FCC and In Flight calls

[zboss]

As a business traveller... I really HOPE.. actually PRAY... that the FCC does NOT allow in flight calls.

One of the most blissful times on a flight is when the loudmouth important guy sitting next to me has to turn off his phone and I can finally get some sleep after a rough work week.

Please PLEASE keep cell phones off during flight!

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by zboss

As a business traveller... I really HOPE.. actually PRAY... that the FCC does NOT allow in flight calls.

One of the most blissful times on a flight is when the loudmouth important guy sitting next to me has to turn off his phone and I can finally get some sleep after a rough work week.

Please PLEASE keep cell phones off during flight!

Ryanair tried it for a while about 3 years ago , costs made the take up too low. Hopefully costs will keep the adoption down. I think in general I'd prefer to see WiFi then cell , I see one or two airlines offering wifi.

Dave

[zboss]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Ryanair tried it for a while about 3 years ago , costs made the take up too low. Hopefully costs will keep the adoption down. I think in general I'd prefer to see WiFi then cell , I see one or two airlines offering wifi.

Dave

I use wifi all the time in flight. It is awesome, especialy for cross country flights.

I am specifically speaking about inflight cell phone calls, not the phones that sit in the backrest of the seat in front of you.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by zboss

I use wifi all the time in flight. It is awesome, especialy for cross country flights.

I am specifically speaking about inflight cell phone calls, not the phones that sit in the backrest of the seat in front of you.

I was specifically talking about inflight mobile phones. Seat back ones never made it to Europe. Ryanair installed gsm cells on several 737. A little phone symbol ( like the toilet occupied) would come on after takeoff. I think they ran it for about a year , 2-3 years ago. Was too expensive for the average Ryanair punter lol.

Dave

[pbiJim]

I travel a lot too. I've been on many flights that had the in-flight phones with the credit card slots on them. They almost never got used.

Even if the FCC allows the use of cell phones, the airlines will still have the ability to ban their use as a point of policy. I expect that is what would happen.

All that aside, the chances of getting a useable cell signal above 30,000 feet are pretty slim.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by pbiJim

I travel a lot too. I've been on many flights that had the in-flight phones with the credit card slots on them. They almost never got used.

Even if the FCC allows the use of cell phones, the airlines will still have the ability to ban their use as a point of policy. I expect that is what would happen.

All that aside, the chances of getting a useable cell signal above 30,000 feet are pretty slim.

The system used on Ryanair , I believe is similar to the systems used on ships , ie a small GSM cell is created by a system then linking to a satellite. It's works very well on board the aircraft. The system doesn't and can't pick up terrestrial cell broadcasts. Even though the pricing model allowed free incoming texts , at € 0.50 , ie 50 cent an outgoing text, there wasn't many takers. After about a year Ryanair removed the equipment.

I've used the same systems aboard passenger ships & ferries and again the costs are quite prohibitive

Again the system only works , with specialised sat links on the aircraft, hence it's a revenue decision for the airline . My understanding certainly in Europe , Is that the actual prohibition on use of phones is in take off and landing. Their use in flight is a function of airline policy.

Dave

[pbiJim]

When flying small single-engine planes, I've always left my cell phone on & never noticed any interference with the navigational or communications equipment that was on board. This goes back as far as the old 1980's era analog phones & includes today's smart phones. That would tend to suggest that perhaps the whole technical argument against allowing cell phones to be used on planes has always been a bunch of hog wash.

[zboss]

Originally Posted by pbiJim

When flying small single-engine planes, I've always left my cell phone on & never noticed any interference with the navigational or communications equipment that was on board. This goes back as far as the old 1980's era analog phones & includes today's smart phones. That would tend to suggest that perhaps the whole technical argument against allowing cell phones to be used on planes has always been a bunch of hog wash.

If a simple cell phone call could cause a passenger plane to crash, terrorists would have used it years ago.

With that said... I think its only a matter of time until the systems on board the new Boeing jets are hijacked from on board the plane.

[Stu Jackson]

Interesting info on interference, perceived or real.

I, however, thought the OP was simply about the airlines allowing phone calls during flights.

I agree. A horrible idea. It's bad enough on the ground.

