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Boatguy30 10-05-2014 04:45

Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Oddly, the "first interview" for the Rebel Heart saga will be done on NPR's this American life this weekend.

The intro I heard this week was a bit hard to stomach. "Cracks in the hull" Really? That's a new one. "Baby is sick" etc, etc.

"Barely time to remove the steering wheel" OH wait, that was me.....

s/v 'Faith' 10-05-2014 07:42

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
This American Life is an excellent program. I have listened to it for years....

Look forward to the interview. :thumb:

s/v 'Faith' 10-05-2014 10:18

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
It is on right now, they are doing an EXCELLENT job with the story!

One edit;

Story is over, it was the first 20 minute segment of the show. No judgement on the part of the report, mostly focused on the chain of events leading to the call to set off the EPIRB and the consequences.

The into talked about the various opinions voiced by those on the shore, and this was mentioned again at the end. Eric did a great job telling the story, and Ira (the commentator) asked good questions. I liked that he clarified that not all of us are rich, and that the boat represented the family's home and possessions.

I suspect there will be folks searching for more information on the story, if so "Welcome to Cruisers Forum".

SaltyMonkey 10-05-2014 10:26

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Crap. have to wait till tomorrow to hear online

jpsgirl96 10-05-2014 10:32

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
I thought both the show and Eric and Charlotte did a terrific job. Might not change any minds, but for those if us who are out there, it was such a clear account.
I was thinking as I listened that any one of the things that happened have happened to all of us, though perhaps one at a time. And - that SIM card sent in the mail thing? Happened to us too, though we and the phone were in the Caribbean at that moment.
Leigh

Cormorant 10-05-2014 11:25

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
The website says they'll make the episode available this Sunday, 7PM Central Time.

Call For Help | This American Life

TugTubPaul 10-05-2014 12:14

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Here is a family that just made the passage from Costa Rica to Polynesian islands..........kids and all.

SVRockstar | Our "very gradual" adventure around the world...

ka4wja 10-05-2014 12:34

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Boatguy, et al,
Thanks for the heads up, I'll have a listen this weekend....
Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy30 (Post 1537670)
Oddly, the "first interview" for the Rebel Heart saga will be done on NPR's this American life this weekend.

The intro I heard this week was a bit hard to stomach. "Cracks in the hull" Really? That's a new one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by s/v 'Faith' (Post 1537890)
Story is over, it was the first 20 minute segment of the show. No judgement on the part of the report, mostly focused on the chain of events leading to the call to set off the EPIRB and the consequences.

The into talked about the various opinions voiced by those on the shore, and this was mentioned again at the end. Eric did a great job telling the story, and Ira (the commentator) asked good questions. I liked that he clarified that not all of us are rich, and that the boat represented the family's home and possessions.

The show's "promo" says they "had 2 radios, but unsure if either was working..." This appears to be referencing their VHF radio and their Icom M-700Pro SSB (NOT a DSC radio)....
(and we know Eric had some frustrations with his Iridium 9555 over the months....so glad he had an EPIRB as well)


From just a cursory look at some postings, we can see that it is very good that they did have an EPIRB....

--- From Feb 2014...
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1471617)
I honestly haven't gotten into the electronics craze. We've put a few thousand miles on with paper charts and basic electronic instrumentation (gps, depth, ais displayed on the radio).



--- From Dec 2013....
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1404735)
Do people actually use the DSC function? I've never called anyone, never had anyone call me, and don't know anyone who's had it happen either. I've had a DSC radio for years, broadcast AIS, etc. Everyone just hails on 13 or 16.

--- From Aug 2013...
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1314388)
Just curious about this, I looked around and couldn't quite figure it out. We're here in Mexico, and then taking it a step further on the high seas, why exactly do I need to have a license from the USA to transmit?

When I hear the ham nets, at least around here, it's clear that it's primarily English speaking Americans and it's frequent to hear "If you don't have a ham license you cannot transmit."

1000 miles out to sea?

Seems kind of odd.



--- From March 2014....
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1493195)
As a guy who uses a satellite phone and has a ham/ssb onboard:

- I have the satellite phone for business because I need to make voice calls. If I didn't have that need, I doubt I'd have the phone.

