Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 13-07-2019, 09:00   #61
Registered User
 
Group9's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,425
Images: 10
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by anotherT34C View Post
About when did police become known as "law enforcement"? Don't remember that as a kid. I remember "protect and serve"...
Around 1776, you know executive branch, and all. That’s how LEOs protect and serve, by enforcing the laws that the elected representatives of the people enact.
__________________

__________________
Founding member of the controversial Calypso rock band, Guns & Anchors!
Group9 is offline  
Old 13-07-2019, 09:56   #62
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Jacksonville/ out cruising
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 30,684
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by anotherT34C View Post
I don't remember them being referred to as "law enforcement officers" when I was younger. That seems to be a recent development, at least in the NE of USA. Might (or not) have some relation to their own perception of themselves in relation to the rest of the population, or in the populations' perception of them.


There has been a lot of rebranding lately, often I believe by the opposition, but sometimes not.
That and the rewriting of history has been interesting.
As Societies beliefs and values have changed, history I guess must change also.
__________________

a64pilot is online now  
Old 13-07-2019, 13:43   #63
Senior Cruiser
 
GordMay's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 38,198
Images: 241
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Gardner.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is online now  
Old 13-07-2019, 14:27   #64
Senior Cruiser
 
StuM's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Port Moresby,Papua New Guinea
Boat: FP Belize Maestro 43 and OPB
Posts: 10,184
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
COP is an acronym for 'constable on patrol.'

That's an urban legend (or backronym)


https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/cop-talk/


"“Cop” has long existed as a verb meaning “to take or seize,” but it didn’t begin to make the linguistic shifts necessary to turn it into a casual term for “police officer” until the mid-19th century. The first example of ‘cop’ taking the meaning “to arrest” appeared in print around 1844, and the word then swiftly moved from being solely a verb for “take into police custody” to also encompassing a noun referring to the one doing the detaining. By 1846, policemen were being described as “coppers,” the ‘-er’ ending having been appended to the “arrest” form of the verb, and by 1859 “coppers” were also being called “cops,” the latter word a shortening of the former.
StuM is offline  
Old 13-07-2019, 14:44   #65
Registered User
 
stillbuilding's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Boat: Custom Freya 20m
Posts: 1,020
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post

COP is an acronym for 'constable on patrol.'

.

There would appear to be evidence that the derivation of “cop” is more complicated than this.

“Copper” was in common use for police in 17th century England and may have derivation from then local custom derivations, from French, Latin or other European languages. Certainly a copper or cop was in common use in Australia In 1950’s to describe police.

“Cop that you bastard” was similarly used to describe retribution.

My guess is that present usage has its derivations in the depths of time.
stillbuilding is offline  
Old 13-07-2019, 15:01   #66
Senior Cruiser
 
StuM's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Port Moresby,Papua New Guinea
Boat: FP Belize Maestro 43 and OPB
Posts: 10,184
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by stillbuilding View Post
“Copper” was in common use for police in 17th century England and may have derivation from then local custom derivations, from French, Latin or other European languages.

Police in England in the 1600's? I doubt that. Nightwatchmen maybe.
StuM is offline  
Old 13-07-2019, 15:12   #67
Sempre Avanti
 
IslandHopper's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bundaberg Queensland, Australia.....
Boat: 45ft Ketch
Posts: 1,872
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

My great, great great Grandfather was a 'Peeler' back in the old Country....
__________________
“Look out the window, look at the chart, and look at the GPS,”.....“In that order.”
IslandHopper is offline  
Old 13-07-2019, 23:52   #68
Registered User
 
stillbuilding's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Boat: Custom Freya 20m
Posts: 1,020
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by StuM View Post
Police in England in the 1600's? I doubt that. Nightwatchmen maybe.


Yeah, you are probably correct-

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4076.jpg
Views:	70
Size:	296.1 KB
ID:	195893

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4075.jpg
Views:	71
Size:	161.3 KB
ID:	195894
stillbuilding is offline  
Old 14-07-2019, 00:24   #69
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 74
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

The correlation / causation point is good. Irrespective of whether the number is accurate, it's clear that the more people who support a movement for change, the more likely it is to be successful. Governments such as those in China and Russia managing public opinion by wholly reshaping reality show you how keen they are to avoid movements for change.

