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12-05-2017, 13:27
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Miami
Boat: Boatless
Posts: 1,578
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Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/acci...oss-of-2-lives
The U.K. Marine Accident Investigation Branch report of two deaths aboard a boat in the Clipper round the world race.
Both are an example of 'One mistake too many!'
In both cases the victim made a fatal error but several other errors contributed to the death!
__________________
Phil
"Remember, experience only means that you screw-up less often."
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12-05-2017, 14:08
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Toronto area when not travelling
Boat: Nonsuch 30
Posts: 1,664
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Very thorough, well-reasoned report. The two accidents show the difficulty of thinking of everything and how much harder it is to handle issues with inexperienced crew, even if they are very capable individuals. Also the added dangers of racing are shown - the attitude was just to keep pushing it when conditions are marginal rather than slowing down even before conditions become nasty.
__________________
Have taken on the restoration of the first Nonsuch, which was launched in 1978. Needs some deck work, hull compounding, and a bit of new gear.
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12-05-2017, 14:15
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,398
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Danger zones to be clearly marked on deck?
You'd have to mark the whole deck wouldn't you?
__________________
"You CANNOT be serious!"
John McEnroe
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12-05-2017, 14:20
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#5
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,103
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
"Later in the same race on 1 April 2016, an untethered crew member was washed overboard from the yacht. The crew member was recovered after 1 hour and 20 minutes in the water, but never regained consciousness."
Notice the time it took to locate and recover the MOB.
And that was with a Very well equipped boat with a big crew and an experienced skipper.
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12-05-2017, 20:14
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Shady Side, MD
Boat: Hallberg-Rassy 41
Posts: 181
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand
"Later in the same race on 1 April 2016, an untethered crew member was washed overboard from the yacht. The crew member was recovered after 1 hour and 20 minutes in the water, but never regained consciousness."
Notice the time it took to locate and recover the MOB.
And that was with a Very well equipped boat with a big crew and an experienced skipper.
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It's shocking that they recovered the MOB full stop.
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12-05-2017, 21:20
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 28,434
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogulskibum
It's shocking that they recovered the MOB full stop.
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Not really shocking to me, anyway. Most race boat crews have practices for MOB situations. I think the fact that it took that long speaks to the difficulty of the conditions they experienced, and we don't know at what point she became unconscious, and, hence, harder to rescue. They were fortunate, considering the circumstances.
I am not at all surprised they persevered and got her back: for one, that's how a race team is--they all would be utterly devoted to rescuing her; and, you're expected to finish with the same number of crew you started with--the same people.
Ann
__________________
Who scorns the calm has forgotten the storm.
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13-05-2017, 08:50
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: richards Bay, South Africa
Boat: voyage Mayotte 50 ft cat
Posts: 165
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Such matters leave me utterly perplexed and confused. I have a light aircraft and can be tracked on any flight anywhere, yet a massive Boeing disappears. Likewise, these are high budget and high tech vessels, yet the MOB obviously wasn't wearing a relatively cheap MOB tracking device? A blip would show up on their GPS automatically towards which the helmsman steers. 1hr 20 mins???? Yup, I don't understand it.
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13-05-2017, 09:40
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#9
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cruiser
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Probably in an anchorage or a boatyard..
Boat: Ebbtide 33' steel cutter
Posts: 5,030
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YPSILANTI
Such matters leave me utterly perplexed and confused. ...... Likewise, these are high budget and high tech vessels, yet the MOB obviously wasn't wearing a relatively cheap MOB tracking device? A blip would show up on their GPS automatically towards which the helmsman steers. 1hr 20 mins???? Yup, I don't understand it.
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Southern ocean in huge seas and wind is a very different place than any of us will ever understand. No problem finding the casualty, MOB on plotter and ais beacon were used. 40kts of wind gusting 60 in the southern ocean must be a savage place few of us can even imagine.
Reading the full report might help.
https://assets.publishing.service.go...ort07_2017.pdf
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13-05-2017, 09:48
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Sherwood Arkansas
Boat: Tanzer 22
Posts: 185
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YPSILANTI
Such matters leave me utterly perplexed and confused. I have a light aircraft and can be tracked on any flight anywhere, yet a massive Boeing disappears. Likewise, these are high budget and high tech vessels, yet the MOB obviously wasn't wearing a relatively cheap MOB tracking device? A blip would show up on their GPS automatically towards which the helmsman steers. 1hr 20 mins???? Yup, I don't understand it.
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Finding the MOB is not the issue. It's getting them back on board. Watch this video to understand the Southern Ocean. She is big and she is mighty. Fast forward to 1:22
https://youtu.be/861lbJmVeSg
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13-05-2017, 12:21
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#11
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Jacksonville/ out cruising
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 31,351
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Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
I guess my first indicator that is wasn't going to be good is noticing they are all wearing helmets
I have my cave diving "bump cap" aboard, but only cause it has a GoPro mounted to it, I never expect to wear it while sailing
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13-05-2017, 13:06
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Boat: Westerly Conway 36ft
Posts: 961
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
From Ainia: Also the added dangers of racing are shown - the attitude was just to keep pushing it when conditions are marginal rather than slowing down even before conditions become nasty.
I agree absolutely. Am trying hard not to get started on this topic, but with that attitude, accidents are inevitable, and some will be fatal. For what ???
I guess races like these are for people who were born too late to explore the Earth and too soon to explore Space.
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13-05-2017, 13:13
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#13
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,585
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by conachair
Southern ocean in huge seas and wind is a very different place than any of us will ever understand. No problem finding the casualty, MOB on plotter and ais beacon were used. 40kts of wind gusting 60 in the southern ocean must be a savage place few of us can even imagine.
Reading the full report might help.
https://assets.publishing.service.go...ort07_2017.pdf
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I believe they were in the N Pacific and.. if memory serves she was wearing a locator beacon.. which she had activated.
Time taken was in my opinion down to slow response's, poor sail control and having to return upwind..
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It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
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13-05-2017, 14:09
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Up the mast, looking for clean wind.
Boat: Currently Shopping, & Heavily in LUST!
Posts: 5,629
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clivevon
From Ainia: Also the added dangers of racing are shown - the attitude was just to keep pushing it when conditions are marginal rather than slowing down even before conditions become nasty.
I agree absolutely. Am trying hard not to get started on this topic, but with that attitude, accidents are inevitable, and some will be fatal. For what ???
I guess races like these are for people who were born too late to explore the Earth and too soon to explore Space.
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Rant mode ON:
Guys, grow a pair! With regards to the above that is. When racing, you push until s**t breaks, fix it/recover, & continue on. Always walking the line between pushing, & thus breaking gear, & slowing up so as not to. But in slowing down, allowing the competition to pass you. That's what racing's about. Always has been. Don't matter if it's sailing or NASCAR. And yes, there are injuries. Much as there are in any other sport. Only there are a huge amount less of them in sailing, & they're far, far less severe.
And as to finding MOB's being easy, I've been out in plenty of conditions where you couldn't spot a person even but a boat length away: In the daytime. Even just in the Chesapeake Bay. So think about trying to do it when the MOB is a wavelength or three away, with waves the size of apartment complexes in between you. It ain't easy to do. And at night, forget it!
For an easy simulation of trying to visually discern things in stiff weather, stick your head out of the car window at 40mph when it's raining so hard that even with the wipers on on high, it's tough to see another car all of 50yds ahead of you. How much can you visually & audibly discern? Now picture trying to do so while perched on an angry rodeo horse, while simultaneously being blasted by fire hoses from 3 different directions.
BTW, at that speed, rain on any exposed skin feels as if you're being attacked by a swarm of bees, literally. And yes, I've experienced both. So no, I'm not joking.
I guess you have to experience such things to "get" them. And while electronics can help with MOB situations, they don't by any means solve the problems. Yes, problems, plural. As there are many connected with such events.
Just day racing in gentle 8-12' swells off of SoCal, it's easy to lose sight of 1/2 (or more) of the fleet every time you're in a trough. Have you ever tried simulating finding an MOB in such conditions? You should, regularly.
I'm not sure what kinds of weather some folks sail in, but perhaps some recalibration is in order. Meaning in terms of what serious sailing & everything that goes with it is.
BTW: Many of the crew in that video were either complete newbies, complete idiots or likely both. Given that they were continually positioning themselves where there were no good places to hang on or brace against, & thus kept getting bowled over to the end of their tethers, repleatedly. After which they'd go back to the same exact location (to repeat said scenario, over, & over again).
That & they were trying to move around during time intervals when it was quite obvious they'd be struck by breaking waves while transiting. When had they waited a few seconds more, they'd not have had to contend with being struck by solid green water while moving.
S**t like that ain't complex, nor does it take long to learn. At least not if you've 2 brain cells to rub together.
ZERO common sense.
__________________
The Uncommon Thing, The Hard Thing, The Important Thing (in Life): Making Promises to Yourself, And Keeping Them.
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13-05-2017, 15:30
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Toronto area when not travelling
Boat: Nonsuch 30
Posts: 1,664
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Re: Report of deaths aboard Clipper Race boat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clivevon
From Ainia: Also the added dangers of racing are shown - the attitude was just to keep pushing it when conditions are marginal rather than slowing down even before conditions become nasty.
I agree absolutely. Am trying hard not to get started on this topic, but with that attitude, accidents are inevitable, and some will be fatal. For what ???
I guess races like these are for people who were born too late to explore the Earth and too soon to explore Space.
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I am not opposed to racing and appreciate that when you race you need to push it try to beat the competition. In fact, 20 or so years ago I inquired about going in the Clipper race (or its pre-cursor) but it was just too expensive, especially when you built in the cost of going to Britain from Canada to train.
My comments were simply about the different mindset of racing and cruising and how the latter can contribute to safety - a good thing since the boat is likely much smaller, the crew much smaller, and you may not have every costly bell and whistle.
__________________
Have taken on the restoration of the first Nonsuch, which was launched in 1978. Needs some deck work, hull compounding, and a bit of new gear.
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