- Satellite phones are flukey. I've had two times where mine has been de-activated by the billing company. When this happens it becomes a paperweight, and both times it was a paperwork error on their part. It's easy for paperwork problems to happen when traveling international by boat.

- When they work, satellite phones are the (long term) most expensive and easiest way to do email, voice, and weather.

- I'd say maybe 1/3 of the offshore boats I know have ham licenses. Those who don't have it generally have plans to get it.

- All of the popular nets I've participated in have been SSB. When you want to have a lot of people in a net, you do it with SSB. No real way around that.

If I didn't need my satellite phone for my job I'd have an SSB with a modem, and eventually study for the ham exam because why not?




--- From Nov 2013...
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1381944)
Yeah I need everything off to work my 700pro. Inverter and engine in particular.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1384452)
I have an Iridum 9555 that I bought from a retail outlet of satellitephonestore.com in San Diego. The sales guy was straight forward, but my relationship with the billing department has been rocky to say the least. I use a lot of airtime and data as it's for my job.

- Twice I've had them disconnect my SIM card from their network for no apparent reason. It only took a phone call (via a cellular number) to clear it up, but still, disconcerting for long passages.

- I've had them change my billing plan without my authorization.

- I've had them charge me for overage minutes in addition to my prepaid plan amount, even though the minutes weren't overage at all and were completely within my plan limits.

- Just recently it seems they've broken my data minutes out from my voice minutes. So my "200 minutes a month" is really "200 voice minutes + data billed at $1.01/minute".

- I use uuplus as well and have had great results with them.

Is the breakout of data and voice normal in the ~$200/month prepaid range? This is several months in a row now of getting my invoice and finding things that are either wrong or questionable.





The above confusion about communications is quite common....and this is one of the primary reasons that the GMDSS was designed as it was...to remove the "human confusion factor" from Maritime Safety Communications (and SAR operations), as well as remove / reduce the vagaries of "mother nature" (radiowave propagation), by use of:
--- 406mhz EPIRB...
--- MF/HF-DSC Signaling...(as well as VHF-DSC)
--- INMARSAT-C...

It appears in Rebel Heart's case, their EPIRB did the trick???
(not sure of all the details)



I look forward to the interview, perhaps we'll learn some more details...

Fair winds to all...

John
s/v Annie Laurie

Matt Johnson 10-05-2014 13:05

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Did they say what went wrong with the boat? Steering was mentioned before, but nothing has been detailed.

Matt

four winds 10-05-2014 13:30

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Listened to This American Life earlier today, good interview though only 20 minutes (the usual format of three stories per show with a "theme").

As to damage.... Eric said the boat was broached, mast and sails under water, and forces on the sails and rigging while righting were transferred to the hull causing failure of the hull to deck joint. He estimated an immediate inrush of water at about 70 gallons if I recall correctly. Adding that water was also coming in from an unknown source.

Water continued to come in through the deck joint as well. I suppose because of the sea state.

The steering was not mentioned in the interview unless I missed hearing it.

When the couple began to contemplate hitting the epirb Charlotte said she walked away stating she needed to use the head. In reality she didn't want to face the fact that doing so would mean the loss of sv Rebel Heart. A bit later the button was pressed and the fate of the boat was sealed and they both new it.

Next they related the wait and arrival of the airplane. And how proud they were to live somewhere where strangers would (and could) jump out an aircraft to help them.

SaltyMonkey 10-05-2014 13:33

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
wow. :popcorn: :popcorn: didn't expect this

MarkJ 10-05-2014 13:42

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
I don't know of we are allowed to comment in this thread :rolleyes: but I will and its nothing to do with Eric or his boat, but a general comment about the quote below

Quote:

Originally Posted by ka4wja (Post 1537953)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel heart
I honestly haven't gotten into the electronics craze. We've put a few thousand miles on with paper charts and basic electronic instrumentation (gps, depth, ais displayed on the radio).


I find it's weird that so many people claim the old methods are good... And so good that they dont use, or little use the modern methods.

It just seems crackers to me for anyone venturing out to spend so much time learning the sextant (as Eric did) but no time learning DSC etc.

Or, for example, so into paper charts but they don't have Google Earth images and position in real time on Google Earth cached images, and a variety of ECN options.

