Taking a 5 day Liveaboard course

[Stewie12]

My daughter and her boyfriend did a 5 day ASA course in the Canary Islands. Loved every minute of it and came away with qualifications to charter a yacht on their own. If you get the right instructor you will learn a lot.

[Macblaze]

One thing others have only noted peripherally. If you can, take the Coastal Navigation Coast at the same time. It used to be a self-study course. Some of its an absolute necessity in PNW waters, because you cant go anywhere without encountering a tidal pass...

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Macblaze

One thing others have only noted peripherally. If you can, take the Coastal Navigation Coast at the same time. It used to be a self-study course. Some of its an absolute necessity in PNW waters, because you cant go anywhere without encountering a tidal pass...

No kidding!

When I did my Advanced CYA out of Vancouver I was the source of endless amusement since I was the only Great Lakes sailor on board. GL = no tides and no currents (to speak of).

The instructor/captain would always turn to me to make the determination as to when we could sail through the various tidal passes. Good lessons for sure, although a bit stressful .

[sailorman7225]

As everyone else has said, these courses are well worth the investment. The confidence building factor is important, along with the knowledge gained. I took a similar course out of Ft. Meyers, Florida many years ago. It was not ASA but rather US Sailing Association certified.

I also took a five-day navigation course that included overnight runs from Ft. Meyers to Key West and back. I highly recommend a navigation course. I found it fun and a big confidence builder as well.

In the end I obtained Basic Keelboat, Basic Cruising, Bareboat Cruising, Coastal Passage Making and Coastal Navigation certificates. It was a great way to start.
Sailorman

[Macblaze]

Now that I am really thinking about this, I am reminded that in the end I never felt these certifications had any value in and of themselves. I really enjoyed the experiences, learned lots and ultimately couldn't give two figs if I "passed" or not — other than needing them to take a higher certification. So learn everything you can but don't sweat the pass or fail.

Frankly if you need more, hiring one of the instructors privately is just as cheap and you can make your own syllabus to learn the things you want to focus on. And, as others have pointed out, a basic course, some sea time on a similar sized boat and a credit card will get you chartering in most places.

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by kmrtraptow

Awesome Thanks! I will definitely check them out. I was planning on SimplySailing as they still have openings in late Oct and the price is relatively good

Late October around here? Pretty late in the year. You will probably have pretty miserable weather conditions. Not a great introduction to sailing.

You might want to check out something out of Victoria or Saanich. There are better wind conditions over there than around Vancouver and the fabulous cruising grounds of the Southern Gulf Islands are right at the doorstep.

Or look for an independent instructor on Saltspring or somewhere. I'd REALLY suggest doing this by the end of September (before the Equinox if possible) so your first experience isn't freezing cold and pouring rain.

[TrentePieds]

Traptow:

Others have mentioned Cooper's, and I endorse that. Cooper's took over where The JibSet left off after Les Alfreds died. I was one of the original instructors at the JibSet. And I skippered/instructed on I don't know how many "crooze'n'learn"s through "the islands", always beating up the hammerhead at Telegraph Harbour to teach the novices how to dock a 65 foot ketch under sail. So with half a century of hindsight, let me make a comment or two in the hope that it will help your perspective.

1:Learning the basic boat-handling, hands on in a rented boat, or during a local lesson, will take you all of an afternoon. You'll look rough around the edges, but you can put the polish on your technique as you gain experience. The boats we used for that basic stuff at the JibSet were Cal20s which are really only overgrown dinghies with a deck and a keel. They sell for about fifteenhunnertbux these days, i.e. for the price of a five day Crooze'n'Learn for ONE PERSON, let alone for you AND your boy. Apply common sense.

2: The paper you get (issued by CYA/CSA) after a Crooze'n'Learn is useful for chartering a boat, but why would you charter a boat if you have your own? You don't need CYA/CSA certification to sail your own boat. What you DO need is a PCOC (Pleasure Craft Operators Card) which is a Transport Canada "drivers licence" required for, and adequate for, any boat you are likely to be skippering. CYA/CSA certification is irrelevant! The PCOC course is offered by sundry agencies via the InterNet. For a fee of $40 or $60 and a moderate "success rate" on the Multiple Choice Questionnaire at the end of five sessions, I think it is, the PCOC will make you perfectly Legal! Competent is, of course, a fish or a different colour :-)!

