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-   -   Tested vs Chinese chain (https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f118/tested-vs-chinese-chain-114368.html)

aneblanc 29-10-2013 15:37

Tested vs Chinese chain
 
What is your opinion:
is it worthwhile paying 40% more for tested chain?

I can buy offshore made 3/8" grade 30 galvanized chain for CAN$2.05/ft or Crosby Spectrum 3 same size, same grade, same strength for CAN$2.85/ft.

Is the galvanizing better, is the welding better, is the chain more reliable? Or is it just the same chain and I am paying 40% more for the name?

Thanks

onestepcsy37 29-10-2013 15:45

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
if you're a weekend sailor in protected waters i might go with the chinese chain. if you're a cruiser i wouldn't try to save a dime on either my chain or my anchor. you'll spend 90% of your time at anchor and your boat and your life may depend on your ground tackle.

besides, 2.85 a foot sounds dirt cheap to me. i paid closer to 4.00 a foot for 3/8" crosby.

JonJo 30-10-2013 04:03

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
In Australia, whose $ has an almost 1:1 exchange rate with the US$, a metre of 3/8th inch Grade L, (G30) chain locally made costs $23.95 and similar quality from CMP, $21.95 per metre. Unbranded stuff, ostensibly the same spec costs $13.95/m.

if you think Crosby expensive, think Australia, and buy the Crosby product.

Whatever you think to buy - check it fits your gypsy (before you buy).

Jonathan

pbiJim 30-10-2013 04:15

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
If you do buy the cheap stuff, you might want to consider stress testing it yourself before you put it into service.

aneblanc 30-10-2013 04:38

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JonJo (Post 1377937)
In Australia, whose $ has an almost 1:1 exchange rate with the US$, a metre of 3/8th inch Grade L, (G30) chain locally made costs $23.95 and similar quality from CMP, $21.95 per metre. Unbranded stuff, ostensibly the same spec costs $13.95/m.

if you think Crosby expensive, think Australia, and buy the Crosby product.

Whatever you think to buy - check it fits your gypsy (before you buy).

Jonathan

Thanks for the replies.
Meanwhile I was checking forums and the consensus appears to go for the Crosby and that the price is good.
Regarding the gypsy my windlass is made out of one fixed pawl at the bow roller and one moving pawl mounted on a pivoting handle with another roller with a purchase of about 1:5 (guessing). So no worry for the size of the link here.
If there is space I sail out my anchor ( no engine) but the windlass is handy if the anchor is really stuck.
Cheers

onestepcsy37 30-10-2013 10:50

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
aneblanc - could you explain - or maybe post a picture - of your windlass? i'm intrigued. doesn't sound what i would usually call a windlass but may be simpler and work just as well....

JonJo 30-10-2013 14:54

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
I do recall starting a thread on short link anchor chain some 6 months ago - querying where did Americans buy chain, or who were the chain makers.

Crosby was not ever quoted as a chain maker.

The 2 mentioned were Peerless (and their various brands) and Campbells (who were not well known). Neither seem to supply direct (a common worldwide facet of the industry) but Defender, West Marine and 1st Chain are retailers.

I do wonder at the source of Crosby chain, do they make it themselves or are they merchanting for Peerless or Campbells or simply importing. It is reassuring they sell Tested chain (as this fits their quality image) - do they test it themselves - or is it tested by the supplier?

Failure of quality, branded, supply is almost non-existent, even G3 seems good enough (if sized correctly). There are anecdotal tales of imported chain failing - but difficult to decide if this is common, or the same few stories reiterated.

Jonathan

S/V Alchemy 30-10-2013 20:34

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by onestepcsy37 (Post 1377577)
if you're a weekend sailor in protected waters i might go with the chinese chain. if you're a cruiser i wouldn't try to save a dime on either my chain or my anchor. you'll spend 90% of your time at anchor and your boat and your life may depend on your ground tackle.

besides, 2.85 a foot sounds dirt cheap to me. i paid closer to 4.00 a foot for 3/8" crosby.

This. You'll not get better advice.

Sun and Moon 30-10-2013 21:39

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
What's your chain source?

aneblanc 31-10-2013 03:18

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by onestepcsy37 (Post 1378242)
aneblanc - could you explain - or maybe post a picture - of your windlass? i'm intrigued. doesn't sound what i would usually call a windlass but may be simpler and work just as well....

For me a windlass has at least 2 functions:
- stopping the chain of going out and this is adressed by a pawl at the bow roller
- multiplying your force to pull the chain in and that is adressed with a second pawl that moves back in forth to take the chain in.
The second roller with its pawl is mounted in line with the bow roller at 6' from the bow on a deck pivoted arm. The hinge is located directly in front of the deck pipe. The roller placed at about 9" from the deck on the pivoting arm. There is an extension of that arm to obtain the purchase.
When you move the handle forward the chain slips on the aft pawl and get stopped at the bow from slipping out, when you move the handle backward the chain slips under the bow pawl and gets pulled in by the aft pawl.
Because I sail the anchor out I couldn't really use a common windlass as it is too slow. This kind of windlass gets only used in case the anchor is stuck. Usually with any wind and boat speed I can get the anchor free on the last tack.
Nick Skeates designed the windlass together with the Wylo II and it is part of the plans. The Wylo II has many details that makes it so good for cruising on a low budget.

aneblanc 31-10-2013 04:34

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun and Moon (Post 1378737)
What's your chain source?

Source Atlantic

cheoah 31-10-2013 09:44

Can you be more specific about where the Crosby chain is on that site? I use their shackles, swivels, sling links exclusively but didn't know they made chain. Your site there doesn't look like a retail site, but I'm out on the farm in iPhone so it's hard to tell. Is that your retail source?

The price you listed is killer. I don't think you can get acco even in 5/16 for less than $4/ft for G4. Chain is expensive, and if the galvanizing goes, it'll just wither away in the salt water. The price differential you mentioned would make replacing poorer quality chain a bad deal.

Cheechako 31-10-2013 10:05

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
I would think some sort of testing program would be good. OTOH, it doesnt mean squat on it's own if the manufacturing process isnt controlled to the point of statistically eliminating out-of-spec chain. In other words, testing a few links doesnt mean there wont be one link ready to fail out of every 100 links!
Now if you buy from a supplier who is ISO certified, they are already testing the chain to statistically eliminate bad areas. (in theory anyway) At least they are watching things a little closer.
Chain is made by machines, machines wear, welding componants go out of spec. If they have problems while your drum of chain is being made, you will have weak links.
The only thing that will solve this is a controlled mfg environment.
Doesnt make you feel warm and fuzzy does it.....?

noelex 77 31-10-2013 11:56

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
This site is worth looking at for an independent review of chain:


Chain

Cheechako 31-10-2013 12:04

Re: Tested vs Chinese chain
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by noelex 77 (Post 1379194)
This site is worth looking at for an independent review of chain:


Chain

This is pretty interesting from that site: "..Every sample achieved the required strength for its grade but it was noticeable that every Chinese Grade 30 chain, with one exception, delivered the strength of a Grade 40. The result suggests that steels used for Grade 40, typical of constructional steels, are more readily obtainable in China than the lower carbon steel used for Grade 30."


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