That "seamanship" is so important and not running into ships so important but will not buy a modern device like an AIS Transponder.

Sat phone really only for work, and would not have been brought along for weather.

The weirdest thing about this particular sinking is that Eric is quite a young man... Much younger than most of us. But steeped deeply into the old ways.

Forum threads often seem to be biased towards the old technology... The writers who use the new kit just dropping out of a discussion whenever someone says "GPS - nice toy but wait till the satellites fall out of the sky"


Mark

boatman61 10-05-2014 13:58

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Coz we're a bunch of old farts who think just pressing buttons is boring..:D
But seriously.. the nonce to use paper and the ability to DR is useful now and then..:thumb:

SaltyMonkey 10-05-2014 14:04

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by boatman61 (Post 1538001)
the nonce to use paper and the ability to DR is useful now and then

:thumb: :viking: :viking: :D :devil:

SV THIRD DAY 10-05-2014 14:07

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by four winds (Post 1537982)
Listened to This American Life earlier today, good interview though only 20 minutes (the usual format of three stories per show with a "theme").

As to damage.... Eric said the boat was broached, mast and sails under water, and forces on the sails and rigging while righting were transferred to the hull causing failure of the hull to deck joint. He estimated an immediate inrush of water at about 70 gallons if I recall correctly. Adding that water was also coming in from an unknown source.

Water continued to come in through the deck joint as well. I suppose because of the sea state.

The steering was not mentioned in the interview unless I missed hearing it.

When the couple began to contemplate hitting the epirb Charlotte said she walked away stating she needed to use the head. In reality she didn't want to face the fact that doing so would mean the loss of sv Rebel Heart. A bit later the button was pressed and the fate of the boat was sealed and they both new it.

Next they related the wait and arrival of the airplane. And how proud they were to live somewhere where strangers would (and could) jump out an aircraft to help them.


Man oh Man...
If I had a dollar for every time someone in the past Rebel Heart threads questioned the abandoning of the boat without all the information...

Lesson learned...wait until the facts are out before passing judgement and pontificating, but you and I both know people won't remember this lesson the next time something happens either.:banghead:

onestepcsy37 10-05-2014 14:30

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
excellent show. not at all biased as i expected it to be. moderator never questioned their judgement.

heard eric and charlotte for the first time. thought they gave an excellent account of what happened and why they made their decisions.

and i don't think it was too much to spend a couple of hundred thousand dollars rescuing four live americans in trouble in the middle of the pacific when we're spending tens of millions of dollars looking for a boeing 777 with a couple of hundred dead people on board....

ka4wja 10-05-2014 14:45

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Just a bit of an update/clarifications....(and a bit of my "explanation" / "questions")


Quote:

Originally Posted by four winds (Post 1537982)
Listened to This American Life earlier today, good interview though only 20 minutes (the usual format of three stories per show with a "theme").

As to damage.... Eric said the boat was broached, mast and sails under water, and forces on the sails and rigging while righting were transferred to the hull causing failure of the hull to deck joint. He estimated an immediate inrush of water at about 70 gallons if I recall correctly. Adding that water was also coming in from an unknown source.
Four winds, a clarification here....
Eric said he estimated about 60 - 70 gallons per day (per 24 hour period) was entering thru the hull-deck joint, and "some" coming in thru an unknown location...
He also mentioned that "where" this water was coming in (starboard aft quarter) was near the radio/antenna connections [I assume their Icom AT-130 tuner and associated wiring/connections) and the battery compartment, so they were not sure if their radio would still work...
(Turns out it was working, but nobody within range was listening)


Water continued to come in through the deck joint as well. I suppose because of the sea state.

The steering was not mentioned in the interview unless I missed hearing it.
You're correct, they made no mention of steering issues....


When the couple began to contemplate hitting the epirb Charlotte said she walked away stating she needed to use the head. In reality she didn't want to face the fact that doing so would mean the loss of sv Rebel Heart. A bit later the button was pressed and the fate of the boat was sealed and they both new it.
A detail that I did not know was that they initially contacted their own doctor (pediatrician?) via their Iridium sat phone, and discussed medical issues regarding their young daughter Lira (13 months old?), ...and he advised giving her Amoxicillin (which they did), but after 3 days, she was not responding favorably...
And, then (at that "3-days of anti-biotic treatment" point) they called the USCG RCC via their Iridium sat phone, to further discuss their daughter's medical problems and the USCG medical officer (?) said that they (USCG) will discuss this medical issue with their doctors further...and they asked them to keep their sat phone ON, and to expect a call back with details...

