Catamaran in the Philippines

[zUrchin]

Yes. I am afraid there has been so much corruption. So far in all my 54 years this is a rare time I suspect the top is not corrupt. So rare and how far and how long will it last?

It's unique history, geography and culture is also important to consider. Heck, in the island of Negros alone where I am originally from, one side speaks the Illonggo dialect based on the Hiligaynon language the other side of Negros speaks the Cebuano Visayan language. The differences between the two are substantial. Then you have the national language based on Tagalog to top it off.

There's also the cenrtralized structure and how funds are dispersed... but you are right, we need to talk about boats more.

So, what do I think is the ideal boat for sailing in SE Asia which I will never be able to own because I could never afford it?

That would be a Shannon 38 HPS. I am not affiliated with them in any way. One could not argue with the ratings too much. It needs only 36 inches of water and goes 12 knots under power. And it's a beachable, singlehandable, monohull sailboat with a very, very wide beam.

There isn't a single one of I am aware of in SE Asia.

[Dragonhand]

WOW, I could also dream about the Shannon 38 HPS, Looks real cool. I like cats, because of the large deck area and the shallow draft. But I also dislike that they are dangerous when flipped over as they may get by a rogue wave (the CE marking regulation require a exit in the bottom to be used "When" flipped over, regardless of sail area. The larger Wharram have never been reported to flip. it is not considered possible because the low center of effort of the sails but it certainly is if you meet the right wave in the Pacific even without sails up.

So I also dream,, lets see what happens to our Dreams

[beiland]

Originally Posted by zUrchin

Follow to my last post on the disputes for awareness of the South China Sea (West Philippine Sea) tensions. Here's a recent article with an image of how China sees it, vs. the various countries in South East Asia.:
BBC News - Has Chinese power driven Asean nations apart?

Be sure to check the map at the bottom of the article. A picture says a thousand words.

Very perplexing when you notice how far reaching China's territorial claim is. It's all about the finite resources of our planet. Most of these disputed areas (Sharborough Shoal, Panatag Shoal, etc.) are expected to be very rich in oil and other natural resources (not to mention marine life).

They've cleaned out the marine life, but there is bound to be some BIG disputes coming with China and any number of these other smaller countries. I saw this coming when I worked in the offshore oil industry in SE Asia in the mid-late 1990's.

And the real problem is these smaller countries are going to be seeking help from the good old USA when tensions break out. The problem is we no longer have Subic Bay, and we have a very precarious foreign relations relationship with China after Amb Huntsman left. I fear what will happen if we come to real tensions with a new 'chicken-hawk' administration that will be heavily influenced by the military of this country. Been thru that twice now.

[zUrchin]

Originally Posted by Dragonhand

WOW, I could also dream about the Shannon 38 HPS, Looks real cool. I like cats, because of the large deck area and the shallow draft. But I also dislike that they are dangerous when flipped over as they may get by a rogue wave (the CE marking regulation require a exit in the bottom to be used "When" flipped over, regardless of sail area. The larger Wharram have never been reported to flip. it is not considered possible because the low center of effort of the sails but it certainly is if you meet the right wave in the Pacific even without sails up.

So I also dream,, lets see what happens to our Dreams

I'll be too old to sail by the time I could afford a used and highly depreciated Shannon HPS. What amazes me though is no other mono hull designer/builder has replicated yet what Walt Shultz's Shannon's shoal sailers have achieved now close to a decade. I am in awe.

Consider the following: 36" draft, no centerboard, motors at 12 knots, sails to weather very well with minimal heel (13 ft wide beam), fully beachable (not just for fine sandy beaches) with it's kevlar reinforced keel, 500 mile range under power. And, try searching the web for negative comments on Shannon yachts. Other than price, ye likely won't find much negative if any.

