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-   -   Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper (https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f17/cruising-the-med-has-become-a-lot-cheaper-139698.html)

David_Old_Jersey 18-01-2015 05:52

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727542)
Just wondering, is it safe to go there?

Depends. 1 in 3 Europeans are now Muslim Fundamentalists - me too (hedging me bets :biggrin:).

On the upside its approx usd5k per person to bring folks into Europe from Syria etc. Rocket launchers are charged extra.

yeloya 18-01-2015 06:14

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
[QUOTE=goboatingnow;1727553

The primary issues are that political unity is needed for monetary union, hence the euro project will now act to force Eurozone countries together even closer , implementing shared risk mechanisms, like Eurobonds, common budgetary policy , further tax harmonisation, and the fundamental idea of fiscal transfers.

[QUOTE=goboatingnow;1727553



That's exactly the point; Implementing common solutions/policies against every countries' different priorities, needs, demography, cultural values , etc. ; I don't see it very likely.. As long as the interests are common that will work but when conflicts arise, every country will go his way; we have seen this on many occasions..

Cheers

Yeloya

Palarran 18-01-2015 06:34

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727542)
Just wondering, is it safe to go there?

That's a funny question Chris. Have you traveled much to Europe?

Once you open up your eyes to the situations we have in the States, it's hard to be afraid to walk down any other country's streets. Temper the threat of what happened in Paris to what happens in Chicago or Detroit (maybe Atlantic City?) EVERY DAY.

Polux 18-01-2015 06:43

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727542)
Just wondering, is it safe to go there?

The elections are some days from know (25). You will have time to see what is going to happen, if a continuity regarding what has been made to recover Greece or a revolution in a sense that everything is going to change and we don't really know what is going to happening.

One thing is for sure, the party that is leading on the vote intentions wants another cut on their dept of 50%. They call that renegotiating the dept. EC cannot do that since if so they would have to do the same in Portugal or Ireland or other countries that are indebted to the Euro Bank and IMF and if they would do that the market consequences would be disastrous with interests going up in an uncontrollable manner.

So it all depends in what the previewed new leader, from a left radical party, is going to do, if he sticks to his promises or if he changes of ideas. Anyway it is complicated because he has no majority and I doubt you can find any other party that accept his proposals and if he compromises there will be trouble on the streets. I would say that probably there will be trouble anyway since when 40% of the population believes that things are going to change dramatically and then if nothing happens, trouble is on the way.

But I believe that will be restricted to Athens and large towns. I would be surprised if that had any influence on the Islands.

Polux 18-01-2015 06:58

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by goboatingnow (Post 1727553)

The primary issues are that political unity is needed for monetary union, hence the euro project will now act to force Eurozone countries together even closer , implementing shared risk mechanisms, like Eurobonds, common budgetary policy , further tax harmonisation, and the fundamental idea of fiscal transfers.


Quote:

Originally Posted by yeloya (Post 1727574)
That's exactly the point; Implementing common solutions/policies against every countries' different priorities, needs, demography, cultural values , etc. ; I don't see it very likely.. As long as the interests are common that will work but when conflicts arise, every country will go his way; we have seen this on many occasions..

Cheers

Yeloya

I believe both are right and the problem is like Yeloya says even if I don't believe that EC will finish. In fact I believe goboatingnow is right and that the current problems will contribute to a faster EC integration because contrary to what Yeloya says it is of the interest of all EC countries, I mean a strong federal Europe. It is the only way to the survival of Europe as a Political and economic meaningful power and that is fundamental.

I agree with the need of Eurobonds that is a bit what happens in US regarding the different states (US as federation is the one that internationally warrants the depths of any of the states) but do do that in Europe you would have the European Parliament in control, approving the annual budget for any of the countries with the power to say no and demand revisions to comply with a number of economic factors (diminishing deficit, payment of debts and so on). That means a loss of sovereignty regarding countries that many local politicians don't want: they would not be able to win elections promising the impossible and sinking countries with the adoption of popular measures without the necessary budgetary back up.

Polux 18-01-2015 07:24

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga (Post 1727550)
EU problems are many but top one in my view is racism or religionism.

dont see how they can avoid ethnic cleansing in not too distant future.

probably will spread around as well.

I guess you don't live in Europe neither you have personal knowledge of the many European countries (that are not all alike).

On the all Europe is pretty much not religious. Many are atheists and the ones that say that they are catholic or protestants refers to that in a generic cultural way. Very few people goes to the messes on Sunday. Religious fundamentalism is a thing that is very far away in Europe.

I don't believe racism is a problem too, the real problem is lack of integration and the bigger problem comes not from Europeans but from many that immigrate to European countries. Normally those have a lot more religious believes then Europeans themselves, sometimes in a fundamentalist way.

When you decide to leave your country and go living in another country, many times demanding and changing nationality it is expected that you do accept and respect the culture of that country. If you become a French by choice it would be normal that French values and culture to become your own. That obviously has nothing with freedom of religion but it has to do with culture.

What we see particularly in Paris or London is that many that are now French or British instead of having accepted the culture of the country that had made them citizens rebel against it, keep themselves apart forming divergent groups that don't want integration but...I don't now what.... and many times with violence.

