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Old 14-12-2021, 11:50   #61
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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True, but beware. One can waste a lot of precious water on dishes. Some boats have a salt water tap for washing. A foot pump for fresh water instead of using pressure water can save a lot of water too.


Even with double sinks , my wife washes in a basin ( I cook she washes ) in the sink typically using about 4 litres per wash.

Showering uses 70% of our water
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Old 14-12-2021, 18:30   #62
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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Will hold off on a davit system until we figure out what best option is.

Our Saga 43 came stock (well, actually, it came without it, but 15 years later the second owner installed the stock system) with an incredible davit/arch system made by Klacko in Ontario. A friend had one made for his Bene Oceanis 45. Klacko has a LOT of production boat dimensions and can almost make it from memory (but he'll still ask for details). About $10K +/- a bunch, for a complete system. If you want pictures or details or contact info, ask.


PS -- I just wandered through the section on arches for Bene's, and there are 4 or 5 pics of my friend's boat. The Oceanis 45 with red mooring lines and a small brown dog. But I notice very few show the unique and very functional swing-arm davit in action.


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Old 14-12-2021, 19:24   #63
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

If you decide you want davits (or a motor crane, if you're towing your dinghy) this is a local supplier;


https://www.oceanmarinesystems.com/

I have their davits on our current boat, and had their motor crane on my previous. Michaei is great to deal with and wants to make sure his product is properly installed ... he'll have suggestions/plans for any boat imo.


You should assess how easy/difficult it's going to be hoisting your motor off its perch on the new boat and then transferring it to your dinghy ... and back again ... without dropping it and yourself in the water. The motor crane made all the difference for me, especially when I went to a bit bigger outboard (and got older).
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Old 14-12-2021, 20:26   #64
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

thanks guys, will check out both those systems. I like the local aspect of Ocean Marine Systems and will pay him a visit. I will be using the outboard from my lake pram that is a Yamaha 6hp which is pretty light but if it sinks, next one will have a crane. We have electric harken 50s in both helms so can help too, maybe even leave the motor on?
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Old 14-12-2021, 22:27   #65
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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maybe even leave the motor on?

I don't think you'll see many boats our size towing with the motor on. I've only done it a couple of times, short hops in calm weather between anchorages. I certainly wouldn't do it in rough conditions. You're adding about 65lb ( I had the Y 6hp too) to the back of a dinghy that won't necessarily track very well even w/o the motor. At least you've got a drop down transom which should make it a bit easier to transfer the outboard.
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Old 14-12-2021, 23:30   #66
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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Another thing outside the kitchen I mean galley, is a tender. With the self-tacking Jib, not a ton of room to store on deck while underway. I suppose will tow it and then store on deck and the marina. Will hold off on a davit system until we figure out what best option is.
If you don't mind the extra weight, windage and appearance of the davits, a RIB on davits is very convenient and practical for coastal cruising, but I won't put davits on our mono hull. We have friends that had their dinghy ripped off the davits at sea by large breaking waves so I would not put to sea with a dinghy on davits, and if we are sailing across a bay or lagoon towing the dinghy is not a big deal.

Lots of boats pull their dinghy up every night on a halyard. We hoist ours every night with a 4 part cam cleat block and tackle using the spin pole as a boom. It is an easy one-person job. We tie it to the side at deck level or in high crime areas we put it on the foredeck overnight and lock it.

We are currently on our second inflatable floor dinghy in 23 years. We currently have an Achilles. it rolls up in a tight package and gets tied to the front of the mast for passage making, keeping the stern light and clear for handline fishing, and the foredeck clear for sail handling.

The two best things about an inflatable floor dinghy are the light weight (we plane with two people and dive gear using 8hp) and the small stowage space. The worst thing for us is no "strong point" in the bow for hoisting like you would have with a RIB. (Just a glued on D ring, ours ripped off so we put a strap under the bow to hoist.) Also if you are spearfishing or collecting lobster you have to remember to bring buckets so your sharp-pointed dinner does nor poke holes in your floor.

