docking w/ inexperienced crew?

[amanoni]

Many good points noted here, I'll add a couple of thoughts. First these are great suggestions for either bow in or stern in. I find though that stern in allows much better visibility to get right at the dock and allow someone to step off easily. Or single handed, its easier for me to get off too. The simple key either way is the mid-line to control the boat.

One thing I would suggest overall though is to practice with the crew at an end dock, not in a slip with other boat. That way you can make a few rounds and get your crew comfy with the approach and their role.

[hamburking]

When approaching a dock with inexperienced crew, I send them below to have a drink or a rest or whatever, until we are safe at the dock. Inexperienced crew have a tendency to do really stupid stuff when docking, putting both the boat and their own safety at risk.

[Whisper Cappy]

Training from my father and mother which I carried over with my own boats is simple and it most often makes docking safe and controlled...GO SLOW! Nothing is more unsafe than docking with too much speed. Most injuries happen when crew tries to slow a boat down with either their bodies or a line running through their hands while attempting tie it to a cleat. This should not happen!

The advise of securing midships line is perfect. Boat will stay in place while you secure other lines. Great advise to have lines completely ready; through chock and over lifelines or pulpits. Make it easy, especially with inexperienced crew.

Most important however - SLOW DOWN when docking!

[deblen]

Learn to single hand.
Prepare a midship line close to cockpit.(It doesn't have to be actual midship.
Tell your inexperienced guests to stay out of the way. Same with many "dock volunteers"
Watch this video carefully.


https://youtu.be/yKu9s2MC-cw



Once your midship is secured,you can relax.


Len

[Ken Z]

I do not let anyone at my helm in tight situations and never at docking. Midship , breast cleat a good choice, if wind from stern stern line , wind from the bow bow line. Loop a cleat on the other boat and take a turn on your cleat, don t let them grab or tie to another boats life line. Your in control, you can fall off and re dock if your not lining up .

[S/V Alchemy]

Originally Posted by Terra Nova

You don't need crew. When you get the boat's 'midships against the dock, immediately secure a center spring and the boat will be under control. Then you can take your time securing the other lines.

^^^This.

[Macblaze]

One of the things that might help out a bit is distinguishing between crew and passengers. I always ask anyone coming aboard what role they want to play.

If they say passenger then I expect them to sit quietly and keep their hands to themselves and enjoy.

If they say crew, then I teach them what I want from them before we leave the dock. Since we come from the land of the much-maligned bullrail, that includes how to control the boat from midships by taking a wrap around the rail after they step off. Then as we come in to any particular dock we talk through the current conditions and discuss the likelihood that a docking might be difficult and what not to do.

Then the onus is on me to bring the boat alongside and make sure that any fledgling crew listen when I tell them I am not close enough and to abort.

I still cringe when I watch this segment with the crew diving off the bow to try and stop the boat....SHUDDDER!

https://youtu.be/nl9J8uy-zEE?t=3m40s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl9J8uy-zEE&t=3s

Skip ahead to 3:40

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by billknny

No matter if the crew is experienced or not, having someone take a jump onto the dock is a bad idea.

Each of my dock lines has a loop in the end, with a 4 inch loop of small stuff threaded thru the weave. Make dropping the loop over a piling or cleat a piece of cake.
.

Hi Billknny,
Point #1, I agree. I still don't understand how that girl I took out on a first date could break an ankle taking a step across only 1 foot of water from a deck only 1 ft higher than the dock. But she did, and that was the end of that relationship (and certainly for the best I guess).

Point #2, please explain the 4 inch loop of small stuff threaded through the weave to make a loop - does that keep the loop from collapsing? If so, can you explain this device in more detail (rope types and sizes, how woven)?

I see lots of folks claiming they just drop a loop over a cleat, while standing on the deck of their boat. I'm not a star basketball player and it does seem like making that shot has no better than a 50/50 chance. Instead I just put the engine in neutral, go to the shrounds and easily step down the 3' to the dock with both bow and stern lines in my hands. But I vow to try it your way next time!

[waterman46]

After stopping the boat I always just step off the boat onto the dock with bow and stern lines in hand. There is no jumping in docking. Hold onto shrouds with both hands, step over lifelines and backwards down to dock. No drama if done at correct time but it must be done quickly.

So I'll try the loop over cleat method but catching the cleat seems dicey.

Many mentioned running dockline from sheet winch temporarily. Don't think that works well with center cockpit boat, as that line could possibly put some big transverse tension on one of your lifeline stanchions while the boat is still moving. And many cruisers have other gear (tanks, solar panels, MOB equipment, bicycles, etc. stored aft along lifelines or stern rail, which can interfere with a line led from a sheet winch.

On larger boats, it is impossible to remain at helm while doing anything with a docking line. Hey, there's finally a good reason to have dual steering (and engine control) stations on beamy cruising boats!

