Tricolor considered harmful; Red over green preferred

[goboatingnow]

the common objection is that the practice of carrying two sets of navigation lights is prohibited by Colregs. It isn’t.

carrying both sets is permitted , lighting both isn’t permitted at present.

[Pandor]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

carrying both sets is permitted , lighting both isn’t permitted at present.

Exactly!

Stan, thanks for the excellent work on the study and paper. And I appreciate that you indicated some sailors might find the results controversial. But I agree that the COLREGS are very clear that a sailboat less than 20m can light either a tricolor or a standard set of lights. Your argument that duplicate sets of navigation lights are unlikely to be mistaken for other lights defined elsewhere in the rules just doesn't make sense. If it was really congested and you wanted your boat to be noticed, should we put three or four sets of lights around the boat?

Sorry, it is just one of my peeves - staring off into a set of lights at night and trying to figure out what they mean because they don't prescribe to the rules.

[goboatingnow]

I agree that allowing both sets of lights is not a good idea. It’s more likely to be misinterpreted as another boat and it would be an anomaly in the COLREGS , I don’t see the regs accepting the argument

My view is a set of all round sidelights on the mast 1 metre apart is the alternative to low side lights.

[MicHughV]

You may laugh, but when I first set out on my voyaging, I was given a beautiful pair of oil wick brass running light lenses replete with glass fresnel lens in red and green. These were quite large, easily the size of a of big loaf of bread, which I placed on teak boards attached to the lower shrouds ala ships of old.

I didn't use them all the time, but they did see quite a bit of use, when I could lay my hands on some lamp oil. They worked remarkable well, much better than the rinky dink navigational lights I had on the deck, as they were about 10' above the waterline, but I eventually fitted a tri-color light.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

carrying both sets is permitted , lighting both isn’t permitted at present.

In fact, it is a weirdly sailor-centric viewpoint.

Viewed from starboard forward, you see red over red (not under command). Viewed from astern, white over white (probably towing).

No, COLREGS specifically says you cannot show both deck level and tricolor, and that won't change.

Red over green was not commented on or discussed. A single reference, only explaining that it existed. The lack of discussion was a disappointment to me and was probably a source of laughter for the COLREGS committee. The solution to the "supposed" problem existed and the report ignored it for no specified reason.

The authors are smart guys, but not on this topic, not in this report. More like embarrassing.

[John_Trusty]

Originally Posted by stanhoney

1. The document argues that when sailing in a harbor at night with lots of traffic, it can be good seamanship to light both your masthead tricolor as well as your deck level sidelights and sternlight. It concludes that when sailing in close proximity to other boats that neither set of navigation lights solves all problems. ... The common objection is that the practice of carrying two sets of navigation lights is prohibited by Colregs. It isn’t. The configuration of the two sets of navigation lights is unlikely to be mistaken for lights defined elsewhere in the rules which would be prohibited.

Sorry, I think that you are misreading this. The document makes it clear that ColRegs do not allow running around with the masthead tri-color and deck side and stern lights illuminated. It indicates that this may be permitted on occasion to attract attention.

If you are distinguishing between "carrying" and "using" duplicated navigation lights, I fully agree that it is prudent to have a choice of which to illuminate, but not to use both at the same time.

As far as, "The configuration of the two sets of navigation lights is unlikely to be mistaken for lights defined elsewhere in the rules which would be prohibited." - if both tri-color and deck lights are illuminated, a sailboat from the port side would appear as red-over-red or Not under command, and from the stern it would be white-over-white or Towing under 200m from ahead.

[Manateeman]

Martin R gets the manatee crew to tip their hats. Excellent post.
Simple...get a strobe.
All we want on the bridge of a commercial vessel is a brief radio call and a flick of your mast head strobe.
This is not rocket science nor Admirality Law class.
Captain Mark

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by John_Trusty

Sorry, I think that you are misreading this. The document makes it clear that ColRegs do not allow running around with the masthead tri-color and deck side and stern lights illuminated. It indicates that this may be permitted on occasion to attract attention.

If you are distinguishing between "carrying" and "using" duplicated navigation lights, I fully agree that it is prudent to have a choice of which to illuminate, but not to use both at the same time.

As far as, "The configuration of the two sets of navigation lights is unlikely to be mistaken for lights defined elsewhere in the rules which would be prohibited." - if both tri-color and deck lights are illuminated, a sailboat from the port side would appear as red-over-red or Not under command, and from the stern it would be white-over-white or Towing under 200m from ahead.

The 12 or 15 metre separation of the red over red or the white over white would probably go a long way to removing any confusion.
I'm still not in favour of the idea.