exactly is needed - do i go with a furling system ? and do i still need sheets and guys or just sheets ? i'm asuming that the rest of the gear needed is just the same as whats already on board.

i've done some extended passages and my number 5 kite is the one that gets used most often and copes really well in winds upto force 7. with my boat being an inshore/offshore racing machine she handles being sailed shorthanded really well but you've got to keep your wits about you and sail by the seat of your pants sometimes :)

just looking for a few ideas on how to rig the 'A' kite too cos there is nowhere to put a furling system as there's no bow roller and the twin groove tuff luff forestay sits right in the bow.

any help would be most appreciated :) thanks in advance :)

hoppy 26-06-2015 13:12

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
Get a selden bowsprit or similar

https://41.media.tumblr.com/37ccfbb12...dcro1_1280.jpg

No need for guys, just sheets. I have a barberhauler (or whatever the correct name is) rigged up on each sheet.

ruby tuesday 26-06-2015 14:31

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
what is that sprit like in terms of strength ? does it attach to the deck ? or is it removable ? - just not seen one like that before - and have you any ideas about the price of one please ?

2 less ropes to deal with :) my doggy will love me for clearing the "pit" a bit more :)

like most race boats when in use you never go downstairs - you will have an accident - cos it's just a mess of sails / halyards and other associated control lines -- my rig is adjustable in near as damn every department :)

barnakiel 26-06-2015 16:24

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
Build or buy a short (2 max 3ft) sprit. Furl from spinnaker halyard. One kit will serve both your Zero and the first A reacher if you build them to length.

A VOR/IMOCA/Mini styled outrigger may add another level of usability to your A reacher, if your boat is "too" narow.

b.

Stumble 26-06-2015 17:52

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ruby tuesday (Post 1856487)
what is that sprit like in terms of strength ? does it attach to the deck ? or is it removable ? - just not seen one like that before - and have you any ideas about the price of one please ?

2 less ropes to deal with :) my doggy will love me for clearing the "pit" a bit more :)

like most race boats when in use you never go downstairs - you will have an accident - cos it's just a mess of sails / halyards and other associated control lines -- my rig is adjustable in near as damn every department :)

Depends on which you go with. They are typically specced to fly everything short of Code sails. Using a code will require adding a bob-stay. Generally they are removable, and the only heavily loaded part is the point right at the bow that is being lifted by the sail. A large backing plate is highly recommended.

Price as always depends on size. But somewhere between $500 and $1200 for aluminium, double that for carbon. I would recommend the Selden, but there are others.

hoppy 26-06-2015 21:39

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ruby tuesday (Post 1856487)
what is that sprit like in terms of strength ? does it attach to the deck ? or is it removable ? - just not seen one like that before - and have you any ideas about the price of one please ?

2 less ropes to deal with :) my doggy will love me for clearing the "pit" a bit more :)

like most race boats when in use you never go downstairs - you will have an accident - cos it's just a mess of sails / halyards and other associated control lines -- my rig is adjustable in near as damn every department :)

This is your lucky day ;) I'm selling it
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...le-148100.html

I've bought a new anchor that does not fit my roller, so I have bought a fixed bowsprit with integrated roller. I am also bit fed up with the hassle of setting it up underway as it blocks my anchor locker and I tend to sail from anchorage to anchorage.

Unfortunately I have to admit that the diameter is slightly oversized for my boat, which is fine, but for your boat it's overkill :(

Here's a link with sizing details Gennaker bowsprits : Seldén Mast AB

It's not designed for a code 0 but everything else is ok. I have something similar to North's G0 in nylon.

ruby tuesday 26-06-2015 23:43

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
looks like a really good option and price isnt too bad either :) 87mm is not actually overkill if you were to see the diameter of my spin pole which is roughly the same -- just a query on the mounting bracket - that does not look substantial enough JMO :)

payday is the middle of next month so am gunna have to sit on my hands and hope its still available - what is postage likely to be given that i live in northern blighty ?

also gunna have a few words with steve goacher when i'm in the lakes later on about sails for her.

ruby tuesday 26-06-2015 23:50

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
thank you Stumble :)

was thinking of rigging the 'A' kite for heavy weather and cruel seas so that i didnt end up getting too wet ;) so what you've said makes sense :)

i have a full height symmetric - top of the mast to the deck in terms of length - for really light winds so a code 0 probably wouldnt be considered. it's the number 3 and 5 'S' kites that i'm looking to not replace but add another option to the sail locker :)

oh and in case anyone is wondering - my boat is 7 years old, yes i got her brand new and she cost a fortune but i earn less than 20k a year - so doing this is a challenge. it's also the reason she's moored where she is.

hoppy 27-06-2015 00:08

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ruby tuesday (Post 1856678)
looks like a really good option and price isnt too bad either :) 87mm is not actually overkill if you were to see the diameter of my spin pole which is roughly the same -- just a query on the mounting bracket - that does not look substantial enough JMO :)

payday is the middle of next month so am gunna have to sit on my hands and hope its still available - what is postage likely to be given that i live in northern blighty ?

also gunna have a few words with steve goacher when i'm in the lakes later on about sails for her.

