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Old 09-12-2022, 13:39   #46
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

I've read the pardeyes' book twice. Lin and Larry P didn't write about the hardships of heaving too, they wrote of the methods to perfect it.

They also pointed out that they were mystified by opinions expressed earlier that heaving too was 'old fashioned' as opposed to essential.

In other words, they were astounded that people would not learn how to do it with their particular boat.

There is no way you should heave to for any amount of time longer than making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich with a sheet across a shroud.

and if you are making 1-1.5 knots you are forereaching, not heaving to...heaving to means you are not leaving the wash created by your boat as it slips downwind, hopefully at 40 degrees to the wind...your direction is not forward, it is sideways so you don't leave your slick....the pardeyes wrote extensively on this and for some boats, you need a sea anchor to prevent going backwards and snapping off your rudder, particularly if its not counterbalanced, as is the case with most traditional boats.....this is not to say a sea anchor is required for all boats, but it may be to heave to and not be slammed backwards.

finally, the pardeyes reference perhaps the most interesting discussion of yawl and ketch based heaving too from 100 years ago...read his descriptions in the appendix for a master class: https://gutenberg.ca/ebooks/voss-ven...ages-00-h.html
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Old 09-12-2022, 14:05   #47
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pirate Re: heaving-to dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonAcierno View Post
There is no way you should heave to for any amount of time longer than making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich with a sheet across a shroud.
I don't know about that.. crossed 2/3rds of the Biscay hove to under fully reefed main.
Changed tack every couple of days to keep me on track for my chosen port.. reckon I'd hold the record for the longest crossing under sail.. 13 days.
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Old 09-12-2022, 14:30   #48
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonAcierno View Post
I've read the pardeyes' book twice. Lin and Larry P didn't write about the hardships of heaving too, they wrote of the methods to perfect it.

They also pointed out that they were mystified by opinions expressed earlier that heaving too was 'old fashioned' as opposed to essential.

In other words, they were astounded that people would not learn how to do it with their particular boat.

There is no way you should heave to for any amount of time longer than making a peanut butter and jelly sandwich with a sheet across a shroud.

and if you are making 1-1.5 knots you are forereaching, not heaving to...heaving to means you are not leaving the wash created by your boat as it slips downwind, hopefully at 40 degrees to the wind...your direction is not forward, it is sideways so you don't leave your slick....the pardeyes wrote extensively on this and for some boats, you need a sea anchor to prevent going backwards and snapping off your rudder, particularly if its not counterbalanced, as is the case with most traditional boats.....this is not to say a sea anchor is required for all boats, but it may be to heave to and not be slammed backwards.

finally, the pardeyes reference perhaps the most interesting discussion of yawl and ketch based heaving too from 100 years ago...read his descriptions in the appendix for a master class: https://gutenberg.ca/ebooks/voss-ven...ages-00-h.html

1 to 1.5 knots with a slick is still hove to. There is still wave action and current that will move the boat. It's totally unrealistic to believe that a boat will remain in one spot in a moving fluid.
When you have a slick and that slick is preventing the waves from breaking on you, and only for the length of your boat, you know you're hove to and there's no argument against that. That is exactly what heaving to is supposed to achieve.
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Old 09-12-2022, 16:43   #49
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

The other benefit of heaving to is in a Man Overboard situation. My wife isn't the most able of sailors but we practice with her at the helm, and at the shout of MOB I throw a bit of orange peel or similar overboard and at the completion of the heaving to procedure our 25 footer is usually within a couple of meters of the marker.
I'm a great fan of knowing how to heave to for everyone that takes the helm.
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Old 09-12-2022, 19:53   #50
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

I have always hove-to under mainsail alone. I just use a double reefed main sheeted slightly to windward so that only the top section of the sail will drive you forward. Play with the rudder position and mainsail sheet position a bit until you figure it out. On my boat, with it's large skeg, I can often just let the rudder go. The wind blows the bow off (this is normal) the mainsail starts to draw a bit and then the bow goes back up into the wind until the boat looses way and then the bow drops off again. If you set it up right, there should be very little motion or heal and no real flapping of the main.

Every boat will be different but as long as I have about 20 knots of wind, it works well. I have done it for over 24 hours offshore in about 40 knots and 20 foot seas and only moved about 8 miles. I was on a big ferro ketch offshore and we did it for 3 days straight in similar conditions.
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Old 09-12-2022, 23:03   #51
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

Recognizing that no two boat designs act in precisely, here is our take.
First you’re not trying to stop dead in your tracks. For that, you need a sea anchor, which even then does not exactly do that.
Rather, a properly set heave to will have the boat footing, even if a barely discernible amount.
Remember, you’re talking bad weather, so the main should have been already reefed.
Assuming that the jib is on a roller furler, it should have been rolled up to something less than 100% to minimize strain on the rigging.
On e the jib is rolled and the main reefed- second reef if you have that option. Get some speed up- you may have to fall off to do it - then tack, NOT rooling the jib sheet when you do so. It shouldn’t have a problem doing that. Once you’ve come about, pull the boom in to tge pount that the natural weather-helm of the boat will want to make it tack back.
You may need to secure the helm to an optimum position.
Split-rig boats (ketches, yawls, schooners) have the option of using the mizzen on yawls and ketches and main on schooners reduce forward motion without the main. (or a schooner’s fores’l ). In these cases the mizzen woukd tend to blow off, while main on schooners does rhe same.
The backed jib and rhe small area of the main should balance each other out. NOw, go inside, and make a cop
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Old 11-12-2022, 15:57   #52
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Re: heaving-to dilemma

For the folk speaking of some fin-keel boats that just wont heave-to, I thought I had one of those for a couple of years (Adams 31, beamy aft cockpit sloop).
Even with no main set at all, and a fully backed number 1 headsail, she would just tack through it after a minute or so unattended, and race away again.
Then my dodger rotted away and 'presto', a boat that heaves to nicely!

So windage aft is likely the problem if you have one of those fin keelers that just wont heave to. Not saying you can necessarily do anything about that (hard dodger, hard Biminis, solar panels, davit-hung dinghy etc) but if you know, then you know...
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