3: Since you are in Vancouver, life is a pieceacake. From any of the marinas in Burrard inlet you can simply go out into English Bay and tool around till your boat handling doesn't look TOO ragged. If you get adventurous, stick your nose into Howe Sound. If you get REALLY adventurous circumnavigate Bowen Island! Go so far as to overnight at Keats Island. Lovely dock and park there! Used to stop there for dinner on the first night out on a C'n'L before crossing the Straits in the night.

4: Now that you are an experienced croozer, circumnavigate Gambier. Don't tell me you can't do it in a Cal 20. I've done it. Also solo to Nanaimo and return in a Cal 20.

5: When I was a Jibset Instructor (sailing out of Coal Harbour at the foot of Bidwell Street where the fancy condos are now) we were still permitted to actually sail in the harbour. That was good, since we sometimes had a "kicker" on the transom, but sometimes not. Well, NOBODY sails in and out of marinas these days, and all boats have engines of some sort, so you needn't worry about the coming and the going. The engine takes care of that for you. I'm perfectly capable of dealing with the snakey entrance to French Harbour under sail alone, but why would I be so daft when I have a perfectly good "iron wind"?

So, to sum up - though I could go on: To get an inexpensive start, don't waste your money on "courses''. They exist to make money for the schools, not to make you a sailor :-)!

Now, being able to take a 30-footer from False Creek to Ganges, or even from Read Point Marina to Ganges, and having to go though one of the passes, doesn't make you a skipper. Neither can a course offered by any of the sailing schools. Only experience IN YOUR OWN BOAT augmented by a whole lot of reading, thinking and applying what you've read, can do that.

Your main problem is going to be that of determining whether you really LIKE cruising (many don't!) or whether the desire is only a fleeting one. If you are cut out for it, there is no reason whatever that you shouldn't start out with what in that smarmy phrase is called your "forever boat". 36, 40 or even 48 feet is just fine. If you are cut out to be a sailor, a skipper and a cruiser, you will be able to handle such a boat easily. But if you are NOT so cut out, you'd have to take a major financial clout on the ear if you'd bought a boat prematurely, and you then had to either continue to feed it, or you had to dispose of it.

So we come back to the Crooze-n-Learn: Doing one will tell you if you like croozing though NOT if you take the C'n'L in the sort of weather we've had this week just gone! Choose a late autumn or early winter time slot. Make sure it's blowing at least 30 knots, so you will come to know the difference between sailing and messing about! But be aware that some instructors are good and some are bad. Being a good C'n'L instructor as well as a good skipper and boat handler is not given to all certificated instructors. Some instructors are fine so long as the winds don't blow but get all atavistic and forget how to teach when rude Boreas gets rambunctious! :-). So be prepared to be disappointed in your instructor qua instructor. Don't take a C'n'L to LEARN anything. That would be a bonus. Just take the course to see, upon your return, if you STILL think you would like to go croozing!

Bonne chance :-)!

TrentePieds

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Traptow:

Others have mentioned Cooper's, and I endorse that. Cooper's took over where The JibSet left off after Les Alfreds died. I was one of the original instructors at the JibSet. And I skippered/instructed on I don't know how many "crooze'n'learn"s through "the islands", always beating up the hammerhead at Telegraph Harbour to teach the novices how to dock a 65 foot ketch under sail. So with half a century of hindsight, let me make a comment or two in the hope that it will help your perspective.

1:Learning the basic boat-handling, hands on in a rented boat, or during a local lesson, will take you all of an afternoon. You'll look rough around the edges, but you can put the polish on your technique as you gain experience. The boats we used for that basic stuff at the JibSet were Cal20s which are really only overgrown dinghies with a deck and a keel. They sell for about fifteenhunnertbux these days, i.e. for the price of a five day Crooze'n'Learn for ONE PERSON, let alone for you AND your boy. Apply common sense.