It doesn't hurt to go oversized and it would allow you to perhaps go for a longer USL.

You will need to buy seldens deck mount from the sounds of it.

The mount bracket has been fine and I've used a lot of halyard tension for my sail

No idea on shipping. If when you get paid you are still interested we can try to work out the cost.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

ruby tuesday 27-06-2015 05:38

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
thanks Hoppy :)

had a few words with steve goacher and he's given me a scooper from a Hunter Horizon 27 - he said that cos my rig has both masthead and fractional kites (they built the rig to cover most people's thoughts at the time plus its fun picking halyards in the dark :whistling: )

so am gunna try this scooper and use the wire tail thats on the tack to anchor it to the deck and just see what happens cos am going for a quiet night on the sea later.

Then there's the cost factor too -- a number 3 and a number 5 'A' kite is gunna cost around £8k inc vat (free shipping though :wink: ) so am gunna have a play and see what transpires before i make the jump and start making adjustments and stuff.




as a side note i had a look on the Ancasta website a while back and there's a Ker 33 IRC spec. comes with a sprit built in and although it would mean stripping ruby tuesday of everything to leave her as she was it would mean that i wouldn't need to order new sails :smile: also i could spec the mast for both fractional and masthead kites. a suit of sails exc. kites is near 25k

barnakiel 27-06-2015 07:21

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
A sprite can be unstayed or stayed. An unstayed sprite must match the free length with pipe diameter and wall thickness. The thicker the pipe, the bigger the dia, the more you can stick it out and the more sail you can fly.

A stayed sprite will be mostly in compression so you can go with some spectra wire and a finer pipe.

You can also build your own, in carbon and epoxy, or in epoxy foam and glass, or in wood, etc.

They either retract or fold (the stayed ones can fold back).

The cost is roughly what you pay for alloy tubing and fittings where you live. On smaller boats we have used old windsurfer masts with success.

The fittings you can buy or build (laminated, or spliced, etc.). So the total cost is from zero to say a couple hundred (if you buy an of the shelf Selden unit, etc).

A homemade unit has the benefit of being made to measure but it takes some time and some experimenting to build yours. Fun project, if you like projects.

b.

ruby tuesday 27-06-2015 08:09

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
the bit thats getting to me is the "drill and reinforce".

the pathetic excuse for an anchor roller (hahahahaha) would prolly take the strain - no problems there - problem starts when it comes to reinforcing the mid and tail of the areas where the sprit would sit. the full bow section of my boat is just shelves and rails for sheets / mooring lines / fenders and sails plus a wet locker and the dehumidifier. so the plate(s) would sit in there but cos of where the pathetic excuse for an anchor locker (hahahahaha) is and the forward hatch is that plate is gunna have to be tiny.

i put my kite up and take kite down from and into a companionway hatch bag - no sprayhoods and dodgers on my boat (could use them but its not the done thing :wink: )

how big is the reinforcing plate gunna hve to be ? am trying to work out if there's space for it given the amount that goes on, on the foredeck -- it can't sit on the centre line cos of the baby stay that puts prebend in the mast and the twin groove tuff luff sits right in the bow almost on top of the sorry excuse for a bow roller --- the ground tackle is exactly what was supplied and has never been used !!!!!

ruby tuesday 27-06-2015 12:16

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
question - if i do go down the route of an external sprit and put all the plates and gubbins in the structure - is there anyone that does cheap 'A' kites ?

i'm prices that being quoted are to me silly money --- i know i've got a racing yacht and yup i should therefore by definition have major funds in the bank etc..... but this couldnt be further from the truth.

Stumble 27-06-2015 13:32

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
North direct has pretty good prices, certainly high value. There are likely cheaper places, but the ones I have seen are also noticeably poorer quality.

ruby tuesday 28-06-2015 00:36

Re: best asymetric sails for cruising
 
thank you :) i'll give them a try cos all my headsails and kites are hydes with the exception of my masthead which is a goacher


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