There is no right or wrong for any of this stuff. Just different priorities and approaches. We chose a little more hassle for hoisting, but lighter and safer at sea.
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Old 17-12-2021, 17:30   #67
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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We have friends that had their dinghy ripped off the davits at sea by large breaking waves.
You hear this a lot and it makes common sense. But you wonder if it's a broad brush generalization that ignores specifics. We have an arch with the dinghy supported from it, and when rigged for travel, the dinghy is quite high. The keel is literally even with the top of the transom, and the top of the dinghy is too high to see over when standing at the helm. Is this legitimately a concern -- can a wave really reach high enough to cause that kind of damage?
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Old 18-12-2021, 05:29   #68
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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You hear this a lot and it makes common sense. But you wonder if it's a broad brush generalization that ignores specifics. We have an arch with the dinghy supported from it, and when rigged for travel, the dinghy is quite high. The keel is literally even with the top of the transom, and the top of the dinghy is too high to see over when standing at the helm. Is this legitimately a concern -- can a wave really reach high enough to cause that kind of damage?
Hi Harry,

I don't think ripping a dinghy off the davits at sea in bad weather is a serious concern in terms of the frequency of it happening. But it has happened. the Admiral and I know we are just beginners and there are many far more experienced folks than us on this forum, but we are starting out on the right road having logged over 60k NM on two Pacific crossings starting from San Diego and going as far west as Ninigo in PNG. "Stuff" (meaning incredibly bad weather) can happen without being predicted. In our many years of sailing we can only attest to one personally verified incident of an inflated dinghy being ripped off davits at sea. And what was the size and condition of the lines? We can't say. Would it ever happen to you on your boat? Probably not. However, some mono hull long distance cruisers we know deflate their dinghy and lash it on deck before long passages even if they have davits, so obviously that skews the data for boats with davits. We can say that having been through 65 knots of wind with 20 foot waves breaking over the boat on our low freeboard Grand Soleil, we would not want to have a dinghy on davits at sea on our boat, but it might be just fine for you on your boat.

Bonus quick true cruising story. We were pinned down by bad weather for weeks in Ninigo, PNG, and finally when we thought things were calming down we headed for the long and torturous unmarked eastern pass. The pass was long with twists and turns and too narrow for us to turn around in. We could not asses the sea state from the lagoon side. Midway through the pass we could see the giant breaking waves at the ocean side of the pass but it was too late. We were committed. Being an old surfer, we slowed to watch and judge the waves and then went full throttle out the end of the pass when the time seemed right. We went up and over the face of a swell that broke behind us. When we were on the face I looked back and saw minimum 10 feet between our transom and the bottom of the trough. I looked up and saw minimum 10 feet between our bow and the top of the wave. Our boat is 46' long. We barely made it over the crest at full throttle with the Yanmar turbo screaming and we probably got to about 30 degrees from vertical when we pitched over the top of the wave just as it was breaking. "Stuff" happens.

Cheers,

John
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Old 18-12-2021, 06:00   #69
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

In the tool department, maybe pack two large and small channel lock pliers. I use these for ll kinds of stuf and generally prefer them to vice grips.

Also, one of those long, narrow claw grabbers has saved my bacon with dropped small parts that invaribly settle in the deepest, narrowest crannies.

We now carry a 18v Ryobi multi-tool. Good for plunge cuts on wood and will even saw thru rusted bolts, radiator hose, ss wire & tubing. Cet a few carbide blades for it.

If you have unusual batteries (like our Odyssey Marine AGMs), using the charger made for that brand may simplify charging and reconditioning the expensive batteries.

Strobes for your PFDs. An extra recharging kit for the self-inflating PFDs.

If you don't have propane on board, but want to have a taff-rail mounted propane BBQ, Maybe construct a propane locker for the small green propane tanks usinging PVC pipe, the rubber endcaps you can buy at plumbing supply and two long hose clamps. Our locker holds e spare tanks and is mounted to a stanchion. It has a small hole drilled in the bottom facing overboard. We actually had the Coast Guard inspect it and they liked the design.

Maybe convert one of your heads to a composter. Plumb the liquids to your holding tank. This set up greatly extends pump out intervals and eliminates the joyous experience of unclogging a marine head.

