Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 30-01-2018, 06:56   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: NYC and Sag Harbor NY
Boat: LeComte NE 38
Posts: 68
Images: 10
Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I have sailed on 49 - 52' sloops with in mast furling mainsails and it has generally worked well. Have heard that in boom furling rig provides better sail performance with fully battened main but can be more difficult to reef and more fussy to drop main requiring boat to be dead to windward which is not always easy in heavy weather. Would love to hear from those with experience and perspectives on this issue.
__________________
P Alter - NYC - Sag Harbor, NY
2002 Grand Soliel 46.3 - 47' Sloop - "Signorina"
palter@skolnick.com
PAlter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 07:21   #2
Registered User
 
S/V Illusion's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Lakewood Ranch, FLORIDA
Boat: Alden 50, Sarasota, Florida
Posts: 2,986
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

Anytime you read someone with a mast furler say they have never had a problem with it, mentally add at the end of their statement the word "yet".

Among those who have had both at various times, myself included, the boom furler is invariably preferable in terms of both efficacy and reliability. You will be better served if you confine your valuation of opinions to those of us experienced with both types.
S/V Illusion is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 09:03   #3
Moderator Emeritus
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Jacksonville/ out cruising
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 31,351
Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I have in boom, and have never had an issue with it.
It is a bear to raise the sail though, an electric winch would be ideal, I use a Milwaukee drill instead.
In any significant wind, you do have to turn into the wind to reef. To some extent you can just let the sheet go and it will furl, but best to turn into the wind.
I think nothing is perfect, everything has disadvantages, you just need to pick what you can live with.
My boat came with in boom furling, I would never have spent that kind of money myself, it’s not cheap, and you have to decide if it’s worth the cash.
a64pilot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 10:08   #4
Registered User
 
MartinR's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Sweden
Boat: 73´ULDB custom ketch
Posts: 1,063
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

What is wrong with full battens and lazy bags? The sail drops easily down, is easily reefed (single line reefing), and easily set. And the system is cheaper. Only drawback is that you need to close the zipper if you want the UV protection.

KISS is a good principle generally

BTW. I have a badly designed in-boom system on my mizzen that I do not use. It came with the boat and is a little bit funny. The luff of the sail is on slides, so you need to insert them into the track one by one when setting the sail.
MartinR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 10:18   #5
Registered User
 
SSgtPitt's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: The boat is on the hard in Indiantown and we’re back in Colorado Springs to make more money so we can go again.
Boat: 1982 Cape Dory 36 Hull #78
Posts: 650
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I have a Leisure Furl boom furler, Off Shore system which is an upgrade from the Coastal version. Previous owner had it installed.
If you have a problem with the furler with the sail up, you can still drop or raise the sail without using the furler but you couldn’t reef without poking holes in the sail. I had an uncontrolled gybe and destroyed my 40 year old cars and traveler and had to drop the sail on the deck in 30kt winds. The sail dropped easily and I was able to tie it off to the boom.
There’s a lot of friction to unwind the sail and get it up the mast track, a power winch makes this much easier otherwise you’ll need some big arms or several of them to work the sail up the mast.
Furling the sail requires the boom to be at an exact angle to the mast so the wound up sail doesn’t walk forward or backward on the spool. You’d need to mark this angle and set it up for easy referance before you left. I have a rigid boom vang so this makes it easier.

The boom is a monster. Everything is heavy duty so you really need a boom limiter / brake. I got the Wichard Gybe Easy and it’s awesome.

My next boat will have a regular setup. The more stuff you have the more stuff you have to fix when it breaks and as I learn more about sailing I keep realizing that simple is better.
SSgtPitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 10:44   #6
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Northland, NZ
Boat: Woods Vardo 34 Cat
Posts: 3,788
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

As suggested, they are more failsafe than Inst which if jammed are impossible short of cutting the sail off.