At this point, Eric said that their sat phone stopped working....he had "SIM Card Error" and could not connect....
So, they had no sat comms...
[They found out AFTER returning home to California, that their sat comm service provider had "changed out" SIM Cards, and had sent them a new SIM Card (via snail-mail) at approx. the time they had departed / within a few days of their departure....and their old SIM was "deactivated' while they were out at sea....]

He then mentioned that he then attempted to raise someone on the "long range radio" [an Icom M-700prp], by "calling Pan Pan, on the distress frequency", but could not get any response...
[I'm not certain what frequency he used, but even though he was aware that the USCG was no longer monitoring 2182 (he commented in that thread last summer), in the interview he said that he tried to call for help by "calling Pan Pan on the distress frequency" (or emergency frequency)...as can w assume he was calling on 2182?? Or was he trying to raise the USCG on 8291, 12290???]
I'm not sure whether he even attempted a VHF and/or a VHF-DSC call....as he did not mention that....(but his confusion about DSC, posted here on this Forum, might point us to make some conclusions...)

It was at this point that they discussed activating their EPIRB....and activating this EPIRB is what set in-motion the rescue that most probably saved their daughter's life...


It was sometime later (a day or so??) that they "heard static on the radio (their VHF radio)....that they thought was dead", this was the USCG aircraft calling....and then they heard a big, loud C-130 buzzing them....and then dropping a big package (which was a "Zodiac" with outboard) and four guys (all by parachute)


Next they related the wait and arrival of the airplane. And how proud they were to live somewhere where strangers would (and could) jump out an aircraft to help them.



I hope these clarifications help...(and make note that I'm not editorializing, just providing some facts and clarifications...)


Fair winds to all..

John
s/v Annie Laurie

Kenomac 10-05-2014 15:39

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
'Sounds like... if I decide to waste some time on Sunday listening to the RH interview, there's no doubt in my mind that I'll first need to roll up my pants or have on some shorts before it begins.

Viking Sailor 10-05-2014 15:47

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Ok, I think that here is one lesson we can learn: Every cruiser with HF communications equipment should know that in an emergency, if they can't make contact on the SSB emergency frequencies, they should try making contact on Ham frequencies even if they don't have a Ham license. These cruisers should check the 20 meter Ham band between 14300 and 14350 kHz. Particularly they should try 14313 kHz which is in use almost 24/7 as an emergency traffic net.

Paul
we6p

europaflyer 10-05-2014 16:18

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by four winds (Post 1537982)
As to damage.... Eric said the boat was broached, mast and sails under water, and forces on the sails and rigging while righting were transferred to the hull causing failure of the hull to deck joint. He estimated an immediate inrush of water at about 70 gallons if I recall correctly. Adding that water was also coming in from an unknown source.

Water continued to come in through the deck joint as well. I suppose because of the sea state.

Blimey, on a Hans Christian. That's rough. That blows most of the 'why did they abandon' guff we've heard straight out of the window.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ (Post 1537995)
It just seems crackers to me for anyone venturing out to spend so much time learning the sextant (as Eric did) but no time learning DSC etc.

What's there to 'learn' about DSC? He had it, I'm sure he knew how to use it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ (Post 1537995)
Or, for example, so into paper charts but they don't have Google Earth images and position in real time on Google Earth cached images, and a variety of ECN options.

You're really suggesting that not plotting his position in Google Earth was a failing? Who does that?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ (Post 1537995)
That "seamanship" is so important and not running into ships so important but will not buy a modern device like an AIS Transponder.

Rebel Heart was AIS equipped, and had been for some time. Records show it was functioning as they left.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ (Post 1537995)
Sat phone really only for work, and would not have been brought along for weather.

He had a satphone and apparently used it regularly. It wasn't his fault it stopped working. What's your point?