On a separate subject, I gathered some valuable input from CF on a thread I started a couple days ago about cruising trimarans. I have wrongly viewed trimarans mostly as speed demons appealing to racers. One of the suggestions I received was to look into Neel trimarans. If you have time, take a look at it. It comes very close to what I would consider another ideal concept design for the perfect sailing boat for Philippine waters. Though builder reputation and feedback is very limited since their boats have just been introduced to the market this year. The only downside from a design perspective that I can think of is this boat would be best sailed short handed (not single handed).

A boat that can easily single handed is high on my list. I do not want my sailing time limited when my wife or sailing buddy have other plans when I want to sail and the weather permits, I go sail.

NEEL trimarans

I believe the strengths of the design concept of Neel tri's can be imitated by a good boat builder in the Philippines. Their basic design is so similar to the Philippine banka, but orders of magnitude safer, with a luxuriously huge salon. No more cramped berths often found on many of the older cats.

So, when you mentioned you like cats because of the large deck area, another option may be something like what Nell has achieved. I'd be keeping an eye for feedback from actual owners of how their Nell boats perform in the real world.

[Dragonhand]

NEEL Trimarans
Sorry to say I think they look a little clumsy. But I would agree that there is a huge difference between a raising Cat/ Trimaran and one that can be used for pleasure.

Does anybody know how to register a pleasure boat in the Philippines. I am looking at one boat that is registered abroad and I think I need to pay import tax? and register it. It is small below 5 Ton

[zUrchin]

Dragonhand, you would most likely be best off registering it as a visiting vessel and acquire your permit as such, thus avoiding importation tax. From what I gather the Philippine government now provides at Subic, multi year permit's for visiting yachts and the fees should be a lot more reasonable than import taxes.

If you are a US citizen, it may be as simple as a visit to the US Embassy on Roxas Boulevard in Manila to acquire the forms and register it as a US Vessel. Be sure to have all your papers, notarized bill of sale, title, proof of citizenship, etc.

However, if you are a Philippine citizen with no dual citizenship status (e.g. US), you may have little choice but to register locally and pay importation taxes. If your spouse or child happen to be a US Citizens, register the boat in their names instead. As would be expected, the US allows the registration of a US vessel for US citizens only.

If you are not a US or Philippine ciitizen, another option worth exploring may be to officially register the boat in Lankawi, Malaysia which claims to have a very open registration process even for foreign vessels. I do not have first hand experience for this, but some of my research indicates that this approach may be an option worth exploring. Upon completion of the process, you could then sail the boat back to the Philippines as a visiting vessel and acquire the multi year permit mentioned earlier.

Importation taxes in the Philippines for boats and cars are extremely high, and can be even higher than what you've paid for the boat. There is no logic in it I know, but that's what it is. I am retiring to the PI next year and have been doing a lot of research on this very issue. I have already decided to sell all my vehicles including my boat here in the States, rather than have them shipped over. It sucks too because cars are much more expensive over there than in the US, and my Com-pac 25 sloop and trailer would be an ideal boat for those waters with its 2'6" draft.

One last thing, any buyer's broker worth his salt should be able to help you through this. Besides, buyer's brokers share the fee from the seller's broker and theoretically their services should not cost you anything.

There are other ways to lower your importation taxes through customs but those other approaches are likely unethical. If we are to have a positive influence on the country and people, the last thing I'd want to do is bribe a government representative and further perpetuate corruption and become part of the problem. Got to walk the talk.

I would appreciate you sharing your first hand experience as you go through the process since I would have to assume there are others in the same boat so to speak including me next year when I retire. Also, since you already are in Manila, per your CF location signature, it may be worth a visit to Subic and Puerto Galera and talk to the yachty expats over there for their thoughts on this issue.

I hope there are others with first hand experience on this that may provide more useful input than I have. So far, my knowledge has been mainly gathered from researching the web and seeking input from non sailing Filipino friends and relatives.