They’re really best when built as a mast/boom OEM combo as most of the add on systems have a clunky track/airfoil added to back of mast.
__________________
@mojomarine1
Boatguy30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 10:45   #7
Registered User
 
s/v Moondancer's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Miami
Boat: Boatless
Posts: 1,552
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I plan to get an in-boom reefing system for my 80th birthday until then I will keep my slab reef and stackpak system...Simple, works every time, reefs while sailing to windward on the jib and never jams. And that is on a 55ft boat in 50 knots and 20 ft seas!

The idea that a sail will only reef if the boom angle is 89 deg +- 1 degree while pointing dead into the wind is ridiculous.
__________________
Phil

"Remember, experience only means that you screw-up less often."
s/v Moondancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 10:49   #8
Registered User
 
boom23's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Med.
Boat: Amel 50
Posts: 1,016
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I am an cruiser, not a racer. I value comfort and ease of use, more than speed.

My current boat, Beneteau 49, has in-mast furling. I really like it. I never had a problem with it and I am sure it is not the best quality system... Also, my sails are tired.

My next boat, Amel 50, will have in-mast furling. All Amel's have in-mast furling but it is much better designed and better quality. I talked to many Amel owners and they love their boats.

I never had in-boom furling.
boom23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 14:12   #9
Moderator Emeritus
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Jacksonville/ out cruising
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 31,351
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Moondancer View Post
The idea that a sail will only reef if the boom angle is 89 deg +- 1 degree while pointing dead into the wind is ridiculous.


Not to be a smart Alec, but it’s closer to 85 on mine, the boom cannot be flat like you would think.
It’s real easy to adjust, if the sail walks forward, boom is too low, walks aft, too high.
You do lose a lot of adjustability too, no out haul etc.
a64pilot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 14:17   #10
Moderator
 
Paul Elliott's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,601
Images: 4
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

Quote:
Originally Posted by s/v Moondancer View Post
The idea that a sail will only reef if the boom angle is 89 deg +- 1 degree while pointing dead into the wind is ridiculous.
Meaning that it isn't true.

My Leisurefurl reefs well enough when sailing downwind. I can get it to better than third-reef equivalent with no hassle -- just get the boom angle approximately close enough, and manage the furling line and halyard tension as it reefs. I do it by myself from the cockpit (with an electric winch). In really strong winds I can't fully furl the sail without turning into the wind, but I can still get very deeply reefed.

To properly furl the sail I head into the wind (dead into it isn't necessary) and eyeball the boom angle. I've got a spring-loaded vang, so I need to ease the sheet tension to control the boom angle, but +/- 10 degrees is good enough.
__________________
Paul Elliott, S/V VALIS - Pacific Seacraft 44 #16 - Friday Harbor, WA
www.sailvalis.com
Paul Elliott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 14:45   #11
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3,126
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

As always happens with mainsail furling threads, the people who own them love them. The people who have never owned one can think of lots of reasons they're no good.

(the very early mainsail furlers had lots of problems but for the last 10-15 years they've been quite trouble free)

I have a Schaefer boom system and love it. Like any piece of sailing equipment you quickly learn a few tricks. You also won't be happy with any mainsail furler if the sail isn't built by a sailmaker with experience in that furler. In a previous boat I had in-mast. It also worked fine once I learned the few tricks.

The greatest benefit of mainsail furling is that you spend much more of your time with the right amount of sail for the conditions. I used to have a slab system. I only had two choices of reefs and it was just hard enough to use that I usually waited too long to reef - sailing the boat on her ear for a while to no one's benefit or comfort.

With the boom furler, it's so easy to reef that I'll reef 12" just to balance the helm. If the wind changes 15 minutes later, I'll adjust it again. Just like a jib sheet or a traveler.
CarlF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 15:00   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 5,921
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

To me the real cruncher between the two systems is your wallet. A good in boom system, installed and set up with a sail is serious money. In mast furling is the cheap seats in comparison. If you can afford the extra hit to your wallet then the in boom does give you a nicer more powerful sail that will let you sail closer to the wind.
robert sailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 15:15   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 462
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I put the first reef in downwind 2 nights ago when wind hit 25kn...put the 2nd reef in downwind when we hit 35kn...(Charleston in mast furling). No idea if its a good idea with in boom furling.
Eder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 15:21   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: NYC and Sag Harbor NY
Boat: LeComte NE 38
Posts: 68
Images: 10
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

