Visit our Popular Forums

RaymondR · 22-11-2018, 21:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmh2002

Yeah, I was pretty happy going upwind, downwind, and reaching at 40-50kn in a past life, but that was definitely not on a sailboat, and resulted in the world's oil reserves being depleted by up to 4000L (yes, over 1000 US gallons) - per hour...

Still, there was none of this tacking back and forth and going backwards nonsense

Mate, at 1,000 gal/hour you were certainly going backwards financially.

jmh2002 · 22-11-2018, 22:29

Yes!

But I wasn't paying the bills at the time and neither was that really a concern for those that were. Getting there with minimum delay was the main priority.

Another world of course, but it was certainly enjoyable at the time and shortened most day trips to 20, 30, or maybe 60 minutes at the most (although once we did do France direct to Ibiza - out at sea in flat calm and averaging over 40kn for 8 hours - that was quite an experience).

So, in all cases, more time to enjoy the location upon arrival

Suijin · 23-11-2018, 04:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by phorvati

U should have stayed in the stream. U got 4-5 kts going your way. That track is showing you are tacking in place

*blinks*

Beating north against 25 knots northerly in the stream?

**boatman61** · 23-11-2018, 05:07

I will go to weather in those conditions if..
Clawing off a lee shore..
Performing a MOB recovery..
Trying to get into shelter..
I will Not if..
Theres the option to stay put..
Theres the option of an easier comfortable route like the ICW..
Prefer gains without pain.. I is an atheist..

thomm225 · 23-11-2018, 05:19

The conditions he said were 15-20 knots.

His boat is docked quite a ways from open water. He said it takes most of a day to get there......to open water, the ocean so that sailing is not a normal day sail for him

If on the other hand, he was in open water after sailing /motoring about a mile from his slip, it would just be a normal day with a breeze and he would be able to develop techniques for his boat to deal with it

That's what we have here with a North wind except the waves will be more closely spaced and steeper. If the wind is NE, it's worse because ocean waves are mixed in and the water is quite shallow

This give folks around here opportunities to practice different techniques in these conditions even when just out day sailing

So far for me the best technique is one reef and furl in some jib to 100% or less. If the winds are nearer to 15, I just sail with all sail up in normal upwind mode. Everything tight and down hauled/luff tight. A traveler would be nice though to center the main boom but not necessary (unless I need to point higher then maybe one reef)

**a64pilot** · 23-11-2018, 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suijin

*blinks*

Beating north against 25 knots northerly in the stream?

Yes, not by choice I assure you. Lot of water over the bow, and speed through the water would drop to 2 kts or so when hit by a big wave. Stream current was keeping our SOG up.
We were 75 miles or so off shore, so ducking in wasn’t really an option

Pendragon35 · 25-11-2018, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldManMirage

Thanks for all the replies. I have to say it made me feel a little depressed to turn back to port, like I had given up or not tried hard enough. But since I didn't have to be out there it just seemed better not to be.

I would say the winds were in the 15-20 kt range. My boat does balance better when I reef the main and fly a full genoa as the wind comes up, the sail is probably about a 135-140. It is a roller furling, which I'm really glad for because no way would I have wanted to be on the foredeck trying wrestle with a sail. The seas were very short and choppy, and I was watching the bow go from way out of the water to just under it a couple of times. She never really "submarined" or tried to bury herself, but it would have been quite a roller coaster I'm sure. Just standing midships while I was reefing the main was fairly difficult, and required timing the waves so I could free one hand to do things. Self-tailing winches would be nice !

So, yes I did try all my possible sail configurations, and motorsailing, and motoring. As far as trying for the gulf stream current, here in north Florida my understanding is its usually about 20 miles off the coast so it wouldn't have been worth it to go so far I don't think. Its only 27.5 miles from St. Augustine to Jacksonville.

I definitely could see that a larger boat would probably have been able to do a better job. Although, I should add that I watched a good sized catamaran that had gone out ahead of me turn around and go back in almost as soon as they had come out. I would say it was a 35-40 footer. But I imagine they would have really been pounding hard with the choppy seas, and maybe they were local just looking for a fun sail, which is not what they found !