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ (Post 1537995)
The weirdest thing about this particular sinking is that Eric is quite a young man... Much younger than most of us. But steeped deeply into the old ways.

Forum threads often seem to be biased towards the old technology... The writers who use the new kit just dropping out of a discussion whenever someone says "GPS - nice toy but wait till the satellites fall out of the sky"

That doesn't really sound like Eric, anything but. They had VHF/DSC, GPS, AIS, SSB, Satphone, laptop, EPIRB... how much more tech do you think they should have had?! Bet they wished they had spent the money on some glassfibre and resin to do the hull deck joint rather than on that AIS unit... or a spare rudder cable (just a guess...) rather than a spare VHF, etc etc.

Maybe some are 'biased towards the old technology' - but if this means spending money on making the boat seaworthy at the expense of a few electronic gizmos then I'm happy with that. Or teaching your crew proper seamanship rather than how to punch buttons on the DSC which, really, isn't that important. Tech is great, it can be a real help, but it's only useful on a boat which is still afloat.

I haven't previously felt the need to comment on a Rebel Heart thread, but now we know some of the details and you're still attacking him for who knows what reason I really felt moved to. I just don't see your point.

Kenomac 10-05-2014 16:39

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by europaflyer (Post 1538085)

I haven't previously felt the need to comment on a Rebel Heart thread, but now we know some of the details and you're still attacking him for who knows what reason I really felt moved to. I just don't see your point.

Wow.... they must be the luckiest people in the whole universe. I know if our Oyster got knocked on it's side, my wife and I would surely be banged up and probably seriously injured. The RH group... no mention of injuries.

I'm lactose and BS intolerant.

ka4wja 10-05-2014 16:46

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Yep, Paul, this is great advice!!!
1) But, it's 14.300mhz that's in use almost 24/7....
NOBODY should recommend 14.313!!!
Quote:

Originally Posted by Viking Sailor (Post 1538071)
Ok, I think that here is one lesson we can learn: Every cruiser with HF communications equipment should know that in an emergency, if they can't make contact on the SSB emergency frequencies, they should try making contact on Ham frequencies even if they don't have a Ham license. These cruisers should check the 20 meter Ham band between 14300 and 14350 kHz. Particularly they should try 14313 kHz which is in use almost 24/7 as an emergency traffic net.

There is the Intercon Net, MMSN, and the Pacific Seafarer's Net...all on 14.300mhz....
14300.net

The BEST 20-Meter Net Going! | A member of the 14.300 mHz net family.
1100z - 1600z

Maritime Mobile Service Network
1600z - 0200z

Welcome to the Pacific seafarer's net | Pacific seafarer's net
0300z - 0500z


The dedicated folks that run these nets above, are a far cry from the lids on 14.313....the operators on 14.313 are not just an embarrassment to ham radio, but to most of humanity!

Please do not click on these sites, unless you wish to be disgusted...
A word from the ARRL regarding HF enforcement on 14313 et al. : amateurradio
THE 14.313 MHz LID PAGE
14.313 MHz and Company




2) And, FYI....
The Maritime GMDSS Distress / Calling freqs are:

Voice: 2182khz; 4125khz; 6215khz; 8291khz; 12290khz; 16420khz...

DSC: 2187.5khz; 4207.5khz; 6213khz; 8414.5khz; 12577khz; 16804.5khz

Quote:

Effective 01 August, 2013, the U. S. Coast Guard terminated its radio guard of the international voice distress, safety and calling frequency 2182 kHz and the international digital selective calling (DSC) distress and safety frequency 2187.5 kHz. Additionally, marine information and weather broadcasts transmitted on 2670 kHz will terminate concurrently.


NBDP (SITOR): 4210khz; 6314khz; 8416.5khz; 12579khz; 16806.5khz; 19680.5khz; 22376khz; 26100.5khz;


Here is the USCG Calling/Distress Freq page...
DSC DISTRESS





All above is just for information/clarifications...

Fair winds...


John
s/v Annie Laurie






europaflyer 10-05-2014 16:50

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenomac (Post 1538093)
Wow.... they must be the luckiest people in the whole universe. I know if our Oyster got knocked on it's side, my wife and I would surely be banged up and probably seriously injured. The RH group... no mention of injuries.

I'm lactose and BS intolerant.

