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Old 02-11-2021, 07:35   #1
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Sailing uphill on Mary River!

Couple weeks ago I was going back to Mary River Marina from Hervey Bay in Queensland, Australia.
Instead of motoring up the river as before, I decided to sail as far as I could.
The odd but helpful fact is that river is tidal and very little gradient so it has been navigable with tall ships according to old photos.
How did those old sailors over hundred years ago made their way up the river beats me?
So I took the challenge and decided to try to get up all the way to Maryborough Marina if I can.
First day was quite easy. Tides were heping me and wind was favourable too so I was sailing first about 3 knots speed. Then just after sunset the wind dropped and I dropped the sails and anchor.
Nect morning with incoming tide, the wind was with me but very light and almost headwind. Had to take port channel past that big island on the river when Navionics was telling me to go starboard side.
Luckily the channel was deep enough for my catamaran.
Slowly made my way towards the horseshoe bend and was passed by another sailing boat who motored past me while I started tacking to headwind.
I made about 8 succesful tacks on that narrow river until 9th did not quite make it,
So I said myself, bugger it and started the motor.
I was racing against the storm and managed to secure my mooring at the marina. Then I was fitting a tarp over leaky roof when I got drenched by rain.
So I made 2/3 of the distance by sailing. Not bad effort sailing uphill
How far inland have you sailed? How far can rising tide take you in rivers?Click image for larger version

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Old 02-11-2021, 13:15   #2
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

Not a bad effort at all. Gets pretty tight and shallow in spots. Did a race years ago from the coast to Taree in a dingy in a gale. That was interesting!
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Old 07-11-2021, 11:07   #3
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Sailing uphill on Mary River!

Interesting subject. I know very little about sailing tall ships, so these are guesses.
The word ‘tall’ comes into it. The wind higher up is usually at a different angle to the wind at deck level. They would have known how to take advantage of this, using the topsails to make progress. Then there’s towing, either using the ship’s boats to tow with the tide, or perhaps there were commercial towing services in such places? I’ve seen numerous pictures of ships being towed by rowing boats. Then, least likely perhaps, is ‘drudging’ where an anchor is rowed out ahead of the ship which is pulled up to it using the windlass. Another anchor is then taken forward and the process repeated. Not much fun; I guess that’s where the word ‘drudgery’ comes from!
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Old 07-11-2021, 15:01   #4
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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Then, least likely perhaps, is ‘drudging’ where an anchor is rowed out ahead of the ship which is pulled up to it using the windlass. Another anchor is then taken forward and the process repeated. Not much fun; I guess that’s where the word ‘drudgery’ comes from!
I suspect you are thinking of "kedging".

Drudgery comes from the word "drudge" meaning to do hard menial work, or a person who does such work. It dates back to the 1300s. Nothing nautcial about it.
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Old 07-11-2021, 15:10   #5
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

https://www.maryboroughqldbusiness.com.au/history.html


"Specialised tugs were in short supply, but there were steam powered vessel operators always willing to tow ships, often three at a time, serving the port."
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Old 07-11-2021, 15:45   #6
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

Tall sailing ships where towed in and out of port with the boats on deck powered by the crew,
They sailed with the high tide, Irrespective of wind direction,
Once well away from the dock, They put up the sails and sailed away.
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Old 07-11-2021, 16:22   #7
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

During the COVID break, I read Cook's journals that he wrote during his voyage of discovery. He regularly deployed one of the two ship's boats (the other was a small sailing vessel) to tow the Endeavour whenever it was in a tight spot or excessively becalmed, which appears to have been the practice of the day. In one instance, off the coast of New Zealand, this saved the Endeavour from wrecking when it started drifting dangerously close to rocks.
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Old 07-11-2021, 16:41   #8
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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I suspect you are thinking of "kedging".

Drudgery comes from the word "drudge" meaning to do hard menial work, or a person who does such work. It dates back to the 1300s. Nothing nautcial about it.


