Hull cleaning dangers

[stillbuilding]

Can anyone direct me to the medical science dealing with the hyperbaric risks of hull cleaning (while using hookah)?

I know this has been covered previously on the forum but cannot find the threads.

Do risks increase with time immersed, age, medical conditions?

Serious enough to justify having an observer present?

Amy precursor physical signs?

Thanks in advance

[senormechanico]

Maybe if you are cleaning a huge ship or nuclear submarine with a 40' draft and huge underwater area which would take hours and hours, but not the run of the mill cruiser's boat with 6 foot draft.


Just IMHO.

[Trvlmedic]

Ironically I just spent two hours yesterday cleaning my cat at a depth of 4' with an engine driven hookah and I haven't felt any side effects at all at all at all. But in all seriousness, being a rescue diver, it is always a good idea to have a safety diver or partner. For example, yesterday my friend cleaned from the waterline to 18-24" below via snorkel and I did everything below via the hookah. All the while watching each other. You are less than one atmosphere of depth and as long as you continue to breath normally you shouldn't have any problems. The fact that you are posing this question on a forum, tells me you may not have any formal dive training such as a PADI course and I highly recommend it before you utilize any compressed air devices especially engine driven.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by Trvlmedic

The fact that you are posing this question on a forum, tells me you may not have any formal dive training such as a PADI course and I highly recommend it before you utilize any compressed air devices especially engine driven.

+1. Added characters.

[stillbuilding]

I ask because in conversation with a knowledgeable friend he mentioned that his brother nearly died when he was hyperventilating and then competing in underwater swimming. Lost consciousness and lucky to be pulled out of the pool by a friend. I was wondering if similar could occur with the exertion of cleaning the hull even with hookah.

[stillbuilding]

Agree should always have an observer.

[MLOI]

Originally Posted by stillbuilding

I ask because in conversation with a knowledgeable friend he mentioned that his brother nearly died when he was hyperventilating and then competing in underwater swimming. Lost consciousness and lucky to be pulled out of the pool by a friend. I was wondering if similar could occur with the exertion of cleaning the hull even with hookah.

For this example -no. Hookah does not present this risk.

What happened to your friends brother was due to the urge to breathe being driven by the presence of CO2 (as carbolic acid in the blood), rather than by the absence of Oxygen.
Sustained hyperventilation purges all the CO2 from your body, but doesn't actually add much O2. So when you then exert yourself underwater, you can use up all the O2, before the carbolic acid levels rise high enough to trigger the need to breath at an urgent level. Not enough O2 (equivalent to breathing gas at < 10% O2 ) and you lose consciousness. Not a great thing underwater.

The only realistic <diving>risks from using a hookah to clean boats is that of impure air from something like exhaust fumes, or baurotrauma from holding your breath at depth and not exhaling on the way up. Both are pretty minor risks, the pressure change is only ~ 0.2 of an ata.
The risk I most worry about is getting run over by another boat. And that's where I think scuba makes it a bit safer than freediving, as you can be sure to only surface somewhere protected. I also worry a little about the crap I'm swimming in, both literal and other chemicals. The risk of diving by myself is not a concern at all.

Mike

[Uncle Bob]

Originally Posted by stillbuilding

I ask because in conversation with a knowledgeable friend he mentioned that his brother nearly died when he was hyperventilating and then competing in underwater swimming. Lost consciousness and lucky to be pulled out of the pool by a friend. I was wondering if similar could occur with the exertion of cleaning the hull even with hookah.

Ah, no. Done many a hull scrub when I was diving and no problems ever.
Have to second the advice to do a course and learn all about it!!

[Steve Bean]

MLOI has given an excellent explanation of a danger called "shallow water blackout," caused by intentionally hyperventilating to hold your breath longer. With a hookah you don't need to hold your breath at all; you just breathe the air supplied by the hookah. I suggest an internet search for "shallow water blackout." When free diving, do not hyperventilate to try to hold your breath longer!

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by Trvlmedic

The fact that you are posing this question on a forum, tells me you may not have any formal dive training...

Ditto on the above. Barotrauma is a serious issue, and can kill you, even from just 4-5 feet underwater. Though some people refuse to believe it, the fact is that with a hookah system you ARE breathing compressed air. I would recommend dive training to anyone who does anything that involves breathing compressed air underwater.


The hyperventilating and almost passing out thing is a different matter all together. It has nothing to do with using a hookah or not. So long as you don't deliberately hyperventilate, this is a complete non-issue as regards hookah diving.

[stillbuilding]

Originally Posted by Steve Bean

MLOI has given an excellent explanation of a danger called "shallow water blackout," caused by intentionally hyperventilating to hold your breath longer. With a hookah you don't need to hold your breath at all; you just breathe the air supplied by the hookah. I suggest an internet search for "shallow water blackout." When free diving, do not hyperventilate to try to hold your breath longer!

Thanks for that reference. Lots of good info and description of deep free diving issues as well as shallow water blackout.

I do think an amateur diver could accidentally not breathe correctly while concentrating on hull cleaning and have some risk so the understanding of shallow water blackout is important.

I will certainly clean my hull at some stage but will do a bit more study first and ensure I have a competent observer.

Thanks again.

[svlamorocha]

Originally Posted by MLOI

What happened to your friends brother was due to the urge to breathe being driven by the presence of CO2 (as carbolic acid in the blood), rather than by the absence of Oxygen.
Sustained hyperventilation purges all the CO2 from your body, but doesn't actually add much O2. So when you then exert yourself underwater, you can use up all the O2, before the carbolic acid levels rise high enough to trigger the need to breath at an urgent level. Not enough O2 (equivalent to breathing gas at < 10% O2 ) and you lose consciousness. Not a great thing underwater.

Carbolic acid has nothing to do with this. I bet you meant to write "carbonic" acid.

[Spot]

To add on to Trvlmedic's post:
I would contact your local dive shop and see if they offer a 'Discover SCUBA' type class.
If I remember correctly, it was only 25$ USD for 2-3 hours time, part on land and part in a pool breathing off a tank and regulator setup. It was by no means certification but it did give background information and some time breathing underwater. I think we learned to clear a mask and snorkel and making sure the first stage was turned on and purging the second stage (the gizmo that has the hose thingy and the other thingy that goes in your mouth).

https://www.padi.com/courses/discover-scuba-diving

After enjoying the 'disco' class I got certified for Open Water.

[fstbttms]

I've been hull cleaning on hookah for almost 25 years and I'm 100% OK!

[MLOI]

Originally Posted by svlamorocha

Carbolic acid has nothing to do with this. I bet you meant to write "carbonic" acid.

Right you are, memory like one of those things you use to drain spaghetti.

Mike