[Sojourner]

I skipped most all of this thread once I saw "tell them to put it into forward and turn the wheel"..... Hand anything over to an inexperienced crew EXCEPT the helm, unless you want to see how your boat looks parked on TOP of the pontoon It's your job at the helm to make everything else easy for anyone onboard. If you got the boat where it needs to be, then a toddler can step off in safety.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by waterman46

After stopping the boat I always just step off the boat onto the dock with bow and stern lines in hand. There is no jumping in docking. Hold onto shrouds with both hands, step over lifelines and backwards down to dock. No drama if done at correct time but it must be done quickly.

So I'll try the loop over cleat method but catching the cleat seems dicey.

I do this when single handing. It takes some skill, both at the helm (takes some time to get from there to the side in a boat with 16 foot beam!), to get the boat stopped dead in the right place, and with the rope.


The best way is to fix one end of the dock line to the midship cleat, make a loose coil with the rest of it, and heave the middle part over the cleat. Then haul in the end of it to capture the cleat. It's much easier to get the middle of the rope around the cleat than trying to get a loop in the end of the rope over the cleat.



With practice, you can do this at some distance. It also helps to have a special line dedicated to this work -- lighter and more flexible than your normal docklines. I use octoplait nylon for this, I think 18mm, but you could use rather lighter line than that, too.


Note that this will not work with Baltic rings or many other types of cleats. In such cases you will either need help from shore, or perhaps one of those mooring hooks common in the Baltic ("hook 'n' moor"). I would never, personally, step off my boat with no one left on board, and her not tied up yet.

Originally Posted by waterman46

Many mentioned running dockline from sheet winch temporarily. Don't think that works well with center cockpit boat, as that line could possibly put some big transverse tension on one of your lifeline stanchions while the boat is still moving. And many cruisers have other gear (tanks, solar panels, MOB equipment, bicycles, etc. stored aft along lifelines or stern rail, which can interfere with a line led from a sheet winch.

On larger boats, it is impossible to remain at helm while doing anything with a docking line. Hey, there's finally a good reason to have dual steering (and engine control) stations on beamy cruising boats!

YMMV, but on my boat, I can lead a line well fair through the middle of one of my midships cleats and up to a primary winch.


If you don't have a deck cleat arranged like that, you can surely fashion a fairlead in some other way. You should be using a lighter line for this, so if you have a low friction eye on a strop (or two), you might be able to use that.

[DEAN2140]

If he is rafting to another boat there should be someone on that boat to catch his lines. You don't raft up to an unmanned boat.

For docking I secure a long line to the aft and bow cleat of the boat and then step off. This allows me to control both ends of the boat. It works in most situations.

[Lihuedooley77]

Do we have this correct....

You are side tying to another vessel that is already secured to the dock ?

I would find a slip, or T dock or whatever. Keep life easy.

What happens when that other vessel decides to leave and enjoy a day on the water ? You boat his tied up to his ! Interesting.

We use a breast line, and have the secured bow and stern lines lead from their cleats , along the life line, close to mid ships, so they run free, and I can reach them from the dock.

I would not trust my vessel to an unskilled person to handle the helm when docking. Also, I usually would have them ( maybe ) hand me a dock line after the boat is secured with the breast line to a cleat or bollard.

Another tip, if some one is tossing a dock line to you....you stand facing them, and take hold your arm out at a 90 degree angle from your side...
Have them throw the line at your ARM not your FACE.

Those on board who are not directly involved with the docking procedure will lay below until the vessel is totally 100 % secured.

Also, big deal saying...." When going slow the cost is low, when going fast you will loose your, ( transom ) ."

Tying up side to, we would have fenders set, usually high, to protect both vessels. Re-set as necessary after adjusting and securing the dock lines.

Also, you did not mention the types of boats. Power or sail. Two sail boats have spreaders, and they may need to be off set. Fw'd or aft of each other.

You have lots of good scoops from the other posters, we would keep it simple and slow, and any help from your passengers or crew should be very simple, plain language, and not having them get off the boat during docking..

Also, many fuel dock staff, or dockside lookie loos, who wish to help, really do not know what they are doing, and things can go very , very wrong in an instant.

In fact, few know how to tie a proper cleat hitch, let alone be aware of the boats speed, and adjust the dock line accordingly. That means the required cleat for the particular dock line.

I have docked in wide slips with a neighboring vessel sharing the slip, ( fenders port and starboard ) but tying up side- to with an already docked vessel, on a permanent basis would not be ideal.

We have rafted up, in a protected harbor, in calm conditions, day only.

As to tying side to in a permanent situation, not going to happen, We would rent a slip of our own, stop the boat, and step ( not leap ) on to the dock . Secure the breast line, and then the bow and stern lines as necessary.

Secure the dock lines with proper cleat hitches, and then spring lines, and flemish out the bitter end of any lines laying on the docks.