You're saying they made up the knockdown?

ka4wja 10-05-2014 17:10

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Europaflyer,
Some clarifications for you....


Quote:

Originally Posted by europaflyer (Post 1538085)
What's there to 'learn' about DSC? He had it, I'm sure he knew how to use it.
a) They did NOT have Mf/HF-DSC, as their "SSB radio" was an Icom M-700Pro...
b) They did have a VHF-DSC radio, but had never used the DSC functions (as of March of 2014), and I'm assuming they did not have either a MMSI#, nor had it programmed into it (hence the DSC functions would not work)....and probably did NOT have GPS inputed to the VHF-DSC radio (without an MMSI#, it wasn't going to work in any case...)

I assume these two things above, are what Mark was referring to...



That doesn't really sound like Eric, anything but. They had VHF/DSC, GPS, AIS, SSB, Satphone, laptop, EPIRB... how much more tech do you think they should have had?!
I cannot speak for Mark....but if you ask me....
I think not understanding how DSC works, nor the how's/why's of MF/HF-DSC, etc. are a valid point to make....
(please understand again, I'm NOT being critical here, and am making NO judgments....just providing clarifications...)

Or teaching your crew proper seamanship rather than how to punch buttons on the DSC which, really, isn't that important. Tech is great, it can be a real help, but it's only useful on a boat which is still afloat.
Yes, this is a VERY good point....
But possibly the facts that they were not sinking and did have plenty of electrical power, and a few days passed between the time they called their pediatrician, and they called the USCG (both via their sat phone), some may wonder "what if's".....

Now in my mind, 20/20 hindsight, especially that spouted off on the internet, is....well it's a bit rude....but hey, every is entitled to express their opinions!!
So, maybe just take it all in....but not too seriously!! :)



Fair winds...

John
s/v Annie Laurie

Kenomac 10-05-2014 17:13

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by europaflyer (Post 1538101)
You're saying they made up the knockdown?

I'm saying... my wife and I had a backyard organic garden for over 10 years. I can recognize B.S. when I smell it.

Viking Sailor 10-05-2014 17:17

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ka4wja (Post 1538097)
Yep, Paul, this is great advice!!!
1) But, it's 14.300mhz that's in use almost 24/7....
NOBODY should recommend 14.313!!!
There is the Intercon Net, MMSN, and the Pacific Seafarer's Net...all on 14.300mhz....
14300.net

The BEST 20-Meter Net Going! | A member of the 14.300 mHz net family.
1100z - 1600z

Maritime Mobile Service Network
1600z - 0200z

Welcome to the Pacific seafarer's net | Pacific seafarer's net
0300z - 0500z


The dedicated folks that run these nets above, are a far cry from the lids on 14.313....the operators on 14.313 are not just an embarrassment to ham radio, but to most of humanity!

Please do not click on these sites, unless you wish to be disgusted...
A word from the ARRL regarding HF enforcement on 14313 et al. : amateurradio
THE 14.313 MHz LID PAGE
14.313 MHz and Company




2) And, FYI....
The Maritime GMDSS Distress / Calling freqs are:

Voice: 2182khz; 4125khz; 6215khz; 8291khz; 12290khz; 16420khz...

DSC: 2187.5khz; 4207.5khz; 6213khz; 8414.5khz; 12577khz; 16804.5khz



NBDP (SITOR): 4210khz; 6314khz; 8416.5khz; 12579khz; 16806.5khz; 19680.5khz; 22376khz; 26100.5khz;


Here is the USCG Calling/Distress Freq page...
DSC DISTRESS





All above is just for information/clarifications...

Fair winds...


John
s/v Annie Laurie






John, You are correct. Thanks for the updated info. What Ham frequencies would you recommend for emergency communications? Maybe ordered by area and time-of-day. Thanks.

Sorry all! I was working from outdated experience and internet links.

Best regards,

Paul
we6p

four winds 10-05-2014 17:21

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
@ka4wja... Good memory you have. I believe your updates and additions are correct and I recall them as well, triggered by your statements.

It was a daily figure for water and Ira Glass mentioned they had a manual pump good for one gallon per stroke, clearing the boat in an hour or so each day. They even seemed to downplay that as a trip ender. Possibly the "inrush" I stated was from the broach, and I think he may have given a quantity on that.