I am a new member and this was my first post on CF and I greatly appreciate all the responses and input. Here are a few further thoughts on the subject:

I own and have been sailing a LeComte NE 38 for 20 years with a loose footed hoisting main, fully battened, batt-car set up with lazy jacks and no bag and it has worked every time up or down in all sorts of weather very smoothly. I usually put in a single reef with wind at about 18 - 20 knots and have 3 reef points. I 've used them all and the boat sails like a duck with great balance even with 50 knots of wind and a good sea with triple reef and it has been fun and comfortable in a wide range of circumstances

I agree that K eep I t S imple S tupid (KISS) is a good motto. However, I am turning 65 this year, will be selling my 38' sloop soon, and moving up to a 49' sloop and at this point I am looking to have some mechanical buddies help out with the heavy stuff and I no longer want to leave the cockpit to reef, or hoisting a mainsail with a 63' luff by hand and crack on the mast mounted winch.

With this in mind, I have outlined a few critical items that will be essential elements for my new old boat - such as electric winch for mainsail, hoist and reef from cockpit (in boom or in mast yet TBD though leaning toward in boom), cutter rig with self tending staysail, and electric primary winches for jib. I have been looking at quite a few boats and really like the Hylas 49. I also do a fair amount of single handing or short handed sailing with somewhat inexperienced crew so these features will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for all the input ...

Paul
__________________
P Alter - NYC - Sag Harbor, NY
2002 Grand Soliel 46.3 - 47' Sloop - "Signorina"
palter@skolnick.com
PAlter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-01-2018, 15:31   #15
Registered User
 
SSgtPitt's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: The boat is on the hard in Indiantown and we’re back in Colorado Springs to make more money so we can go again.
Boat: 1982 Cape Dory 36 Hull #78
Posts: 650
Re: Mainsail in boom furling vs. in mast furling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Elliott View Post
Meaning that it isn't true.

My Leisurefurl reefs well enough when sailing downwind. I can get it to better than third-reef equivalent with no hassle -- just get the boom angle approximately close enough, and manage the furling line and halyard tension as it reefs. I do it by myself from the cockpit (with an electric winch). In really strong winds I can't fully furl the sail without turning into the wind, but I can still get very deeply reefed.

To properly furl the sail I head into the wind (dead into it isn't necessary) and eyeball the boom angle. I've got a spring-loaded vang, so I need to ease the sheet tension to control the boom angle, but +/- 10 degrees is good enough.
Sounds like you and I have the system and setup. I’m currently replacing all the high stress parts that show wear and Leisure Furl has been extremely helpful in getting the correct parts for my setup.
I also don’t have a problem reefing on all points of sail until the winds get over about 15kts. Of course, it’s always easier when there’s no load on the sail. We just let the boom go and bring the sail down a little.
Our current issue is the button for the electric winch. It’s touchy and you have to mash it in just the right spot to get it to work. I’m having a tough time finding the correct replacement for it as the new ones have a smaller diameter button.
The previous owner had the system installed so he could sail into his 80’s, unfortunately it didn’t help his balance and he sold the boat to me.
SSgtPitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
furling, mainsail, mast, sail

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: 52 kenyon inmast furling mast, shrouds, boom and sail, plus roller furling head sail vuilbaard Classifieds Archive 0 05-06-2016 16:26
Dufour In Mast Furling Mainsail-Conversion To Batten Mainsail stefano_ita Monohull Sailboats 4 04-03-2016 14:45
For Sale: Mainsail furling system, gooseneck, boom, sail swisscatfive Classifieds Archive 0 13-08-2015 13:42
For Sale: Mast, Boom, S/Pole, Winches, Mainsail cisco007 Classifieds Archive 0 23-10-2009 21:12
In-boom mainsail reefing furling system Erikte Multihull Sailboats 36 13-08-2008 18:58

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 17:51.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.