[roverhi]

The majority of passengers don't want voice calls as well as the flight attendant unions. Hopefully the airlines will not allow it. Texting is fine but voice will lead to a raft of disturbances on the planes. The occasional drunk we get now will turn into an LA Freeway of incidents. Just flew last weekend first class on a mileage upgrade. A women as far away as she could be in the first class cabin was so loud on her phone I had difficulty hearing the flight attendant to order the pre take off beverage. Yeah, I know flying first class is hell. Can't imagine a plane full of these idiots screaming into their phones.

It appears that the technology for airborne cell phones has been around for a decade and cell phones were never a problem for the aircraft systems. The government(s) are just getting out regulating cell phone usage.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by pbiJim

When flying small single-engine planes, I've always left my cell phone on & never noticed any interference with the navigational or communications equipment that was on board. This goes back as far as the old 1980's era analog phones & includes today's smart phones. That would tend to suggest that perhaps the whole technical argument against allowing cell phones to be used on planes has always been a bunch of hog wash.

As a licensed avionics engineer (and pilot), I can provide some first experience in general aviation (GA) aircraft.

It is really really difficult to get your average cell phone to cause any problem with the aircraft avionics but it does happen. I would suggest 99.99% (even 99.999%) of the time, there is no interference but again I have witnessed a couple of occurrences. On two occasions, it was possible to get some minor fluctuations on a nav indicator and once, a cell phone shut down the engine fuel computer on a R22 helicopter causing a autorotation - that one was serious. Interestingly only one one particular handset would cause the problem and only on one helicopter.

I have seen computers / tablets cause minor interference in PA systems.

So it isn't much of an issue in GA and my gut feeling is that it would be less of an issue on airline transport aircraft; however I don't have first hand experience on heavy metal.

Still...who wants to be the first one to experience a serious incident...

[transmitterdan]

The FCC is only issuing a proposed rule. They believe that technology is good enough that a microcell fed via satellite link will not interfere with radio equipment on board and on ground. That is all they are required to do under commerce department rules.

It is up to FAA to determine safety issues such as when calls can be made without affecting passenger safety. Further, airlines will have to decide if economic issues warrant installing the hardware.

The telcos want this because they offer high speed data services via smart phones. It is likely they can make more money by offering LTE or other data services. They don't much care if voice is not allowed during flight.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Wotname

As a licensed avionics engineer (and pilot), I can provide some first experience in general aviation (GA) aircraft.

It is really really difficult to get your average cell phone to cause any problem with the aircraft avionics but it does happen. I would suggest 99.99% (even 99.999%) of the time, there is no interference but again I have witnessed a couple of occurrences. On two occasions, it was possible to get some minor fluctuations on a nav indicator and once, a cell phone shut down the engine fuel computer on a R22 helicopter causing a autorotation - that one was serious. Interestingly only one one particular handset would cause the problem and only on one helicopter.

I have seen computers / tablets cause minor interference in PA systems.

So it isn't much of an issue in GA and my gut feeling is that it would be less of an issue on airline transport aircraft; however I don't have first hand experience on heavy metal.

Still...who wants to be the first one to experience a serious incident...

Sorry so why did one of the worlds largest Airlines , Ryanair , have no problem allowing a whole plane to use mobile phones.

The interference issue is just bumfluff

Dave

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Sorry so why did one of the worlds largest Airlines , Ryanair , have no problem allowing a whole plane to use mobile phones.

The interference issue is just bumfluff

Dave

Don't be sorry ,

I agree with you that it isn't really an issue but I can say I have personally seen a couple instances of interference in GA aircraft. As previously posted, two were minor and one was major (commanding the single engine in a helicopter to go to idle), so I can't agree that it "never" happens. Conversely I have seen thousands of times when it doesn't happen (we test for EMI / RFI every time new equipment is installed).

Again, GA observations do not directly relate to airline transport.

I have no information what / how / why Ryanair did or didn't do to ensure their flight safety (technical or procedural) ; presumably they satisfied their and the regulator's safety requirements.

[sartorst]

If cell phones dont effect other electronic devises why is it that just prier to my phone ringing my computer screen compresses slightly and a sound is heard in the speakers then the phone rings? this does not always happen but sometimes