Selfsteering gear ..

[Hesti]

With the last boats, self steering gear has not been that much of a big topic: We had a tiller pilot (switched off after adjusting) or another means of blocking the tiller, slightly oversheeted jib and from windward to half wind situations, the boats kept course reasonabely well until there was a change of wind strength. In the end, I still steered a lot by hand.

With the next boat, we may want to go a step further for longer passages. Electric tiller steering is not a welcome option: It is hard on the battery charge and the whine-whine-whine-whine is unwelcome.

Are there known tricks to lead the sheets to the tiller or is wind vane pendulum the only option? If wind vane pendulum: Which brand? Or are there good plans for self building?

Input welcome, Hesti

[gmakhs]

If you have a transform hanging , a simple trim tab is the best solution .
You can move it with electric or with wind .

[Hesti]

Thanks! But I do not fully understand - could you perhaps provide a photo or a sketch?

[Bill Seal]

Self-Steering for Sailing Craft
John S. Letcher Jr.
It's over 40 years old, but has lots of good ideas.
You can find it on ebay or amazon for 20-30 bucks.
Or you can get it here in PDF https://jesterchallenge.files.wordpr...r-jr-small.pdf

[gmakhs]

Here is a simple sketch of what I use .

[thomm225]

Electric tiller pilots these days take very little from the battery especially on Sunny Days.

Some tiller pilots are much more quiet than others. My Raymarine ST2000 is quite quiet.

I was at 11.9 volts one morning and sailed for hours in the rain/thick clouds on my autopilot where my solar panels provided no help.

[gmakhs]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Electric tiller pilots these days take very little from the battery especially on Sunny Days.

Some tiller pilots are much more quiet than others. My Raymarine ST2000 is quite quiet.

I was at 11.9 volts one morning and sailed for hours in the rain/thick clouds on my autopilot where my solar panels provided no help.

Electric tiller pilots this day are **** , my autohelm.ev100 have broke twice and one of my friend have had the same issue , they do burn a lot of power through it might feel little on a short trip but on a long passage they burn a lot .
The most important issue is that they are failing .

ST2000 IS QUITE stringer but doesn't perform well .

[gjordan]

Hesti, what type of boat do you have? I am a big believer in windvanes and have about 15K miles of use. I have had 2 Aries previously and have my third waiting to go on my boat when it goes in the water. There are many brands that will work OK. I bought another Aries because I have liked the way they worked for me before, but Monitor, Cape Horn, Fleming and several others will all do the job. If you have an electrical failure on a boat with a windvane, you are inconvenienced but if you have an electrical failure on a boat with only an autopilot, you will probably learn what exhaustion at sea means. I have nothing against autopilots but knowing how dodgy electricity can be, I prefer the mechanical device. Just my opinion. _____Grant.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by gmakhs

Electric tiller pilots this day are **** , my autohelm.ev100 have broke twice and one of my friend have had the same issue , they do burn a lot of power through it might feel little on a short trip but on a long passage they burn a lot .
The most important issue is that they are failing .

ST2000 IS QUITE stringer but doesn't perform well .

Both of mine (Raymarine ST 2000 and a Simrad TP 10) are still working but have had problems that I was able to fix

I bought the Simrad in 2014, and the Raymarine in 2018

[gmakhs]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Both of mine (Raymarine ST 2000 and a Simrad TP 10) are still working but have had problems that I was able to fix

I bought the Simrad in 2014, and the Raymarine in 2018

St 2000 is well build , mine was good for years before it brakes , but the newer models are just bad , my boat is 26 feet and my friends 28 feet we both have change 4 drive units now in total in waranthy , in less than a year less than 5000 miles .

[thomm225]

You might want to checkout Boat Alexandra's (Sean's) Pypilot Software and how he builds his autopilots.

He has sailed his old boat (a Bristol 27) damn near around the World. BTW, notice the windvane on the back of his boat but he is using his pypilot system and maybe a motor from an old autopilot

It's in the link where I was getting advice on repairing my Raymarine before I realized that the only problem was the shaft had come loose/unscrewed.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ot-208491.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbez...ature=youtu.be

[250224]

Originally Posted by Hesti

is wind vane pendulum the only option? If wind vane pendulum: Which brand?

Don't know if a wind vane pendulum is the only option. Personally I have a Windpilot (which works fantastic) together with a Raymarine tiller pilot which is being used for short distances, i.e. marine in/out.

[El Pinguino]

I have a custom made trim tab on aux rudder.... has done a lot of ocean miles....

When I had it made 17 or so years ago $$$$$ were an issue... otherwise I would have bought a Hydrovane or a Cap Horn... the latter being a truly elegant bit of kit.

When in use the helm is lashed and and the only bits of string involved are one light line to engage / disengage it ( this acts against a bit of bungee that holds it in gear ) and two damping lines to restrict the aux rudder to +/- 5* or less... sail trim is everything with any SS.

Photos should explain all... the only bit you can't really see is the tube within a tube that transfers rotary from the vane at the top and converts it to push/pull at the bottom where it is sent to the trim tab.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by Hesti

With the next boat, we may want to go a step further for longer passages. Electric tiller steering is not a welcome option: It is hard on the battery charge and the whine-whine-whine-whine is unwelcome.

I totally agree with your thinking! Particularly the noise bit.

Originally Posted by Hesti

.... Or are there good plans for self building?

The internet is full of plans for DIY building, but if you go that path I recommend you either do a LOT of reading, or better still, pick up one or more of the older books (remember those?) on the subject.

My reason for saying this is that every author on the web, and to some degree books, I have found has a bias in their thinking that may eliminate a design option that would be good for you and your particular boat. I have also found that very few of the web resources I could find had any useful numbers, and had a bit of a hit and miss approach to the build. No web resources I found address the mathematics of the stability and self correction of the system, all were trial and error and many simply accepted unstable systems without question.

I am 90% of the way through my build of an auxiliary rudder with trim tab and H-vane so I can't tell you if it is a work of art or a waste of time. But I can tell you the numbers in the build, such as the size of the rudder, the ratio of the balance of the blade and the leverage percentages on the trim tab actuator have all come from multiple books on the subject. I also started with the Hydrovane blade as a base line for the overall rudder size and increased it by 30% based on lots of comments from users of that system with boats similar to mine.

It has been a very enjoyable project to date, but not one for the faint of heart as it has combined all that I have in the way of welding skills, fibreglass skills and a fair bit of woodworking skills too. Sourcing the materials has been a right royal PITA, I have now spent a total of three whole working days in my van, just getting hold of the right bits of stainless steel. If I were not currently an unemployed student it would have been a very false economy for me to build this thing.

But regardless of the financial aspect, the personal satisfaction so far has been immense.

It will be even more immense if the thing works.

El Pinguino's build has caught my eye and I'll be hitting him up for some comments on the vertical axis vane choice as I respect his wisdom on this one. I had, until now, been firmly of the belief that H axis was the only way to go.

I do plan to share the results of my build on this forum, whether it works or not, either as a source of motivation or a cautionary tale, not sure which it will be. About a month to go at a guess.

Rustic Charm, here on CF, implemented a bit of my learning on his trim tab system with good results, I don't claim to be anything other than the conveyor of book learning in his case, but it was good of him to test some of my understanding for me before I went to the effort of building it.

[gjordan]

We still dont know what type of boat the question is about. Size and to some extent underwater configuration all have to be considered. ____Grant.