The problem of Europe is not what you say. The problem is that none of the moderated political parties have been able to deal with the problem (for many years) or many times simply acknowledge it, populations unhappy with the situation turns to the ones that promise to do something, the extreme right parties. That is the real problem as well as the lack of will of many that have immigrated to fit in and integrate.

chris4911 18-01-2015 07:33

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
I have not been to Europe, or much of anywhere yet, still planning and saving. Just looking at a map of the Mediterranean Sea, it looks like just one way in, past a lot of dangerous places. Pirates, terrorists?

dpddj 18-01-2015 07:44

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
MarkJ - you going to brave the lobster pot floats and make it as far north as Maine?

boatman61 18-01-2015 08:00

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727630)
I have not been to Europe, or much of anywhere yet, still planning and saving. Just looking at a map of the Mediterranean Sea, it looks like just one way in, past a lot of dangerous places. Pirates, terrorists?

Tell me.. TELL ME... WHERE..:jump:
I need some excitement... 70kt winds and 10 metre sea's are sooooo boring....:biggrin:

robert sailor 18-01-2015 08:08

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Immigration is the number one issue in many places in the world. Birth rates decline like crazy as soon as females are highly educated and are a driving force in the economy. In Canada for example our birth rate is 1.1 and you need around 2.6 to keep the population steady. Without immigration the country would shrink and with it the tax base and social programs.

So we bring in more people from other places to fill the gap so to speak. This has worked well for Canada over the years but our multicultural policies have not worked that well as it has delayed the integration. Some cultures refuse to assimilate and that is the same situation in Europe. Big issue!

goboatingnow 18-01-2015 08:09

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727630)
I have not been to Europe, or much of anywhere yet, still planning and saving. Just looking at a map of the Mediterranean Sea, it looks like just one way in, past a lot of dangerous places. Pirates, terrorists?


Absolutely , the pillars of Hercules still stand and tributes must be paid to the Berbers

Dave


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

chuckr 19-01-2015 01:37

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727630)
I have not been to Europe, or much of anywhere yet, still planning and saving. Just looking at a map of the Mediterranean Sea, it looks like just one way in, past a lot of dangerous places. Pirates, terrorists?


i just read your posting to my admiral. her response "he should just stay tied to the dock".

we have sailed from the azores into the med avoiding the berber pirates as they chased us up the spanish main until the kights of st john came out to engage them as we sailed over to sardinia and down to tunisia and the pirate ships. then we sailed up to corsicia and into bonifacio and went ashore where giant people chased us back to our boat and threw giant boulders at us as we sailed out but caught a few other cruisers and ate them.

as we entered rome the vandals were rampaging burning and looting at will. so we quickly departed to anzino only to be shelled and bombed by allied aircraft. not feeling safe there we high tailed to messina staits only to encounter giant whirlpools that swallow ships whole.

missing them we decided to go to albania and bounced off sea mines for weeks before escaping to dubrovnik where we left when the motor fire started coming close and headed to venice where we were safe for afew days but then on the return south we barely missed the sultans fleet as it approached ortanto.

sliding past them we made malta and the safety of the knights of st john who were preparing for the ottorman onslaught. deciding we were to old for that we slipped under the berber radar and arrived back in tunisia.

next year we will be a whole different set of problems.

i think i agree with the admiral you really need to think before you cut the docklines; it is really dangerous here.

moderators please forgive me for my sarcasim, i just could not resist. :whistling:

Brob2 19-01-2015 02:03

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by robert sailor (Post 1727647)
So we bring in more people from other places to fill the gap so to speak. This has worked well for Canada over the years but our multicultural policies have not worked that well as it has delayed the integration. Some cultures refuse to assimilate and that is the same situation in Europe. Big issue!

Disagree. Assimilation is not the problem, respect for different cultures and for the law of the country are. French, Muslim, Hindi, whatever, have co-existed in the past and can with tolerance.

hoppy 19-01-2015 02:08

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chris4911 (Post 1727630)
I have not been to Europe, or much of anywhere yet, still planning and saving. Just looking at a map of the Mediterranean Sea, it looks like just one way in, past a lot of dangerous places. Pirates, terrorists?

As someone who sails in Greece, I'm not worried about pirates or terrorists, but I am always nervous that Zeus will release the Kraken

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb2zIR2rvRQ

SwissMocha 19-01-2015 02:41

Re: Cruising the Med has become a lot cheaper
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Barra (Post 1726598)
Giddyup! Might add another year to the med cruise if this keeps up. Carib got 15% more expensive for us aussies this year and the eurozone another 10% cheaper.

Greece will never repay the loans but frankly thats just a side show to the real issues and right now with the swiss bailing on the euro peg the whole mess is beginning the inevitable unravelling.

Where this all ends is anyones guess but you can be sure there will be many more unintended consequences worldwide yet. We are in uncharted waters.

Great time to be swiss - take your francs and buy a boat in euros and come sailing in the med thats my tip!

Absolutely! My future boat just encountered a huge discount of about 16%. I love it!:smitten:


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