Quote:

Originally Posted by ka4wja (Post 1538030)
Just a bit of an update/clarifications....(and a bit of my "explanation" / "questions")






I hope these clarifications help...(and make note that I'm not editorializing, just providing some facts and clarifications...)


Fair winds to all..

John
s/v Annie Laurie


four winds 10-05-2014 17:36

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
For what it's worth I take a man at his word (woman too) until I have a reason to believe otherwise. Therefore I feel the couple are relating the events as they happened and can't imagine how anyone could know any reason not to.

rebel heart 10-05-2014 17:57

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenomac (Post 1538120)
I'm saying... my wife and I had a backyard organic garden for over 10 years. I can recognize B.S. when I smell it.

We got broached and a subsequent larger breaking wave hit us while we were still beam to, I know the boom went in the water but I highly doubt the mast did.

We were broad reaching and our boom was 19' long, with maybe 12' of beam, so it was decently out there.

On a port tack we slept along the starboard side so there was no real people injuries. The boat was secured from missile hazards from weeks of bumpy seas prior to that.

I was actually in the companionway so fairly well braced. I held on tight, waited to get righted, then climbed over the plexiglass, clipped in, and started surveying damage.

We were dealing, I think, with where the easterly trades run into the equatorial counter current. That heaped the seas a bit and provided more than one swell direction.

Feel free to believe what you like.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Boatguy30 10-05-2014 18:03

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Certainly plenty of time has passed to craft a more perfect story. Details still seem a bit vague to me.

One thing for sure, it would have sucked with all those guys on the boat for what 4 days? For some reason I thought they were transferred to the ship not onboard Rebel Heart all those days.

Also didn't mention the crew makeup of other boat cited with young children and sizes of their boats. Almost all boats we meet crossing the pacific with very young children had a full time care giver/ crew member as well as 2 more to actually sail the yacht.

I still believe that was overall the biggest mistake.

hpeer 10-05-2014 18:16

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Rebel,

Glad to see you back.

You've had a run of luck, bad then good.

Keep the faith.

four winds 10-05-2014 18:18

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
RH, I feel for you, man.

Barely have a chance to respond to one person and the next one stands up to doubt your word.

I truly feel bad thinking about it.

s/v 'Faith' 10-05-2014 18:33

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart (Post 1538141)
We got broached and a subsequent larger breaking wave hit us while we were still beam to, I know the boom went in the water but I highly doubt the mast did.

We were broad reaching and our boom was 19' long, with maybe 12' of beam, so it was decently out there.

On a port tack we slept along the starboard side so there was no real people injuries. The boat was secured from missile hazards from weeks of bumpy seas prior to that.

I was actually in the companionway so fairly well braced. I held on tight, waited to get righted, then climbed over the plexiglass, clipped in, and started surveying damage.

We were dealing, I think, with where the easterly trades run into the equatorial counter current. That heaped the seas a bit and provided more than one swell direction.

Feel free to believe what you like.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Eric,

You did an excellent job with the interview mate, best of luck to you and your crew.

S/V Faith

onestepcsy37 10-05-2014 19:25

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
thanks for coming on this forum, eric. i listened to the public radio broadcast today. first i have to say that both you and charlotte sound exactly as i'd imagined you would. i also believe your story exactly as you told it.

there are any number of armchair sailors and monday morning quarterbacks out there who would happily tell you what you should have done and what you should have had on board. but like my dad used to say, 'never argue with an idiot; people watching might not be able to tell the difference'.

i carry less gear than you do when offshore, although in truth i've never ventured as far offshore as you have. an iridium phone and an epirb are my connections with the outside world. and as you have proven, the only really vital piece of gear was the epirb. and it worked as advertised.

i am surprised at the damage done to the boat from the broach. scary to think that a boat as well made as that should suffer hull/deck separation.

here's hoping that you two can get your lives back on track quickly. fair winds and following seas...

Andrew Troup 10-05-2014 20:13

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
I haven't followed it either, so I can only comment on how people are joining the dots as presented in this thread,

and on that basis I have to say that europaflyer's inferences

ON EDIT
and logic in general look sounder to me than MarkJ's .

rebel heart - good to have you back, sorry about your troubles.

goboatingnow 10-05-2014 20:25

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Forgive me , if I find some of this perplexing.