2: The paper you get (issued by CYA/CSA) after a Crooze'n'Learn is useful for chartering a boat, but why would you charter a boat if you have your own? You don't need CYA/CSA certification to sail your own boat. What you DO need is a PCOC (Pleasure Craft Operators Card) which is a Transport Canada "drivers licence" required for, and adequate for, any boat you are likely to be skippering. CYA/CSA certification is irrelevant! The PCOC course is offered by sundry agencies via the InterNet. For a fee of $40 or $60 and a moderate "success rate" on the Multiple Choice Questionnaire at the end of five sessions, I think it is, the PCOC will make you perfectly Legal! Competent is, of course, a fish or a different colour :-)!

3: Since you are in Vancouver, life is a pieceacake. From any of the marinas in Burrard inlet you can simply go out into English Bay and tool around till your boat handling doesn't look TOO ragged. If you get adventurous, stick your nose into Howe Sound. If you get REALLY adventurous circumnavigate Bowen Island! Go so far as to overnight at Keats Island. Lovely dock and park there! Used to stop there for dinner on the first night out on a C'n'L before crossing the Straits in the night.

4: Now that you are an experienced croozer, circumnavigate Gambier. Don't tell me you can't do it in a Cal 20. I've done it. Also solo to Nanaimo and return in a Cal 20.

5: When I was a Jibset Instructor (sailing out of Coal Harbour at the foot of Bidwell Street where the fancy condos are now) we were still permitted to actually sail in the harbour. That was good, since we sometimes had a "kicker" on the transom, but sometimes not. Well, NOBODY sails in and out of marinas these days, and all boats have engines of some sort, so you needn't worry about the coming and the going. The engine takes care of that for you. I'm perfectly capable of dealing with the snakey entrance to French Harbour under sail alone, but why would I be so daft when I have a perfectly good "iron wind"?

So, to sum up - though I could go on: To get an inexpensive start, don't waste your money on "courses''. They exist to make money for the schools, not to make you a sailor :-)!

Now, being able to take a 30-footer from False Creek to Ganges, or even from Read Point Marina to Ganges, and having to go though one of the passes, doesn't make you a skipper. Neither can a course offered by any of the sailing schools. Only experience IN YOUR OWN BOAT augmented by a whole lot of reading, thinking and applying what you've read, can do that.

Your main problem is going to be that of determining whether you really LIKE cruising (many don't!) or whether the desire is only a fleeting one. If you are cut out for it, there is no reason whatever that you shouldn't start out with what in that smarmy phrase is called your "forever boat". 36, 40 or even 48 feet is just fine. If you are cut out to be a sailor, a skipper and a cruiser, you will be able to handle such a boat easily. But if you are NOT so cut out, you'd have to take a major financial clout on the ear if you'd bought a boat prematurely, and you then had to either continue to feed it, or you had to dispose of it.

So we come back to the Crooze-n-Learn: Doing one will tell you if you like croozing though NOT if you take the C'n'L in the sort of weather we've had this week just gone! Choose a late autumn or early winter time slot. Make sure it's blowing at least 30 knots, so you will come to know the difference between sailing and messing about! But be aware that some instructors are good and some are bad. Being a good C'n'L instructor as well as a good skipper and boat handler is not given to all certificated instructors. Some instructors are fine so long as the winds don't blow but get all atavistic and forget how to teach when rude Boreas gets rambunctious! :-). So be prepared to be disappointed in your instructor qua instructor. Don't take a C'n'L to LEARN anything. That would be a bonus. Just take the course to see, upon your return, if you STILL think you would like to go croozing!

Bonne chance :-)!

TrentePieds

A lot of good points here - but I'd still take the course. I was an experienced power boater (a patrolman with the federal Department of Fisheries) before I decided to take up sailing and took the CYA course in the mid-eighties. Well worth it as an introduction to sailing.

[andrewparker]

My wife and I took the Sail Canada Basic Cruising Course (2017) and the Intermediate Cruising Course (2018). Both out of Vancouver. The Intermediate course required an Intermediate Coastal Navigation course and a Maritime VHF Restricted Operator Certificate.

Before taking these courses we had no prior sailing experience other than dinghy sailing. Since taking these courses we have bareboat chartered on several occasions from Vancouver Island and in the Caribbean. Whether or not that was wise of the charter companies I'll let others decide. But as to whether or not you can bareboat charter with just these courses (and a credit card) yes you can.

We took the courses with Cooper Boating. To put it delicately we were underwhelmed by the quality of the courses and instructors and would go elsewhere next time.

