Boat sinks in The Northwest Passage

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

There is no magic that will make a boat “pop up” out of the ice when it is pushed into the hull. The ice is jagged and creates many sharp high pressure points against the hull. The entire weight of the boat can end up impinging on jagged ice. It will cut the hull like a hot knife though butter. Ice breakers and other ships designed for Arctic seas have ridiculously thick hulls. It is fantasy to imagine a pleasure boat could be reinforced to survive getting encased in pack ice.

Sadly, the captain used the ice to destroy a perfectly good boat.

but it CNY survive if properly designed and no not ridiculous thick
It just takes good planning. Just ask Alva Simon
https://www.amazon.com/North-Night-S.../dp/076790446X
Btw he is an occasional poster on here and on sailnet.

[transmitterdan]

Even properly designed small boats are at serious risk if they get surrounded by pack ice. Because someone did it and survived isn’t a surefire formula for success.

I can understand the desire to explore waters sailed by the very few. But there are idiots who believe the NW passage should be reliably ice free every summer by 2018. It’s not and the wanna be forecasters that said it would bear some tiny sliver of responsibility. It was on their prognostications that so many unprepared boats have attempted what is essentially a lottery draw where losers can easily freeze or drown. It makes no sense.

[hpeer]

Anyone who believes the crap heard without checking out for themselves is playing with Fire. I’m no cc denier, but I do know that we are not there yet, and may not be for some time.

I don’t know, nor does anyone else here, that this really did or did not play into the sinking. So why don’t we just leave it alone.

A lot of boats have made it in the last few years, including a wooden cutter with the Capt, his wife, and two little girls. They got lucky.

Maybe folks reading about the last success rate has given folks it’s an easy thing to do. And maybe this capt truly knew the risks and maybe he didn’t.

I still think an Ovni would be a good choice for this mission and would have a better chance than normal of surviving. It’s not uncommon for boats to pop up in the ice when sealing. Not all do, but some.

[DeepFrz]

The following quote was taken from StuM's post in the other current thread on this matter.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ge-206751.html

In the blog post I linked to:


"That's exactly what the Canadian authorities have urged all crews in recent days. It is not foreseeable that the passage would open at all this year. On the contrary, the current ice situation for yachts is dangerous. The crews should either move their ships back south or look for a safe hibernation port in Baffin Bay or Greenland,


The skipper of the "Anahita", Pablo David Saad, had deliberately ignored the official warning and instead oriented himself to the skipper of another yacht, who has traveled the passage several times and who had been hoping in the last few days still for a withdrawal of the ice ,"

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by newhaul

figured didn't take long for a thread about the unfortunate loss of a vessel to sea ice to turn into an agw thread.

newhaul links to a post on a well known site dismissive of climate science and then claims he did not start an AGW thread.

[RaymondR]

The classic examples design for survivability of sailing ships in polar exploration have to be Amundsen's "Fram" and Shackelton's "Endurance". "Fram" was specifically designed with a rounded hull shape and nothing, such as protruding sheer strakes, to catch or give purchase and rode up onto the top of the ice and survived. "Endurance" was a more conventional vessel and hull shape which could not do so and was crushed and sunk.

Designing from that base for NWP, steel, flush deck to maximize side heights rounded hull profile and raise keel.

[hpeer]

Along those lines there was a Meta built Damien here in the yard last couple of years they had just spent 2 winters in the arctic. She is 52’, round hull, swing keel. They used a dozer to haul her on the beach for the winter. She is now somewhere around Norway or Svaldborg.

SV Philos is the name. Australian chap running her.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by jackdale

newhaul links to a post on a well known site dismissive of climate science and then claims he did not start an AGW thread.

Jack that was just the one that showed up in my news feed . Recall on another thread about s week ago I posted the CCG actual report when that research ship " ran aground" in in that same area . I did not make any statements concerning anything but the loss of a vessel .

[nortonscove]

I think crushed is most likely. The pressure is unimaginable when an ocean of ice moves on the tide or wind.

[DeepFrz]

The St. Roch also had a rounded bottom, very strong beams and Australian "Iron Bark" sheathing. She had quite a history sailing in the Arctic. I saw her in the museum in Vancouver back in the day.

Has anyone heard if any boats have made it through the passage in the last few days? There has been a persistent warm southerly flow through the area over the Labor Day weekend and it seems to have made quite a difference to the sea ice extent in the passage.

[hpeer]

Yesterday we were talking to a couple just over from Greenland, they have been following the fleet closely and have contact with one boat there. According to them one boat managed to slip through earlier but all others have been thwarted. Ice is now making and returning boats need to hustle back or over winter.

[DeepFrz]

Thanks hpeer.

[nortonscove]

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

The St. Roch also had a rounded bottom, very strong beams and Australian "Iron Bark" sheathing. She had quite a history sailing in the Arctic. I saw her in the museum in Vancouver back in the day.

Has anyone heard if any boats have made it through the passage in the last few days? There has been a persistent warm southerly flow through the area over the Labor Day weekend and it seems to have made quite a difference to the sea ice extent in the passage.

Yes. My wife's father and brother are part of a crew bringing a large tug through right now but then he was the last of the Newfoundland big boat sealing captains and somewhat used to heavy ice and the skills required to survive it.

[DeepFrz]

Originally Posted by nortonscove

Yes. My wife's father and brother are part of a crew bringing a large tug through right now but then he was the last of the Newfoundland big boat sealing captains and somewhat used to heavy ice and the skills required to survive it.

And a tug equipped for the conditions would be able to safely follow an icebreaker. Something that most sailboats can not do.

[victor15]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Apparently some didn't get the CCG warning about the sea ice threat in the NWP this year.
https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.word...thick-ice/amp/
Thankfully no loss of life.

Its nothing more than to be at the wrong place and wrong time unprepared.

Only those registered with NORDREG received warning while Anahita received from me well in time to return. There are some stubborn unfortunately.

Spent all night with SAR informing them with details of Anahita and their poor communication using only Garmin SMS and language barrier. Floating on top of ice floe for nearly 12 hours at night in Bellot Str. is not a fun. Eventually were picked by helicopter of Coast Guard icebreaker.

See my 2018 Yachtsmen Routing Guide to Northwest Passage for safe/unsafe anchorage/shelter, 5th Edition from: https://rccpf.org.uk/pilots/136/Arctic---Northern-Waters

Just scroll down a bit. Its for all those wanting to sail NWP and is free. p { margin-bottom: 0.25cm; line-height: 120%; }a:link { }
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