Affordable Power?

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by Tidjian

I would be interested in learning about these and how to DIY one. I'm pretty handy. Would you mind PM me or responding with some more information? It wouldn't hurt I don't think to have an alternative power source in the event of cloudy skies or bad weather.

Another drawback of hydro is that it only makes power when you’re moving and only appreciable power on passages where you’re moving 24/7. I think you’d be far better served focusing on solar and energy management.

I agree with A64, stay away from AGM. In addition to cost they need to have a full float charge every couple of weeks to have a respectable lifespan which you’re not going to be able to give them unless you’re plugging in at a marina with some regularity. You can design charging solutions to get them to float but on your boat that’s going to be a challenge.

[a64pilot]

Another thing, forget the electric portable cooler.
From your numbers your talking about a Peltier cooler, like the Coleman ones.
First they don’t cool very well at all, and second they are huge energy hogs compared to the cooling you get, very inefficient.
A small Dorm fridge can be had for about the same money, gets far colder and is much, much more efficient, run it off of a small pure sine wave inverter.

Some wise man here a few years ago posted something I thought significant.
He posted that refrigeration is a slippery slope, once you decide you want it, you will need significant other systems to support it.
Refrigeration is usually when people start thinking large Solar, large battery banks, generators and large externally regulated alternators, the sum of which may exceed the value of your boat just to put it into perspective.
I’m not saying do without refrigeration, I won’t, just realize the support one requires.
We have a Moderator named Sailor Chic that has done what it sounds like your wanting to do, but with a larger boat.

[Tidjian]

I looked into mini fridges like the ones you get at Costco for $120. They weren't bad on power drainage from what I saw. I think some were as low as 1.5-2 amps. I don't remember the exact specs. The reason I didn't figure one in was they're suggested not to be run in 95° heat. They also only cool to about 40° lower than ambient temperatures. I suppose it's better than nothing. I figured a cooler would be more efficient and designed for outdoor heat. Marine fridges are a fortune.

I could go without any refrigerator. It's very low on my list of things to get. It's like a if I could item. Sure it would be nice to have a cold drink or be able to keep fish for a couple days in case there's no catches. But it's not at all a necessity compared to other items.

Thank you for the advice. I'll look at those batteries.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Tidjian

I would be interested in learning about these and how to DIY one. I'm pretty handy. Would you mind PM me or responding with some more information? It wouldn't hurt I don't think to have an alternative power source in the event of cloudy skies or bad weather.

I've posted about this several times here on CF, so some searching will be useful to you.

In short, the one I did used a surplus 32 VDC tape drive motor. At the time (mid 80's) these were commonly available for small bucks. The prop was from a 6 hp Johnson o/b, obtained for free because it had a chunk out of one blade. It was mounted on a stainless shaft about a meter long and coupled with some 1/2 inch dacron double braid. A blocking diode in the circuit to avoid it drawing power when the speed dropped, and no regulation required.

If I was to do it again, I'd use a converted Fisher Paikel (sp?) pancake motor, modified to act as a low speed alternator. Lots of instructions on this on the net.

The actual usefulness of such a device will depend a lot on the boat that you end up sailing off in. The bigger and faster she is, the more useful energy you can extract with a hydrogen. If you do plan on running a radar whilst asleep, the hydro power availability might well make it feasible and sustainable.

Jim

[Tidjian]

What was the approximate size and weight of your unit just to get an idea? I'm looking at plenty of designs online. Some are as simple as using plastic spoons for the spinner and others fabricated sheet metal. I'll go browse the forums for your design.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Tidjian

What was the approximate size and weight of your unit just to get an idea? I'm looking at plenty of designs online. Some are as simple as using plastic spoons for the spinner and others fabricated sheet metal. I'll go browse the forums for your design.

The drive motor was around 5-6 inches in diameter and 10-12 inches long. Weight perhaps 5 kilos.

Jim

[sailorcherry]

I'm very pro alt energy, but in your case I'd go with a Honda genny. They are quiet, sip fuel and it's so nice knowing you can run any appliance or tool.

On a side note, not trying to rain on your parade, but are ya sure 23' is big enough for you and your travels? Personally, no way would I be looking at something so small (been there, done that) maybe a heavenly twins (old cat @26').

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Tidjian

I actually considered a small gas generator since I'll likely have an outboard motor. I won't be using it except when going in and out of port. So the stored gas on my boat will likely serve little to no use most of the time.

That's what I had planned to use my 5 hp 4 stroke 25" extra long shaft outboard for also (going in and out of port) but over the years I've used it many times to crossing the 20 miles or so of bay here to get me home on a Sunday for work on Monday.

Sometimes I motor all the way if the wind is light (under autopilot) but other times I'll run it just above idle and motor-sail. The motor allows me to point to the needed course which would sometimes be 10 to 15 degrees plus closer to the wind than sails alone and this makes a big difference over 20 miles with light winds

As far as the solar, I have a 60 watt panel lying (tied down) on my aft lazarette locker. It feeds a Windy Nation 20 Amp Controller which in turn charges my two fused 12 volt deep cell batteries I have in parallel

I don't have a fridge just ice box so this power is enough. The panel and the controller were just over $100.00. I still haven't mounted the controller. (also I have two backup $12.00 controllers one of which I used to use in my system but upgraded to the Windy Nation Controller with display and adjustable float voltage)

https://www.windynation.com/Charge-C...319?p=YzE9MTc=

The solar powers the lights, ac inverter (for the laptop, internet, phone, and fan) GPS, Depth, autopilot, etc.

