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Old 17-06-2019, 11:03   #46
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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Originally Posted by sailorladd View Post
That is why, using two whisker poles you have a bit of leeway (pun intended to go slightly off course from DDW... oh, and the homemade whisker poles are still going strong after more than twenty years of sailing as is the wooden mast, boom, staysail boom, bowsprit etc... it all depends on how you make it....as stated it's not that difficult.
My foil has two grooves. I suppose I could use the 2nd groove and use the Spinnaker halyard to hoist the second jib.
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Old 17-06-2019, 13:15   #47
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

Absolutely.... The extra bit of effort it takes to set the "twins" would be well rewarded on long passages (I clocked up about two weeks on one run I recall... but an afternoon stroll around the buoys may not be that practical.... although well worth going through the practice run so that when you do need them you "know the ropes" groan...sorry
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Old 17-06-2019, 19:26   #48
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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Originally Posted by bensolomon View Post
I am going to ask I silly question...I apologize in advance. Do you have two jib/Genoa halyards or do you link both headsails to a single jib halyard on the foil?
That's a good question. Not silly at all!

I have only one halyard, since I have staggered hanks on only one forestay. Dual forestays with dual halyards are much more flexible as they also permit hanking on two different jibs, such as a working jib and and a genoa, to use individually in changing conditions, as well as making the hoisting of twins twice as easy. And you can compensate for slight differences in luff tension between the twins. My sailmaker got it just right, but one can't expect perfection - only marvel at it when it's achieved.

In the video I posted above, you might notice I'm really putting my back into hauling up the sails because I'm hauling two jibs at once (about 50 pounds) against the resistance of 20 hanks, 10 on each jib. And it puts some strain on the block and halyard. Two forestays and two jibs would have let me haul up one at a time.

I do have a halyard winch, but I'm often too impatient to use it, and a bit superstitious about straining the gear with a winch if something fouls. I like being able to stand back and look right at the whole rig while I'm hoisting - not bent over a winch straining my neck to look up. When I sail single-handed, my shiftless crew is very unreliable at warning me while I'm cranking
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Old 17-06-2019, 21:16   #49
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

Yes I originally had twin forestays but could never keep them both tensioned evenly lol, tension one and the other slackens off! So reduced and went single forestay and hanked on alternately which worked pretty well, remember you are running and don't really need a knife edge on the downwind sails...and I remind myself also that there are no two boats alike! So what works for me may not work as well with you, but that is the fun and joy of owning a sailboat, I loved these challenges and lived for my boat and when I achieved my goal, the feeling of satisfaction was wonderful
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Old 18-06-2019, 14:23   #50
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

On a couple of occasions I have used the boat hook pole to get the sail out a little more ( assuming itís a wooden pole )
Or as suggested using the boom ( but that never worked for me )
Also pulling the Halyard around the stern
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Old 19-06-2019, 10:53   #51
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

I have a perfect solution, we just did this today in the Abacos.
Learn the Icicle hitch and tie it from the jib sheet to the cleat while running wing and wing. The wind was directly behind us and this work perfectly. Simple, easy and effective.
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Old 03-07-2019, 17:32   #52
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

So I pulled anchor the other day at Kiptopeke, Va for my 20 mile crossing back to VA Beach.

I then rolled out the jib and sailed between the cement ships then went forward and raised the main.

The sails split to wing and wing so I just went with it. At about the same time, the wind went from 5 knots to around 12-14 which was nice to speed up the crossing.

Being close to land helped keep the waves down also at least for a couple hours.

Autopilot is running the show.

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Old 03-07-2019, 17:58   #53
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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My question: Does anyone have tips for a makeshift pole, or advice for sailing downwind without one?
We crossed the Atlantic E to W with just a headsail fitted with two sets of sheets; for down wind work (95% of the passage) we didn't hoist the mainsail just 'poled out' the mainsail's boom using the jibe preventer and Mainsheet, having run one of the extra headsail sheets through a block lashed at the boom's end.
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Old 07-07-2019, 11:55   #54
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

I had a telescoping pole from two pvc pipes. Two jennys went up wing and wing attached together and loose footed ahead of the forestay. These were controlled by sheet lines attached to sail at the ends of the pole and steered the boat from downwind to a beam reach more or less like it was a square rigger. Worked great!!
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Old 08-07-2019, 03:55   #55
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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Nice. I am getting more interested in trying this soon.

Maybe someday in extremely light air I'll try a little trick my old sailing club used to do for practicing spinnaker drills in super light air, too light for actually flying the spin. Throw a Stern anchor out and the boat doesn't move so the apparent wind isn't effected by the motion of the boat since there isn't any. That frees up the helm too to practice the foredeck drills. Talk about not needing the rudder...
I have done something similar with my sailing students on Sonar keelboat. We found an empty quay in the marina where moored alongside we had the wind almost directly on the stern. We practiced all spinnaker work while moored securely
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Old 08-07-2019, 04:35   #56
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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Originally Posted by lateral View Post
I pole out the #1 with the spinnaker pole.
Worked so far but have not used in real squally conditions.
I have bought another spin pole and thinking about the old #1 on the other side.
Could be exciting!
Surprising how far forward AWA can be before leech collapse.
Dunno about the drop tho, could furl both and wait for less wind to drop the second out foil groove. Could be messy ...haha!

Max wind so far 25knts.
Pic is with #2 on lite day.
Last trip out did 43 Nm in 5hrs with #2 & main, not too shabby.
AWA 110į- 120į. 20+ Knts tho.
I donít see a preventer in your photo. Even with a preventer I recommend against standing like that when DDW.
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Old 08-07-2019, 12:45   #57
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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I don’t see a preventer in your photo. Even with a preventer I recommend against standing like that when DDW.
Good call. Normally we do, just that day was light and steady & wasn't ddw.
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Old 08-07-2019, 13:09   #58
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

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Originally Posted by bobnlesley View Post
We crossed the Atlantic E to W with just a headsail fitted with two sets of sheets; for down wind work (95% of the passage) we didn't hoist the mainsail just 'poled out' the mainsail's boom using the jibe preventer and Mainsheet, having run one of the extra headsail sheets through a block lashed at the boom's end.
May I have a picture of this, please? I think I get it conceptually, but I would love a photo. Did you use a snatch block at the boom end? Then to aft mounted deck block back to winch?

Thank you,
Ben
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Old 08-07-2019, 16:12   #59
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Re: sailing downwind without a kite or pole?

Anybody ever seen what happens when a "prevented" main gets backwinded (taken aback) in a strong gust?

It's even more interesting when: 1) the preventer breaks/gets cut by panicked crew or, 2) it bends the boom.

I'll stick to twin jibs and a Dutchman boom break, thanks.
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