Sometimes the best thing is to give up, go back, anchor and have a nice time just being there. Sounds like that's just what you did. Good for you for having the smarts to realize the better way!

contrail · 25-11-2018, 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dooglas

You think your boat does not make good progress to windward in choppy seas? I'd say he went back in for good reasons. Gentlemen...and catamarans...don't go to windward.....

Do you actually have any catamaran experience, or are you just past along misinformation from someone else? Because cats - at least good ones - certainly can go to weather!

contrail · 25-11-2018, 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Not too long actually.
The problem I usually have is the forecasted winds change, drastically.
Then it’s best if possible to dive into an anchorage, but not always possible.
I left Stuart Fl for Brunswick Ga last July, forecast was Southerly winds first day, then clock around out of the East as normal for the rest of the week. I knew first day wouldn’t be good sailing as 10 to 15 DDW in the Gulfstream means 6 to 10 due to current and 6 kts DDW won’t even fill my sails.
Anyway the winds did clock around to come from the East, but continued all the way around to straight due North, at 20 to 25, gusting to 30.
Nothing to do but crank the Yanmar and gut it out, we were way offshore, however first day I set my 24 hour record of 250 ish miles, and my IP is a 250 mile a day boat only if it’s on the back of a truck. Gulfstream was 4+kts, and we averaged well over 10 kts.

Currently meandering down the ICW waiting on friends to head out for the Eastern Caribbean, Plan is maybe Grenada for Hurricane season?

Let me know when you reach the BVI...would enjoy meeting up!

**a64pilot** · 25-11-2018, 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by contrail

Let me know when you reach the BVI...would enjoy meeting up!

We will try, most all I can say at this point.
We are waiting on friends now, but can only wait just so long, but says if we don’t get going, that making it far enough South in time is going to be tough.

waterman46 · 25-11-2018, 21:30

Even in our 46' with 60hp, we often struggle along at about 3 to 3.5 knots for many hours against 6 to 9 foot seas and 25knot headwinds. Conditions worse than that are not worth fighting, heave to or find a harbor.

You may want to get professional advice on matching your prop to engine and reduction gear for your boat - could be that some improvement could be made. Definitely the biggest prop that will fit subject to adequate hull clearances, can improve that low-speed, high load condition of motoring upwind.

We just completed the downwind route Ensenada to Cabo. Looking on my chartplotter at our previous track on the northbound voyage, I could see how many motor-tacks it took to clear the first 10 miles just north of Cabo last spring. Memories of a beat-up day for sure. Happens to all of us.

Always works best with a heavily reefed main strapped in tight so boom is on centerline and try to stay dry (hopefully you have a dodger).

contrail · 26-11-2018, 05:30

Out of interest, at what time of the day did you start your northbound trip? We used to do it a couple of hours after the wind died at night, and then it was usually pretty easy to get past Falso, etc, and up the coast far enough to be clear of the big winds in the morning. Jim Elfers's guide book, The Baja Bash, recommended a couple of hours before dawn, but that was because he wasn't much for night sailing. One could leave earlier, if the conditions warranted. A day time departure was almost always rugged!

waterman46 · 26-11-2018, 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by contrail

Do you actually have any catamaran experience, or are you just past along misinformation from someone else? Because cats - at least good ones - certainly can go to weather!

Agree. We see lots of multis doing the Baja bash. Actually, since in less windy conditions they can go nearly twice our speed, they can more easily avoid the worst conditions, and anchor in places to rest that we can't due to heavy rolling in those anchorages. OK, there goes my hull envy again

waterman46 · 26-11-2018, 10:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by contrail

Out of interest, at what time of the day did you start your northbound trip? We used to do it a couple of hours after the wind died at night, and then it was usually pretty easy to get past Falso, etc, and up the coast far enough to be clear of the big winds in the morning. Jim Elfers's guide book, The Baja Bash, recommended a couple of hours before dawn, but that was because he wasn't much for night sailing. One could leave earlier, if the conditions warranted. A day time departure was almost always rugged!

All correct. We just wanted to get started, having fueled up and all ready to go, and it would have been wise to try anchoring just outside the harbor for a few hours. As you no doubt know, anchoring there is a bit dicey due to the depth, but is doable if you are watchful. Of the two bashes and several LA to SF runs I have done, this one was far more difficult all the way to SF.