[kmrtraptow]

Originally Posted by dannc

We have not done this in Vancouver but we have done the ASA 101 and 103 classes over a 6 day class. It was a HUGE amount of work to get done in that time frame. The school had a boat we could live on while we took classes on a smaller boat. This was good because it saved us travel time to a hotel and saved money. Time was precious and needed to study.

We had two, 100 question tests, plus the knot tests, and the practical tests on the boat. It was quite a bit of work and when not sailing we were practicing knots and studying the books. We would wake up in the morning, eat breakfast and start playing with knots and reading the books. It was hard work but fun.

My wife got sick towards the end of the class but she was able to pass the two written tests, most of her practicals and knots. She kicked a..ss. She went from knowing not much to only missing a few questions on each test, passed the knot tests and almost all of the practicals. We had to go back and finish the man overboard drills and one practical. She was so close to finishing. Flip side, is that to finish her class, we got more time on the boat, had a different instructor and learned a few more things even though we had already been through the evolutions.

I would highly recommend taking the classes. I "learned" sailing from my dad who "learned" on his own and from friends. ASA did not exist back then so there was no choice but to learn on your own. I learned so much more in the class than back in the day. I see how we should or could have been doing things correctly/differently back in the day...

The advantage of classes, is that you have other viewpoints on how to do things. Teaching yourself you have just one way. It might be a right way but maybe it is not. How would one know? You might have experience doing things one way, and that way might be ok, but the teacher, if they are worth their salt, and ours were/are, might know a better way or maybe just another way of doing things.

In one of my careers, I have to take continuing education every year. Some of these classes I have been taking for a quarter century. The same danged classes. Guess what. Every year I learn something new. Why? It is the same material that does not really change. How can one learn anything more? Simple. Different instructors with different ways of doing or seeing things, along with different experience, can teach even old dogs something new.

Find a school with good teachers and go for it. Just be prepared to do some hard work.

Later,
Dan

Thanks for this!

[kmrtraptow]

Wow this is awesome advice, thanks! Ideally I am a 'Go big or go home' type of person and to me it's not just about sailing and whether I like it (I'm pretty sure I will) but it's about the freedom/lifestyle/Less is more mentality as I get older (52). Ideally I would just buy an inexpensive boat and see if I could Liveaboard on the hard and spend time doing a refit so I can really understand the boat itself and learn while doing (Which is ready how I learn best anyways). I'm still in the research phase and your advice has really pushed me in a better direction. Thanks so much?

Kevin

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Traptow:

Others have mentioned Cooper's, and I endorse that. Cooper's took over where The JibSet left off after Les Alfreds died. I was one of the original instructors at the JibSet. And I skippered/instructed on I don't know how many "crooze'n'learn"s through "the islands", always beating up the hammerhead at Telegraph Harbour to teach the novices how to dock a 65 foot ketch under sail. So with half a century of hindsight, let me make a comment or two in the hope that it will help your perspective.

1:Learning the basic boat-handling, hands on in a rented boat, or during a local lesson, will take you all of an afternoon. You'll look rough around the edges, but you can put the polish on your technique as you gain experience. The boats we used for that basic stuff at the JibSet were Cal20s which are really only overgrown dinghies with a deck and a keel. They sell for about fifteenhunnertbux these days, i.e. for the price of a five day Crooze'n'Learn for ONE PERSON, let alone for you AND your boy. Apply common sense.

2: The paper you get (issued by CYA/CSA) after a Crooze'n'Learn is useful for chartering a boat, but why would you charter a boat if you have your own? You don't need CYA/CSA certification to sail your own boat. What you DO need is a PCOC (Pleasure Craft Operators Card) which is a Transport Canada "drivers licence" required for, and adequate for, any boat you are likely to be skippering. CYA/CSA certification is irrelevant! The PCOC course is offered by sundry agencies via the InterNet. For a fee of $40 or $60 and a moderate "success rate" on the Multiple Choice Questionnaire at the end of five sessions, I think it is, the PCOC will make you perfectly Legal! Competent is, of course, a fish or a different colour :-)!

3: Since you are in Vancouver, life is a pieceacake. From any of the marinas in Burrard inlet you can simply go out into English Bay and tool around till your boat handling doesn't look TOO ragged. If you get adventurous, stick your nose into Howe Sound. If you get REALLY adventurous circumnavigate Bowen Island! Go so far as to overnight at Keats Island. Lovely dock and park there! Used to stop there for dinner on the first night out on a C'n'L before crossing the Straits in the night.