Good luck. I hope you have your boat by the time I get there next year. And maybe we'll even get a chance to cruise together. I'll supply the beer.

zUrchin

[beiland]

Originally Posted by Bruce626

My 43' catamaran has just been put in the water for rigging and engine testing. My builder is Nigel Roberts and he has a boatyard in Tombobo Bay on the central Philippine island of Negros - near the southern tip. This is my first boat (actually two boats as I had a sailing dingy built as well). After I retired and before I left California five years ago I got a certificate in sailing 30' keel boats (first Lido 14s and then the Shields). My plan is to live aboard with my Filipina girlfriend and circumnavigate the major islands of the central Philippines - sailing within sight of land and anchoring every night. Currently I think of the catamaran as a movable apartment with an ocean view - perhaps later I will become more adventurous. I suspect that a steep learning curve lies ahead and all the experienced sailors out there are vastly amused. Clearly I have many questions - and I probably have not yet thought of the really important ones.

Did you get your boat fully launched?
Do you have some more photos/drawings of the aft placed rig?

[Bruce626]

Yes, my catamaran has been in the water for some time now. I eventually gave up on getting the old used Volvo Penta 2002 to run properly and imported a Beta 38 and had it installed. Once I had a working engine I started practicing sailing the boat once or twice per week. The sailing practice was useful but in the process I broke the attachment point for the port forestay bridle (half inch stainless) and am now working on getting that fixed. The other major issue is that the depth sounder that was installed did not recognize the transducer and I have a replacement - but it needs a rather large hole drilled through the bottom of the hull to install it (waiting for my installer to return from Austria). Once those issues are taken care of I hope to sail to Cebu now that the wind is no longer against me. Lots of pictures on Liza's facebook page, send me a PM and I will send back her facebook handle and you can make a friend request. I am not sure how to move pictures from facebook to CF since I don't do facebook. Thanks for asking. Have a good day.

[beiland]

I don't do Facebook as a general rule.

However I am getting ready to utilize Photobucket's free photo hosting site.
Photobucket - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Daruffians]

Bruce626,

Do you have any update on Niegel? Is he still in Tambobo bay? How's that Cat that he built for you? Do you still have it?

[Bruce626]

Hi Daruffians! Last I heard Nigel was still in Tambobo living on his three story cat. Yes, I still have my catamaran and we are currently in Carmen, Cebu at Zeke's. Still some work to do on the cat - as always. Zeke charges P8,000/mo to tie to his dock/pier which includes water. I pay an additional P400/mo for electricty. I was moored off the Cebu Yacht Club (really expensive to join) for several months - P400/night to use their mooring(s) which did not hold my cat and three of them got drug into deeper water. You can moor for free at Zeke's as some yachts do with no charge to tie the dingy - I have been seduced by not having to haul water so am willing to pay the fee. Still, Liza would like to sell the cat and move back on land - or to the USA. I am content here and our small dog, Pearl, is OK with boat life as well. I suspect that I will eventually have to give in - just not today. Good Luck. Have a good day.

[Daruffians]

Bruce626,

Thanks for the quick reply. I am also looking to build a cat but been thinking of building in Eastern Samar,( Calicoan Island) Homonhon Island is where I came from but I am currently here in San Diego. I am looking for someone that have experienced in building a power cat. If you encounter in your travels locals that has an experienced in fiberglass work, please tell them to email me @ daruffians@gmail.com. 8,400 pesos per month is not bad in Cebu. Plus you are in the water front, some people pays millions of pesos to have the ocean front apartment or condo. Okay Have fun and drink a San Miguel for me....

[tracychan]

may i know where to park in tambobo bay? u have the contact number as my friend want to sail the boat here from indonesia.

[DocBrauer]

There is a tv sold in Philippines called a Fukuda. It plugs into 220 then is converted into 12v dc going into tv. Cut off cord and wire into boat electrics. Assuming you have 12v. Mine's been in 5 years.

[DocBrauer]

You can park a motorcycle at Arlene's.