World population is growing 20 million people every 3 months

[UAEguy]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Non-fuel uses are far higher value uses, then just burning it. It will become too expensive to just burn like that long before it's too expensive to make plastic with. Oil doesn't just "run out", like one day the tank is still putting out and the next day it's dry. There's oil all over the earth,

Strangely enough, I agree with you 100% on this point. Personally and professionally, I think there is credence in the theories of abiogenic oil.

HOWEVER, just watch what happens when the price of oil hits $100/brl again...then we will revisit this conversation. OK?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by brownoarsman

I find it very funny that a bunch of cruisers, many of whom sustain themselves solely on solar/wind generation and lead-acid battery storage, are arguing that the technology is not there yet ....

More about the needed sacrifices and behavioral changes to fit your usage to the current technology until something better comes around, innit?

Of course, industrial use is a totally different ball game than residential.

Not arguing that technologies not there, arguing that its not currently suitable technology to slip in and take the place of oil due to the immense scale we rely upon it. Oil has and is a cheap energy source that has enabled our society to abuse and over depend on the energy that is realeased from it, unwinding our way of living isnt as simple as few behaviour modifications, we are talking about a major key stone of the modern society and the financial system.

I really hope that Dh as one is right, I hope technology is just around the corner and the disruption will be minimal, I also agree nuclear is the way but in our modern protest over everything society, I cant see it.



Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Cottontop]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Would you think for example If I decided to grow a garden that I should be able to force the local grocer into buying any that I decided was excess? Then of course we have to make it so that he keeps food on hand for those times I want more or the weather was bad or there wasn't enough rain etc., but he has to buy any food I don't want.
Think that is fair?

Maybe the analogy is not entirely apt.

Remember that the "grid" is a regulated utility, in most US states and other countries. A government sanctioned monopoly that can take land for generation plants and transmission lines by eminent domain, gets a guaranteed return and can pollute our air and water without cost (the "Tragedy of the Commons").

So suppose your grocer is growing the produce he sells on public lands. And he gets a guaranteed price. And he dumps loads of chemical fertilizer into adjacent waterways. And every year he wants more land. And all this at the same time homeowners are growing excess produce and throwing it away for lack of a market. Now should the grocer have to buy the excess produce?

Would that today's complex questions fit easily into the framework our founding fathers gave us (in the US), but we might just have to fashion our own solutions.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I think controlled fusion will also be cracked. God knows when. But when it is, it will change the world.

But the market shows that a lot of investors believe that battery technology can be brought forward in reasonably short time frames, and are willing to be money on it.

Fusion would be the game changer, but so would some sort of new approach to batteries. Logically and technologically I think they are developments that should be right around the corner, but it seems they have been at this stage for much of my adult life.

At this point I’m not holding my breath for either … nor making speculative investments. But that probably explains why I’m a $500/month cruiser .

[UAEguy]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I’m a $500/month cruiser .

Wow, that is impressive! I'm guessing there isn't a female in the equation

The best I ever did with a woman aboard was $1200/month in Mexico. Damn I miss Mexico, tacos, beer, tacos, beer...

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by UAEguy

Wow, that is impressive! I'm guessing there isn't a female in the equation

The best I ever did with a woman aboard was $1200/month in Mexico. Damn I miss Mexico, tacos, beer, tacos, beer...

Sorry … it’s a old reference around here. Currently I’m more like a $1500/month cruiser. Although I aspire to be much less . And yes, there is female in the equation.

Check out http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post2291998 if you want to have a fun read.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Fusion would be the game changer, but so would some sort of new approach to batteries. Logically and technologically I think they are developments that should be right around the corner, but it seems they have been at this stage for much of my adult life.
No
At this point I’m not holding my breath for either … nor making speculative investments. But that probably explains why I’m a $500/month cruiser .

Only issue is where to mount it

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Sorry … it’s a old reference around here. Currently I’m more like a $1500/month cruiser. Although I aspire to be much less . And yes, there is female in the equation.

Check out http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post2291998 if you want to have a fun read.

Wow, what a strange twist! When we're self-contained in the Med anchorages, my wife and I spend less than $1000 per month.

But we aspire to spend much more and become $6000 per month cruisers!

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Sorry … it’s a old reference around here. Currently I’m more like a $1500/month cruiser. Although I aspire to be much less . And yes, there is female in the equation.

Check out http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post2291998 if you want to have a fun read.

It will get to be less as soon as the breakup happens and you cast off again

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by AiniA

India's total fertility rate in 2012 was 2.50 and declining and for exactly the same reasons that the UK' s dropped in Victorian times - movement off the farms, mechanization on the farms, empowerment of women (education and jobs). All these things take time and I don't mean 10 years, more like 50 or 75. China used the One-Child policy, with considerable and some nasty long-term consequences, to speed up the process of demographic transition.

And it was carried out by the UN so it must be true..
Does this include the many miscarriages and girls born and abandoned in the fields because they have no value.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Only issue is where to mount it

+1

Originally Posted by newhaul

It will get to be less as soon as the breakup happens and you cast off again

Thanks …?

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Wow, what a strange twist! When we're self-contained in the Med anchorages, my wife and I spend less than $1000 per month.

But we aspire to spend much more and become $6000 per month cruisers!

That’s OK Ken. I’m a mere mortal. From all your posts on this stuff you appear to be made of fairy dust. But to be clear, when we’re self-contained on the boat we don’t spend anything. How would we?

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

+1
That’s OK Ken. I’m a mere mortal. From all your posts on this stuff you appear to be made of fairy dust. But to be clear, when we’re self-contained on the boat in we don’t spend anything. How would we?

We rarely go into marinas, maybe once a month. Produce our own elctricity and water. Our only expense is fuel and food, some of which we catch with a fishing rod/reel. You must eat more than we do if you're spending $1500 per month, using up more than your fair share of the Earth's finite resources.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We rarely go into marinas, maybe once a month. Produce our own elctricity and water. Our only expense is fuel and food, some of which we catch with a fishing rod/reel. You must eat more than we do if you're spending $1500 per month, using up more than your fair share of the Earth's finite resources.

If I could get down to $1,500/week at the moment I'd be happy....boat refits grrrrrrr.....the way I'm going getting below that will happen naturally ie. the money running out!

BTW Ken I trump you on all battery solar accounts, 660amp/hr, 480w boat and 20kw on factory/gym building:-)

Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Simi 60]

I haven't read every post yet but birth rate is one thing, what's the death rate?

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We rarely go into marinas, maybe once a month. Produce our own elctricity and water. Our only expense is fuel and food, some of which we catch with a fishing rod/reel. You must eat more than we do if you're spending $1500 per month, using up more than your fair share of the Earth's finite resources.

On the other hand... according to your own figures and my observation, The Med is half the cost of where Mike and others sail..

So all things being equal, he is spending $750 a month in real terms and is $250 a month in front of you...

Price of food is no indicator of consumption if is not a level playing field.

Just sayin'.