4: Now that you are an experienced croozer, circumnavigate Gambier. Don't tell me you can't do it in a Cal 20. I've done it. Also solo to Nanaimo and return in a Cal 20.

5: When I was a Jibset Instructor (sailing out of Coal Harbour at the foot of Bidwell Street where the fancy condos are now) we were still permitted to actually sail in the harbour. That was good, since we sometimes had a "kicker" on the transom, but sometimes not. Well, NOBODY sails in and out of marinas these days, and all boats have engines of some sort, so you needn't worry about the coming and the going. The engine takes care of that for you. I'm perfectly capable of dealing with the snakey entrance to French Harbour under sail alone, but why would I be so daft when I have a perfectly good "iron wind"?

So, to sum up - though I could go on: To get an inexpensive start, don't waste your money on "courses''. They exist to make money for the schools, not to make you a sailor :-)!

Now, being able to take a 30-footer from False Creek to Ganges, or even from Read Point Marina to Ganges, and having to go though one of the passes, doesn't make you a skipper. Neither can a course offered by any of the sailing schools. Only experience IN YOUR OWN BOAT augmented by a whole lot of reading, thinking and applying what you've read, can do that.

Your main problem is going to be that of determining whether you really LIKE cruising (many don't!) or whether the desire is only a fleeting one. If you are cut out for it, there is no reason whatever that you shouldn't start out with what in that smarmy phrase is called your "forever boat". 36, 40 or even 48 feet is just fine. If you are cut out to be a sailor, a skipper and a cruiser, you will be able to handle such a boat easily. But if you are NOT so cut out, you'd have to take a major financial clout on the ear if you'd bought a boat prematurely, and you then had to either continue to feed it, or you had to dispose of it.

So we come back to the Crooze-n-Learn: Doing one will tell you if you like croozing though NOT if you take the C'n'L in the sort of weather we've had this week just gone! Choose a late autumn or early winter time slot. Make sure it's blowing at least 30 knots, so you will come to know the difference between sailing and messing about! But be aware that some instructors are good and some are bad. Being a good C'n'L instructor as well as a good skipper and boat handler is not given to all certificated instructors. Some instructors are fine so long as the winds don't blow but get all atavistic and forget how to teach when rude Boreas gets rambunctious! :-). So be prepared to be disappointed in your instructor qua instructor. Don't take a C'n'L to LEARN anything. That would be a bonus. Just take the course to see, upon your return, if you STILL think you would like to go croozing!

Bonne chance :-)!

TrentePieds

[kmrtraptow]

Thanks for this!

Originally Posted by andrewparker

My wife and I took the Sail Canada Basic Cruising Course (2017) and the Intermediate Cruising Course (2018). Both out of Vancouver. The Intermediate course required an Intermediate Coastal Navigation course and a Maritime VHF Restricted Operator Certificate.

Before taking these courses we had no prior sailing experience other than dinghy sailing. Since taking these courses we have bareboat chartered on several occasions from Vancouver Island and in the Caribbean. Whether or not that was wise of the charter companies I'll let others decide. But as to whether or not you can bareboat charter with just these courses (and a credit card) yes you can.

We took the courses with Cooper Boating. To put it delicately we were underwhelmed by the quality of the courses and instructors and would go elsewhere next time.

[barnakiel]

And do you get a license at the end of this course?


I think I could need one too. We have spent the last 17 years doing it all illegally. Especially the toilets fixing part and varnishing.



b.

[kmrtraptow]

Haha. I bet the maintenance is neverending just like a house lol. Probably would get a certificate which I dont really care about just the experience but maybe I can 'wing it's too and have the same journey

Originally Posted by barnakiel

And do you get a license at the end of this course?


I think I could need one too. We have spent the last 17 years doing it all illegally. Especially the toilets fixing part and varnishing.



b.

[barnakiel]

;-)


All you do that gets you on the boat, on the water and doing it, is good !


You not just get exposure and feeling for the thing but you also build relationships with people doing it, and those dreaming of doing it.



Keep the flame burning. Keep the dream alive and LIVE IT.

Cheers,
b.