No one has mentioned solar power. If the boat has it, be sure it has the correct controller for the type of batteries you have and that it is set for those batteries. You'll learn to love solar for it reduces need to charge batteries with the engine or generator.

Long cable lock for your dinghy, with a long-hasp marine padlock that fits thru the motor mounting bolts.

Good, powerful flashlite for night running around lobster and crab trap floats.

If you use and inflatable dinghy, carry a repair kit and replace the glue every few years. In this vein, carry a small, tight container of acetone or toulol for prepping the repair.

Aquaseal glue is great for sealing cuts and tears in just about any waterproof fabric. Very popular with fisherman here in Canada.

Two or three small, waterproof flashlites. Our current favorites are the small, yellow Dorcy lites available at Hamilton Marine and other stores. Bright for the size with a wide swath of light.
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Old 18-12-2021, 10:18   #70
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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One universal truth about boat galleys is the sink is always too small for washing dishes. Have a couple of large plastic wash basins for that. Wash dishes in seawater in the cockpit. Joy dishwashing soap works well in seawater. You can then rinse in freshwater down below in the micro-sink, but if you wipe them dry there really isn't all that much salt left on them when they are fully dry.
Totally agree, most double sinks are for show and too small to use. I far prefer one big sink and have replaced doubles in the past.
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Old 18-12-2021, 10:23   #71
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

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Originally Posted by sailingharry View Post
You hear this a lot and it makes common sense. But you wonder if it's a broad brush generalization that ignores specifics. We have an arch with the dinghy supported from it, and when rigged for travel, the dinghy is quite high. The keel is literally even with the top of the transom, and the top of the dinghy is too high to see over when standing at the helm. Is this legitimately a concern -- can a wave really reach high enough to cause that kind of damage?
It IS a broad brush generalization. You use your davits 95% of your cruising time because you are not crossing an ocean 98% of the time. They are super useful and make life much easier. If you worry about "dingy ripped off" then you should have stowed it instead of left it on the davits before traversing the roaring 40's....
It's a bit like saying "dont have a bimini it will be ripped off in a storm".
Use your head, you'll be fine.
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Old 18-12-2021, 14:30   #72
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

Here's a different point of view.

We have a 3.5 meter aluminum hull RIB inflatable dinghy, a little over 11 ft. Powered by a 15 hp 2 stroke. We do not now, nor have we ever had davits. At night, we hoist the the dinghy to limit biofouling, and discourage theft. It is lifted on the port side with the spinnaker halyard. In really strong winds, say over 40 kn., we leave it in the water, tied crosswise across the stern of the boat, so it rides in the lee of the mother boat.

It is ALWAYS dis-inflated and stowed on deck for passages, and not towed. We've figured out how to keep it from surfing onto the sugar scoop (3 cone series drogue), and can tow safely in fairly strong conditions, but it is better off on deck for passages.

We think we don't need davits; and, if we did, we would still stow the dinghy on the foredeck for passages. They're too ruddy expensive to risk in davits, imo.

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Old 18-12-2021, 15:53   #73
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

I think davits are a great addition for “exploring and day cruising” where you arrive at- med, Bahamas, Caribbean, US, etc. Who wants to drag a dinghy for inshore or short coastal hops. Davits are great for 90% of cruising for most. And good davits and some ratchet straps and you can leave the OB on like we do on our 2.9m RIB with 15hp. 5 min to raise, 5 min to lower.
But for sporty inshore/coastal we’ll remove OB and if offshore will stow dinghy on foredeck.
To OP- are you really going offshore multi day passages? Or mostly inshore day, short overnights? If the latter you will want davits
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Old 18-12-2021, 23:14   #74
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Re: Help me shop, new boat needs outfitting.

After re-reading the OP, I realized that they would probably not need it in the short run.
Sooner or later a cruiser is going to need something to beat and pound on.
I have a short length of railroad track, with it bolted to a piece of plywood.
It can be set down most anywhere or clamped to a board/counter/table.
You can get some cast "anvil" type thing from China, but it's not the same.
Thier's a "ring" to a chunk of track, and you're not making horseshoes.
A good bucket is nice to have for all kinds of things.
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