You’re right that what I described is correctly known as kedging, but drudging exists:

https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sail...g-jargon-28366
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Old 07-11-2021, 19:37   #9
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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You’re right that what I described is correctly known as kedging, but drudging exists:

https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sail...g-jargon-28366
Interesting, here are several descriptions of drudging used in an alomst diametrically opposite sense to kedging:

https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/sail...n-anchor-33591
Drudging is deliberately dragging the anchor to control your progress astern.

https://www.waterwayguide.com/latest...-for-new-times
in essence, he described the technique of “drudging”, an age-old method of controlling a boat’s speed or direction by intentionally letting the anchor drag-the one time that “dragging” is not only acceptable but encouraged. Drudging is distinct from kedging in that with drudging, once the length of the rode is adjusted, it’s the anchor that moves. Whereas with kedging, once the anchor is set it doesn’t move, it is the rode that is adjusted.

Drudging is distinct from kedging in that with drudging, once the length of the rode is adjusted, it’s the anchor that moves. Whereas with kedging, once the anchor is set it doesn’t move, it is the rode that is adjusted.

https://www.boatus.com/expert-advice...chor-maneuvers
Old sailors often used the current by "drudging" into harbor when there was no wind. They drifted in but kept the bow into the current by dragging the anchor from the bow on a very short scope.
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Old 07-11-2021, 20:47   #10
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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Interesting, here are several descriptions of drudging used in an alomst diametrically opposite sense to kedging.
Yes. Drudging or clubbing (an alternative name) is the term for deliberately dragging the anchor to orient the vessel and to control it in a river current. Those terms were much used in 13th Century to 18th Century English

The term drudging likely has naught to do with drudgery (drudge = a slave, a person employed to do mean, servile work) but has much to do with dredge. The OED regards drudging to be a variant of dredging.

In modern ship operations, dredging the anchor is still taught (at least in some schools and in some textbooks) as a means of controlling a vessel when approaching a berth in a river current.
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Old 08-11-2021, 02:00   #11
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Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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Yes. Drudging or clubbing (an alternative name) is the term for deliberately dragging the anchor to orient the vessel and to control it in a river current. Those terms were much used in 13th Century to 18th Century English



The term drudging likely has naught to do with drudgery (drudge = a slave, a person employed to do mean, servile work) but has much to do with dredge. The OED regards drudging to be a variant of dredging.



In modern ship operations, dredging the anchor is still taught (at least in some schools and in some textbooks) as a means of controlling a vessel when approaching a berth in a river current.


I’ve seen this done a couple of times in Poole Harbour, years ago. Oil tankers leaving Southampton water and proceeding down the Solent, which has a narrow dredged channel, often tow a tug boat which motors against it for similar reasons. Pity I confused the term in my memory with kedging.
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Old 08-11-2021, 03:52   #12
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

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I’ve seen this done a couple of times in Poole Harbour, years ago. Oil tankers leaving Southampton water and proceeding down the Solent, which has a narrow dredged channel, often tow a tug boat which motors against it for similar reasons.
Yes, that's the idea.

Once the ship is moving slower than the current - whether slowed by dredging the anchor at short scope (about 1:1) or by a tug motoring upstream to stem the current, then water is flowing over the keel and rudder. So the rudder can be used to turn the vessel.

I dug out my copy of David House, Seamanship techniques: shipboard and marine operations, to make two clips:
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Old 13-11-2021, 16:11   #13
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Re: Sailing uphill on Mary River!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellowtulip View Post
Interesting subject. I know very little about sailing tall ships, so these are guesses.
The word ‘tall’ comes into it. The wind higher up is usually at a different angle to the wind at deck level. They would have known how to take advantage of this, using the topsails to make progress. Then there’s towing, either using the ship’s boats to tow with the tide, or perhaps there were commercial towing services in such places? I’ve seen numerous pictures of ships being towed by rowing boats. Then, least likely perhaps, is ‘drudging’ where an anchor is rowed out ahead of the ship which is pulled up to it using the windlass. Another anchor is then taken forward and the process repeated. Not much fun; I guess that’s where the word ‘drudgery’ comes from!
Interesting replies and I will try to apply different techniques on my sailing.
Quite different techniques on tall ships with big crews than me sailing single handed on my 50 year old catamaran.
But knowing all those techniques, I might be apply some of them if and when motor fails.
It is better to practise scenarios in advance than trying to figure out when those things happen.
I practise man overboard when I see a UFO.
Unknown Floating Object which often becomes just a FO and wnen I lift it onboard, it becomes just an O.
Last UFO I recovered was actually a dog!
A balloon dog which had flown off from childrens party?
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