As far as this not being about sailing, it's an off topic section and sailors are a good group to discuss heavy topics with. I left the last politics group I was in because it was full of Trumpites and Liberals yelling at each other.
philaw is offline  
Old 14-07-2019, 00:38   #70
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,762
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by anotherT34C View Post
I suppose if I'm in an unfamiliar town, I have no qualms about asking a policeman for directions, but I'm less inclined towards a "law enforcement officer", wearing Oakleys, a buzz cut and no cap. Seems decidedly less friendly or helpful.

Law Enforcement Officer is just a generic term that covers all the varieties of enforcement officials (police, sheriff, etc.) It's a convenience/generic term used by the media and agencies, not an actual organization.
letsgetsailing3 is offline  
Old 14-07-2019, 05:07   #71
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Boat: Baba 40
Posts: 815
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

It (term LEO) seems more of a deliberate rebranding, to help promote the image of the so called 'warrior cop'. Probably Hollywood played an important part, but if the result is police shifting their perception of their job away from 'serve the public' and towards 'law enforcement', I'm not sure that's a good thing.
anotherT34C is online now  
Old 14-07-2019, 05:56   #72
Registered User
 
Mike OReilly's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 8,281
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by Group9 View Post
...What was startling was that a populace that was nonplussed by the killing of an innocent by a drug trafficker, would become enraged when a violent felon was killed by the police. Culture value difference to the max.
I appreciate your frustration here Group, but I take comfort in the enragement. Felons are not expected to act with honour, nor within the confines of the law. Police certainly are.

As I know you know (better than me), police are one of the few agencies given state sanction to use violence against the citizenry. This is no small license, and should always be held tightly in check.
__________________
Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG: www.helplink.com/CLAFC
Mike OReilly is offline  
Old 14-07-2019, 06:01   #73
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 6,229
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

I have several LEOs in my family. And I can tell you they definitely serve and protect all of us. And the completely backwards idea that law enforcement officers are a greater threat to a civil society than the criminals from whom they protect us is so screwed up it’s impossible to comprehend.
transmitterdan is offline  
Old 14-07-2019, 06:43   #74
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 7,697
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Is the original premise true or is the definition of "civil resistance" faulty for the purposes of the study?

Non-violent civil disobedience typically implies a carefully considered plan put developed ahead of time.

Violent civil disobedience can be broken down into two categories:
- Carefully thought out plan (say the American Revolution)
- For lack of a better term, emotional outbursts with little or no planning in reaction to some perceived atrocity.

I suspect it's more the planning aspect that affects success than the violence or lack thereof. Since not many people reacting emotionally go all non-violent on somebody, it creates the appearance that it's more effective.
valhalla360 is online now  
Old 16-07-2019, 03:02   #75
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 9,053
Re: Nonviolent Civil Resistance - The 3.5% Rule

Quote:
Originally Posted by valhalla360 View Post
Is the original premise true or is the definition of "civil resistance" faulty for the purposes of the study?

Non-violent civil disobedience typically implies a carefully considered plan put developed ahead of time.

Violent civil disobedience can be broken down into two categories:
- Carefully thought out plan (say the American Revolution)
- For lack of a better term, emotional outbursts with little or no planning in reaction to some perceived atrocity.

I suspect it's more the planning aspect that affects success than the violence or lack thereof. Since not many people reacting emotionally go all non-violent on somebody, it creates the appearance that it's more effective.
It seems today that it really doesn't matter if the disobedience turns violent or remains peaceful to effect Change

Social Media has become such a powerful and LOUD tool in the hands of many that changes are happening at a much faster pace than ever before.

Conversations have become far more Polarized.
Attitudes and outlooks Darker, so that factions of protesters can become violent yet the cause is not diminished as others spin the reasons in 24hr News cycles

People no longer just disagree, they demonize!

It is now a much sadder world where group intimidation and social bullying is in itself psycholocally violent
__________________

Pelagic is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
rule

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Civil Asset Forfeiture ... A Civil Discussion .... SURV69 Our Community 13 15-12-2017 14:12
Rule Hose (for Rule Pumps) kjames Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 3 09-01-2012 05:51

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:34.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.