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Old 05-07-2018, 11:24   #91
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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One reason why it can be advantageous to convert mech energy to electrical and back, is to get the power more easily where it's needed. Why locomotives are diesel-electric although some power is lost in the conversion.
I see what you mean, but that's not a very good analogy. Locomotives are diesel-electric to avoid a hugely complex and innefficient mechanical transmission. The electric traction motors are driven at a constant power curve, varying voltage and current depending on speed. This allows the engine to run at a constant efficient RPM, while providing the huge torque needed at low speeds as well as power at high speeds.

I never had a suitcase generator mounted permanently with proper exhaust/air, but I suppose that would be ideal for emergencies.. Then again, it wouldn't be a suitcase generator if bolted in, would it? Maybe a run-it-in-place solution?
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:30   #92
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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.

IMHO, a dewatering pump should be PTO engine connected to connected to other adequate power supply (ie. genset).
I agree,and I also think dewatering is not a big issue in a storm. Look at the number of yachts that have been pitch poled / rolled , hatches torn off and have survived for months either abandoned or got their crew home.
Dewatering is more of an issue if you are holed below the waterline hitting a container in a storm (just not your day [emoji4] )

Most damages are above the waterline from breaking seas causing cracks/ damaging hatches..... If dismasted, and part of mast is battering hull...you need to cut that away asap.

My PTO pump driven off the main engine removes about 60 gallons/minute , that's 3, 600 gallons per hour equals around 30,000lbs or 15 Tons

How mch more do you need?
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:50   #93
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

all great points...
what about a ditch bag, where it is easily accessible. not stowed.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:52   #94
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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My PTO pump driven off the main engine removes about 60 gallons/minute , that's 3, 600 gallons per hour equals around 30,000lbs or 15 Tons
I really like this idea.
Did you install it yourself?

On a side note, I am always surprised to see that some wimpy bilge pumps have smaller motors than toy RC cars. It just seems like a good place to do a little upgrading even if not going for the large trash pump.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:56   #95
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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I could never figure why boat mfgs continue to vent tanks overboard. So, to keep seawater out of fuel and fresh water tanks, and yet keep them functioning in all conditions, instead of temporarily plugging vents to tanks, better yet would be to double loop the vent hoses, add a fish-mouth type valve to each and vent them inside the boat, secured as high as possible.
Hi Taipe
Good idea about the double loop but I'm not familiar with the term "fish mouth type valve"
With them venting inside in rough conditions, would diesel fumes contaminate the interior?

My tanks all have valves on the vent pipes at the highest point, then a flexible hose that loops further up inside the air intake vents, and down the exterior so they are venting outside.

Again, I distinguish the difference between Gale Conditions (where I would not bother turning off vents) and Storm Conditions, where seas are extreme and crew are down below.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:59   #96
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

Before I fixed my leaking system I would have had to discharge the holding tank, lest there be another type of storm inside the cabin.

Still might be wise to do with a properly working system.
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:03   #97
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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A Honda, or other brand, suitcase generator used to run a dewatering pump in storm condition makes no sense in my opinion. Is it to be placed inside or under sheltered dodger? What about the exhaust and carbon monoxide? Place it on deck? Place in deck in storm conditions? Hove to, & pouring gas into the generator lashed to a deck? Cords plugged into the 110VAC outlet? Water - rain, wind driven & seas - all about? I question the ability to get clean fresh gasoline into it, the ability to start & keep it running and the GFI protected outlet from tripping.

IMHO, a dewatering pump should be PTO engine connected to connected to other adequate power supply (ie. genset).
Those are good points, of course -- if you don't have a dry place to run it, then that will be a problem, with this variant, for all these reasons.
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:08   #98
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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Before I fixed my leaking system I would have had to discharge the holding tank, lest there be another type of storm inside the cabin. [emoji2]

Still might be wise to do with a properly working system.
Lol.....not a pleasant thought

But you do bring up a good point about emptying that smelly tank and avoiding free surface effects pumping odors.

I actually use rough conditions to help clean the holding tank by pumping in salt water and bleach, but that is when crew are feeling ok
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:26   #99
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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I actually use rough conditions to help clean the holding tank by pumping in salt water and bleach, but that is when crew are feeling ok
Interesting idea! Might have to do that.
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Old 08-07-2018, 10:10   #100
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

Crew numbers - perhaps slightly off-topic because it is storm prep before going to sea rather than while at sea . . . . but crew numbers are not much discussed in cruising forums and there is quite a bit of 'safety leverage' there.

3 (or 4) crew means MUCH less fatigue all around, and thus greater margin to deal with stuff when it inevitably happens.

Think about (just for example) dewatering a boat (either by hand, or continuously clearing trash from around the pumps) with say 4 crew, rather than just 2 70-year-olds.

I know many cruising couples are reluctant to bring strangers into their home and their set routine. We ourselves were reluctant. However, on passages in cold water, with higher gale possibilities, with upwind stretches almost inevitable . . . it should probably be a serious consideration.
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Old 08-07-2018, 10:48   #101
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Crew numbers - perhaps slightly off-topic because it is storm prep before going to sea rather than while at sea . . . . but crew numbers are not much discussed in cruising forums and there is quite a bit of 'safety leverage' there.

3 (or 4) crew means MUCH less fatigue all around, and thus greater margin to deal with stuff when it inevitably happens.

Think about (just for example) dewatering a boat (either by hand, or continuously clearing trash from around the pumps) with say 4 crew, rather than just 2 70-year-olds.
Of course, more crew means more resources to deal with emergencies, less fatigue, the possibility to hand steer the boat for a long time in adverse conditions. This improves safety much more than for example a life raft.

6 scared men with buckets get the water out of a boat pretty quick
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Old 08-07-2018, 11:19   #102
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

More crew that know what they're doing, not just more passengers.
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Old 08-07-2018, 11:20   #103
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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for example) dewatering a boat (either by hand, or continuously clearing trash from around the pumps) with say 4 crew, rather than just 2 70-year-olds.
This is an excellent point. I would guess than most of the cruising boats we meet have just a couple (mostly older) as a crew. Single-handers are usually viewed as a separate breed, but with one bad injury, 2 able crew could become a single-handed adventure. Beyond diluting the fatigue, 3 or more is just good redundancy, IMO.

If all goes well (knock on teak), I plan to sail well beyond the age of being able to execute a couple of pull-ups. At that point, however, it might be prudent to grab some (much) younger crew for a long passage.
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Old 08-07-2018, 11:23   #104
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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More crew that know what they're doing, not just more passengers.
yes, totally agree . . . . I should have said 'experienced crew'
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Old 08-07-2018, 11:43   #105
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Re: STORM PREPARATION AT SEA

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6 scared men with buckets get the water out of a boat pretty quick
Modern boats with shallow bilges the use of buckets almost impossible. You also cannot get a the Coast Guard supplied water pump to work, as the inlet to way too large, even with the strainer removed. That is personal experience.
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