Also, make sure that the bow and or pulpit, anchor, etc, do not extend over the dock, where people walking by can plant their heads, face or body part to something very solid.

Keep it easy, slow, smart , safe, and use seamanship and situational awareness.


I also use a breast line when docking large vessels into a dead end slip that is shorter than the length of the boat. Like a 55 ft sailing vessel , in a 50 foot or less dead end slip.

When docking under sail, We gently take a purchase with the breast line, and slowly stop the fore reach of the boat, well before the bow hitting and rising up over the end of the slip.

Regardless , keep dockings, smooth, easy and slow. It will all work out just fine.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Lihuedooley77

Do we have this correct....

You are side tying to another vessel that is already secured to the dock ?

I would find a slip, or T dock or whatever. Keep life easy.

What happens when that other vessel decides to leave and enjoy a day on the water ? You boat his tied up to his ! Interesting.

We use a breast line, and have the secured bow and stern lines lead from their cleats , along the life line, close to mid ships, so they run free, and I can reach them from the dock.

I would not trust my vessel to an unskilled person to handle the helm when docking. Also, I usually would have them ( maybe ) hand me a dock line after the boat is secured with the breast line to a cleat or bollard.

Another tip, if some one is tossing a dock line to you....you stand facing them, and take hold your arm out at a 90 degree angle from your side...
Have them throw the line at your ARM not your FACE.

Those on board who are not directly involved with the docking procedure will lay below until the vessel is totally 100 % secured.

Also, big deal saying...." When going slow the cost is low, when going fast you will loose your, ( transom ) ."

Tying up side to, we would have fenders set, usually high, to protect both vessels. Re-set as necessary after adjusting and securing the dock lines.

Also, you did not mention the types of boats. Power or sail. Two sail boats have spreaders, and they may need to be off set. Fw'd or aft of each other.

You have lots of good scoops from the other posters, we would keep it simple and slow, and any help from your passengers or crew should be very simple, plain language, and not having them get off the boat during docking..

Also, many fuel dock staff, or dockside lookie loos, who wish to help, really do not know what they are doing, and things can go very , very wrong in an instant.

In fact, few know how to tie a proper cleat hitch, let alone be aware of the boats speed, and adjust the dock line accordingly. That means the required cleat for the particular dock line.

I have docked in wide slips with a neighboring vessel sharing the slip, ( fenders port and starboard ) but tying up side- to with an already docked vessel, on a permanent basis would not be ideal.

We have rafted up, in a protected harbor, in calm conditions, day only.

As to tying side to in a permanent situation, not going to happen, We would rent a slip of our own, stop the boat, and step ( not leap ) on to the dock . Secure the breast line, and then the bow and stern lines as necessary.

Secure the dock lines with proper cleat hitches, and then spring lines, and flemish out the bitter end of any lines laying on the docks.

Also, make sure that the bow and or pulpit, anchor, etc, do not extend over the dock, where people walking by can plant their heads, face or body part to something very solid.

Keep it easy, slow, smart , safe, and use seamanship and situational awareness.


I also use a breast line when docking large vessels into a dead end slip that is shorter than the length of the boat. Like a 55 ft sailing vessel , in a 50 foot or less dead end slip.

When docking under sail, We gently take a purchase with the breast line, and slowly stop the fore reach of the boat, well before the bow hitting and rising up over the end of the slip.

Regardless , keep dockings, smooth, easy and slow. It will all work out just fine.

Just some pedantic and not very important comments on terminology:


I know that many "boaters" refer to lines running perpendicular to a midship cleat as "breast lines", but strictly speaking, breast lines run from the bow or stern perpendicular to the dock:





http://www.reidmiddleton.com/reidour...w-asce-manual/



Many sailors confuse these with bow and stern lines.


And "bitter end" is not the end of the line which is lying on the dock -- that's the "working end". The bitter end is the one made fast to the ship, more precisely, to the "bitts".

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Just some pedantic and not very important comments on terminology:

I know that many "boaters" refer to lines running perpendicular to a midship cleat as "breast lines", but strictly speaking, breast lines run from the bow or stern perpendicular to the dock:

Once again, usage varies and declarative statements that others are wrong should be used with care.

That's your interpretation. Many authorities will disagree.

In my experience, breast lines are not restricted to bow and stern locations. Breast line is frequently used to describe any mooring line running perpendicular to the dock.

In fact I've never come across any definition which limits the expression to bow and stern attachments.

If you want to be specific, if it's running from midship, it's a "midship breast line" or ("breast fast" according to one definition at least https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/breast%20line)

In common terminology, there are essentially three types of mooring lines, depending on their angle to the dock:
Breast Lines
Head/stern Lines
Springs.
https://www.wartsila.com/encyclopedi.../mooring-lines

BoatUS: