Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 20-09-2022, 04:18   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 4
Regatta strategy on start line

Hello,
I am about to participate to a regatta on a Beneteau First 31.7 cruiser.
The competition is given by two laps around a triangle, whose vertices are given by some marks which are to be left on port side, see the drawing attached.

The crew has a somewhat intermediate level, so I would better keep things simple and easy. For this reason, I opted for a boat with an asymmetric spinnaker, which is easier to handle and jibe.

The difficult part is that, if the spinnaker is taken down on the leeward side of the boat at the downwind mark, then it will be on the wrong side when it is hoisted at the next lap. Hoisting manoeuvres where the spi is taken down on the windward side of the boat, such as the kiwi drop, are too difficult for the crew, so we would better forget them.

I thought about the following strategy, where the spin is taken down leeward, and then the bag is moved on the other side of the boat manually, while going upwind. I plan to move the bag without detaching anything (sheets, halyard, ...), so I will be sure that sheets, etc... will be properly rigged when the spi will be hoisted on the next lap.

What do you think about this plan?
Attached Files
File Type: pdf regatta.pdf (156.0 KB, 22 views)
Laurent_craft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2022, 04:48   #2
Registered User
 
danstanford's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Peterborough, Ontario
Boat: J/88
Posts: 671
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

We always dowse on the port side not matter what tack you are on approaching the mark. Most often we find ourselves doing a windward drop but it is critical to have the kite ready to hoist from that side when rounding the leeward mark if you are going back up wind for another leg.
__________________
Never attribute to malice what can be explained away by stupidity.
danstanford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2022, 02:23   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 4
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by danstanford View Post
We always dowse on the port side not matter what tack you are on approaching the mark. Most often we find ourselves doing a windward drop but it is critical to have the kite ready to hoist from that side when rounding the leeward mark if you are going back up wind for another leg.
What is the 'kite' for you? The front sail?
Laurent_craft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2022, 02:33   #4
Registered User
 
danstanford's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Peterborough, Ontario
Boat: J/88
Posts: 671
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurent_craft View Post
What is the 'kite' for you? The front sail?
The kite is the asymmetric spinnaker in my description.
__________________
Never attribute to malice what can be explained away by stupidity.
danstanford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2022, 03:51   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 4
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by danstanford View Post
We always dowse on the port side not matter what tack you are on approaching the mark. Most often we find ourselves doing a windward drop but it is critical to have the kite ready to hoist from that side when rounding the leeward mark if you are going back up wind for another leg.
Quote:
Originally Posted by danstanford View Post
The kite is the asymmetric spinnaker in my description.
Oh sure, sorry, I was confused. Like I said, taking the asymmetric spinnaker down windward is not possible given the level of my crew, so I was asking for an opinion about the plan that I proposed in my drawing, which does without this manoeuver.
Laurent_craft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2022, 04:41   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Yuma Island
Posts: 1,523
Images: 15
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Moving the bag should be no particular issue. Just make sure none of the lines are fouled. What we always did is have the foredeck 'run the tapes' to make sure the chute/kite/big scary sail didn't foul on the next hoist.

this is technique for multihulls (more apparent) but there are useful things for everyone in this vid:
tamicatana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2022, 18:39   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 38
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

If the crew is inexperienced pulling off the repacking and shuffling of the lines up wind is asking for a problem at the upwind mark. If it’s light you can certainly do the windward takedown as mentioned above, another alternative is to plan on gybing at the top mark and launching from the port side. With an Asym you’re really not sailing any lower than 140 awa anyways so your going yo have to gybe down wind on your course.
SurlySailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2022, 19:00   #8
Registered User

Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 103
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

If you think the next hoist will be on the opposite side (for example, douse on starboard, next hoist on port) then maybe consider this:



Douse on starboard, right into the companionway. Then, detach all 3 lines (halyard, sheets, tack line) from the sail, but clip them to each other, immediately, without tangling anything. Now pull on the port sheet until the clipped-together ends of the lines come all the way around the forestay and end up on the port side of the boat. Don't bother repacking the chute into its bag. Just run the 3 tapes to make sure it's not a twisted mess, trying to leave the foot and the luff on top, with the belly and the leech on the bottom. Now shortly before the hoist, grab the clipped-together ends of the lines, pull the bunch into the companionway, and clip the halyard to the head, sheet to the clew, and tack line to the tack. Hoist right out of the companionway. One crew member should pull the tack line until the tack is right at the end of the sprit, while another kind of controls the bulk of the sail so that the tack feeds out but the whole belly doesn't fill yet. Once the tack reaches the end of the pole, jump the halyard smartly and get the sail up fast.
ChrisOwens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2022, 19:11   #9
Registered User

Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 103
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurent_craft View Post
Hello,

I thought about the following strategy, where the spin is taken down leeward, and then the bag is moved on the other side of the boat manually, while going upwind. I plan to move the bag without detaching anything (sheets, halyard, ...), so I will be sure that sheets, etc... will be properly rigged when the spi will be hoisted on the next lap.

I don't think you want to move the bag from one side of the boat to the other with everything attached.



The geometry can be mentally challenging, especially with the wind blowing and people yelling. One rule that will keep you out of trouble is never pass the end of the halyard, or the end of the sheets, or the end of the tack line through the foretriangle. Imagine that there is a triangular pane of glass with its three edges attached to the mast, the forestay, and the centerline of the foredeck; you cannot pass the end of any of these lines through that pane of glass; instead, the correct way to get any of them from one side of the boat to the other is to pass them around forward of the forestay.



If, after the douse, you just grab the bag, with the sail in it and all lines attached, and drag it across the foredeck to the other side of the boat, you will have moved all three lines through the foretriangle, and you will have an unholy mess on your hands. (You could, if you felt strong and nimble, pass the entire bag around the forestay, but that's a lot of time to be standing on the bow faffing about, and you'd be trying to reach under the foot of the jib to hang onto the bag, messing up the jib trim and likely dropping the whole mess into the water.
ChrisOwens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2022, 19:38   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: San Francisco
Boat: Morgan 382
Posts: 694
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisOwens View Post
If you think the next hoist will be on the opposite side (for example, douse on starboard, next hoist on port) then maybe consider this:



Douse on starboard, right into the companionway. Then, detach all 3 lines (halyard, sheets, tack line) from the sail, but clip them to each other, immediately, without tangling anything. Now pull on the port sheet until the clipped-together ends of the lines come all the way around the forestay and end up on the port side of the boat. Don't bother repacking the chute into its bag. Just run the 3 tapes to make sure it's not a twisted mess, trying to leave the foot and the luff on top, with the belly and the leech on the bottom. Now shortly before the hoist, grab the clipped-together ends of the lines, pull the bunch into the companionway, and clip the halyard to the head, sheet to the clew, and tack line to the tack. Hoist right out of the companionway. One crew member should pull the tack line until the tack is right at the end of the sprit, while another kind of controls the bulk of the sail so that the tack feeds out but the whole belly doesn't fill yet. Once the tack reaches the end of the pole, jump the halyard smartly and get the sail up fast.

I was going to suggest this, but into the front hatch to the V berth.

Moving the sailbag from one side to the other with all the lines attached requires throwing the whole sailbag in in front and around the forestay. I would not recommend that.

Can you get a practice day with the crew before this regatta? You can raise the spinnaker, immediately douse it, and relaunch quite a few times in a long day of sailing. You will probably also wind up with a twisted sail once or twice and learn how to deal with that or prevent it.
__________________
-Warren
wholybee is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-09-2022, 19:46   #11
Registered User

Join Date: May 2021
Posts: 103
Re: Regatta strategy on start line

Quote:
Originally Posted by wholybee View Post
I was going to suggest this, but into the front hatch to the V berth.

Excellent idea.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wholybee View Post
Can you get a practice day with the crew before this regatta?

Also excellent idea.
ChrisOwens is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
regatta

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Perkins 4108 won’t start on start battery will start on house Lightssurfer Marine Electronics 17 17-12-2021 15:07
Battery Banks / Inverter Strategy Dockhead Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 17 28-09-2010 13:31
Preemptive Replacement Strategy Fiveslide Construction, Maintenance & Refit 7 03-02-2010 12:01
Strategy: Miami-Bimini with East Wind pete33458 Atlantic & the Caribbean 7 08-01-2010 14:34
Advice for purchase strategy witzgall Monohull Sailboats 22 01-04-2007 15:14

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 16:29.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.