Firstly , there has been no mention in the blogs of a bad knockdown, mast in the water usually leaves the boat a mess. Often it causes injuries, most notably minor ones, bruises, bumps etc.

secondly the rescue boys were on board for serval days, yet the hull had separated from the deck and water was coming in. !!!!!

I have no skin in this game , but my experience is that post reconstructions of rescue events are never accurate, details are nuanced. Usually to demonstrate that the crew "had no choice" but to abandon. The boat is always the subject of the problem, the crew dynamics and mental states ( good, bad, or indifferent ) are never mentioned.

I respect Eric coming on here, its a brave thing to do. But I'm always interested in the inter crew dynamics in dramatic at-sea events. In my experience, these are far more significant then hardware failures. Its not a question of assigning blame, or scoring points, but the analysis is only useful if you can ascertain a reasonable perspective on events.


dave

colemj 10-05-2014 20:28

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by europaflyer (Post 1538085)
Blimey, on a Hans Christian. That's rough. That blows most of the 'why did they abandon' guff we've heard straight out of the window.

It seemingly also blows all of the "what makes a bluewater cruiser", "why catamarans are not ocean vessel" and "huntabentalina are not suitable ocean boats" threads straight out of the window.

Mark

minaret 10-05-2014 20:41

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by colemj (Post 1538220)
It seemingly also blows all of the "what makes a bluewater cruiser", "why catamarans are not ocean vessel" and "huntabentalina are not suitable ocean boats" threads straight out of the window.

Mark



Why? The hull/deck on the Union 36 is heavily overbuilt. The deck flange is 3/4" solid glass, the hull over 1" solid. It is bolted and then heavily glassed on the inside. If this joint failed, the event which caused that failure would have been catastrophic to a lighter built boat. This fact would seem to prove the point on those threads, rather than the opposite.


https://www.practical-sailor.com/issu...ew_5879-1.html

colemj 10-05-2014 20:52

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by minaret (Post 1538227)
Why? The hull/deck on the Union 36 is heavily overbuilt. The deck flange is 3/4" solid glass, the hull over 1" solid. It is bolted and then heavily glassed on the inside. If this joint failed, the event which caused that failure would have been catastrophic to a lighter built boat. This fact would seem to prove the point on those threads, rather than the opposite.

Ah, OK. Yes, there is a lot to be believed to reach that point. Both that the conditions to cause that happened (assuming the vessel was as sound as you say), as well as that those conditions would cause failures in the types of vessels I mentioned. It is difficult to picture our boom in the water in F5 conditions. In fact, we just did a marvelous overnight in F6 and I don't think our boom went any further than 5-10* closer to the water than upright.

Also, the conditions described, as well as a single knockdown (if that happened), has happened countless times on many boats not built to those scantlings with no structural damage. Google the internet for lightweight racing boats experiencing their mast in the water.

It is possible that other vessels may not have found themselves in that attitude in those conditions. Again, I know we would surely be lost if our mast was in the water. Are you saying that these were conditions that would capsize a multihull? Is Eric saying that?

Mark

minaret 10-05-2014 20:57

re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by colemj (Post 1538232)
Ah, OK. Yes, there is a lot to be believed to reach that point. Both that the conditions to cause that happened (assuming the vessel was as sound as you say), as well as that those conditions would cause failures in the types of vessels I mentioned. It is difficult to picture our boom in the water in F5 conditions. In fact, we just did a marvelous overnight in F6 and I don't think our boom went any further than 5-10* closer to the water than upright.

Also, the conditions described, as well as a single knockdown (if that happened), has happened countless times on many boats not built to those scantlings with no structural damage. Google the internet for lightweight racing boats experiencing their mast in the water.

It is possible that other vessels may not have found themselves in that attitude in those conditions. Again, I know we would surely be lost if our mast was in the water. Are you saying that these were conditions that would capsize a multihull? Is Eric saying that?

Mark


Dunno, Eric hasn't said anything about conditions during this knockdown. All I know is that if that joint did indeed fail, the forces involved were astronomical.


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