[Bill Seal]

If you're going to use a Honda generator to charge your batteries, remember they only put out 8 amps at 12VDC (100 watts) so you'll have to rig up a battery charger to use all the power from the AC output.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Bill Seal

If you're going to use a Honda generator to charge your batteries, remember they only put out 8 amps at 12VDC (100 watts) so you'll have to rig up a battery charger to use all the power from the AC output.

the problem there is IIRC the 12v output on the genny is unregulated so may damage your batteries in short order.

[Bill Seal]

The 12V output is limited to 8 (EIGHT) puny little amps.
I ended up mating a Briggs motor to small automotive alternator for long term camping. (or making lots of beer runs into San Filipe to keep the van charged up)

[Tidjian]

Is there a controller or something I can use or something between the connection from the genny to the battery? Something to stop any risk of damaging the batteries. Solar panels have the controller to serve that purpose so there must be something.

I'm trying to stay away from too much power need. I'm considering a tiller pilot but having a cheaper homemade windvane as backup. Unless I manage to snag a monitor or Aries system used then I'll skip on the AP. Right now I'm looking at a couple sites which sell kits and you make it yourself for around $600-1k. Unless I find design plans I can use to make it myself entirely for free.

I'm going to definitely get the solar panels but I might just grab 2 instead. Maybe even just 1. I'm not sure. I'm looking into alternative energy all around. I could go days without sun so I'm leaning towards either getting a wind turbine ($400-1k) or trying to make a hydro electric genny. I've been finding a lot of home brewed schematics. Some a little less reliable than others.

If I can find a boat with an inboard that'd be even better because I could run that on an alternator when I need to. But if not the genny would be nice. I could run it to charge batteries or if I did get an icebox I could just run it to get the ice made then turn it off. Might have to haul a bit more fuel but again the added luxury for a few hundred bucks would be nice. I'm also thinking about when I'm there. I might not always be at a port. I could anchor off an island for a few days and being able to have a couple living luxeries goes a long way.

[Tidjian]

Hmmm...

http://www.windbluepower.com/mobile/...ode=dc-540&404

I'm just wondering if this can be used for the generator on a hydro electric system? Could use the prop off an outboard for the blade. Or possibly fabricate them from a non corrosive sheet metal. Aluminum might be too thin and unsure about plastic. Could potentially encase it in a pvc tube or simply get pvc sheeting and bend them to specific forms for casing. Basically an attempt to make a homemade W&S system.

Wondering what speed this would kick in at. Says can produce 12v at 6 mile winds or 130rpm.

Also wondering if it's worth going through all this for a hydro electric turbine. Might be less hastle and more cost effective to just buy a wind turbine. I've just heard they're noisy.

[hellosailor]

"Marine fridges are a fortune."
Ask yourself, are sailors, especially new boat buyers, all a bunch of rich idiots? Or, perhaps, is there a difference between a marine fridge and a $120 dorm fridge? Hmmmm....

Honda are the first ones to say their gensets are designed for charging 12v batteries only, and NOT AS A 12V POWER SUPPLY. There are waveform pictures on the web showing just how "dirty" that 12v power is, and that's perfectly acceptable because the Honda gensets are designed as AC gensets with an auxiliary battery charger. They're almost in a class by themselves, when it comes to running WELL for YEARS.

And when you don't have room for a huge solar installation but need to save every watt you can find? Get an MPPT controller for the panels. Name brand, not fakes from ebay. They give you about 15% more power from the solar panels, and it is simple physics, not magic. Yes, you pay more, but when you've run out of room for more panels...an MPPT controller means 4 hours of sunlight before a storm, can almost give you a "5 hour" charge. Pretty handy that way.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Tidjian

Is there a controller or something I can use or something between the connection from the genny to the battery? Something to stop any risk of damaging the batteries. Solar panels have the controller to serve that purpose so there must be something.

I'm trying to stay away from too much power need. I'm considering a tiller pilot but having a cheaper homemade windvane as backup. Unless I manage to snag a monitor or Aries system used then I'll skip on the AP. Right now I'm looking at a couple sites which sell kits and you make it yourself for around $600-1k. Unless I find design plans I can use to make it myself entirely for free.

I'm going to definitely get the solar panels but I might just grab 2 instead. Maybe even just 1. I'm not sure. I'm looking into alternative energy all around. I could go days without sun so I'm leaning towards either getting a wind turbine ($400-1k) or trying to make a hydro electric genny. I've been finding a lot of home brewed schematics. Some a little less reliable than others.

If I can find a boat with an inboard that'd be even better because I could run that on an alternator when I need to. But if not the genny would be nice. I could run it to charge batteries or if I did get an icebox I could just run it to get the ice made then turn it off. Might have to haul a bit more fuel but again the added luxury for a few hundred bucks would be nice. I'm also thinking about when I'm there. I might not always be at a port. I could anchor off an island for a few days and being able to have a couple living luxeries goes a long way.

yes there is something to charge safely off of a generator its called a battery charger. Run off of the 120v AC side. The 12v dc output on the generator is unregulated.