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Old 13-01-2021, 07:24   #1246
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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You might be surprised about how 'easy' it is sometimes to find LP for the RV. Just a mile or so....

well some campgrounds sell it, and it seems like it would be easy....but I've had plenty of times when it took some serious doing to find a fill when I wanted to top off.



For what it's worth, I wasn't paying close attention but I do think the Lavagabond girl did mention something about starting to stash a spare bottle from now on...

My take.... they had options for uncooked meals and are likely taking the decision to simplify, save weight, or whatever.... and were stretching the fill planning to fill at the next port .....

Actually I am familiar with how easy it is to find LP on land versus at sea because I regularly buy it for my gas grills in 2 locations and of course for my boat. I can’t believe you’re even trying to make that comparison. On land it would be pretty hard to find a place that an RV might go in the whole US where you couldn’t replace your LP before your next meal if you wanted to, and usually within just a mile or so down the road. Campgrounds, gas stations, hardware stores, building supply stores, big box stores, etc. commonly sell the stuff. It sea, when you run out, you might be several days or even more before you get to land where you have the opportunity to refill and even then, you’ve still got to figure out how to get it from the refill facility to the dock without a vehicle to transport it in. The weight of a spare tank or a couple of the little quart sized ones is trivial on a yacht like La Vag.
Sure, we can all survive just fine without cooked meals or with using the exhaust manifold for heat, but with very minimal planning you shouldn’t have to on a million dollar yacht.
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Old 13-01-2021, 08:17   #1247
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

Perhaps...just perhaps... the marina where they were before departure didn't have convenient access, and they would have had to rent a car, carry it some long distance, or whatever....
meanwhile, their targeted destination marina reports LP fills on site...and just to sweeten the deal let's say at a significantly cheaper price!
+ it was only a short passage of a day or three or whatever.... and maybe we've got some canned food that's getting old and needs to be eaten....so take the chance.
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Old 13-01-2021, 10:10   #1248
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Perhaps...just perhaps... the marina where they were before departure didn't have convenient access, and they would have had to rent a car, carry it some long distance, or whatever....
meanwhile, their targeted destination marina reports LP fills on site...and just to sweeten the deal let's say at a significantly cheaper price!
+ it was only a short passage of a day or three or whatever.... and maybe we've got some canned food that's getting old and needs to be eaten....so take the chance.


Your “perhaps” scenario is yet another reason why it would be a lot more prudent to have some kind of backup system other than the engine manifold for cooking. When cruising on a boat, even coastal cruising like in your “perhaps” scenario it’s not always easy or practical to dash off and refill an empty propane tank and it’s even more unattainable when offshore. I try to be cost conscious too, but are you REALLY going to choose to attempt to cook on your engine manifold for 2 or 3 days in order to avoid paying even double the $20 typical cost of refilling your propane tank?! On a million dollar boat like theirs it’s not just about surviving but rather living comfortably and since most people enjoy eating cooked food, I think it’s pretty shortsighted to not have some other plan in place to be able to cook their food for at least a few days when their single propane tank inevitably runs out. A second propane tank like most boats that size have, or a couple small tanks with the appropriate adapter, or even a $50 hot plate they could run off of their inverter seems to me as better alternatives than being unable to cook in the galley.

I don’t watch their videos and am not making any judgment on their overall seamanship but this lack of any reasonable backup cooking plan for when their single propane tank runs out, as well as their attention grabbing circus stunt of crossing the North Atlantic with their infant onboard late last fall tells me that they don’t always think things through very well. So there are several other utube cruisers that I think are more worthwhile to watch in the limited amount of time I want to devote to that sort of thing.
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Old 13-01-2021, 10:46   #1249
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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...but this lack of any reasonable backup cooking plan for when their single propane tank runs out, as well as their attention grabbing circus stunt of crossing the North Atlantic with their infant onboard late last fall tells me that they don’t always think things through very well.
I am not going to defend Riley as I have always thought of him as a bit of a doof (but who am I to judge), but your inclusion of the above comment shows that your opinions are a bit suspect and definitely predisposed to a particular point of view...

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So there are several other utube cruisers that I think are more worthwhile to watch in the limited amount of time I want to devote to that sort of thing.
Exactly. So your Vagabonde denigrating is to what purpose? Horses for courses...
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Old 13-01-2021, 11:47   #1250
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Originally Posted by jtsailjt View Post
...I had a boat with room for only one propane tank in the propane locker but I wanted a backup supply available so I could still cook when it ran out. So I got a fitting that cost about $10 that would allow me to attach the little quart bottles to my system and kept a couple of them laying on top of my main propane tank. They’d get me by until my next opportunity to fill the main tank.
Voila. An easy backup without the weight or space of another full size tank.

This is what I was suggesting that La Vagabond could have / should have thought about in advance when they set up their boat.

"Hey we want to save weight and not have 2 big heavy tank (ok fine), but hey let's have an adapter and a small extra tank as a backup just in case (better)".

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Old 13-01-2021, 12:31   #1251
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

I just watch some of these videos once in a while when I miss my sailing vacations and get curious. I'll admit to being attracted to the bikinis too. Who doesn't like good scenery? Also I admit to being a bit jealous, or maybe envious, but I still generally think "Good for them!" I don't begrudge them being able to live that kind of life. I just have no intention of paying for it. I don't believe you have to pay anything to subscribe to a YouTube channel. Sorry, I don't feel guilty for not sponsoring them, just like I don't feel guilty about fast forwarding through commercials on TV.

Maybe Im a bad person...
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Old 13-01-2021, 13:34   #1252
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

What this is, is a new media format: you've never had the opportunity to take $30/month, and give a dollar each to 30 different shows you enjoy. Lubbers complain about having a $100 cable bill and their favorite shows always getting cancelled. Well, now they can take a program they like and directly put a dollar (or five) in their pockets: more than whatever share they'd have got of a $100 cable bill, I can tell you that.. There are few if any sailing programs on TV because it's much more profitable to make The Real Housewives of Below Deck on the Deadliest Catch, so cancel that garbage and directly subsidize a creator or 10. Sure, the "Like and Subscribe" is annoying but it isn't more annoying than commercials!

The ones that go overboard with fanservice or who get too haughty are not my cup of tea, but I wish them well and I'm glad we have the opportunity to directly support things we enjoy rather than take whatever gets jammed in our face by CableCo or Netflix. When one gets snotty at the bar or fouls my anchor line I'll pass judgement. Till then, best of luck.

P.S. They also test the latest crap from vendors and make rookie mistakes so we don't have to! I'll take it.
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Old 13-01-2021, 14:28   #1253
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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I am not going to defend Riley as I have always thought of him as a bit of a doof (but who am I to judge), but your inclusion of the above comment shows that your opinions are a bit suspect and definitely predisposed to a particular point of view...







Exactly. So your Vagabonde denigrating is to what purpose? Horses for courses...


Isn’t an expression of a particular point of view pretty much the definition of an opinion?

I don’t there’s much left to ‘suspect’ since I think my use of the phrase “circus stunt” pretty much characterized just how I feel about anyone who would voluntarily take an infant into an environment where if all doesn’t go well all the adults will climb into their survival suits and likely be fine a day or so later when someone shows up to fish them out of the drink. But since they don’t make infant sized survival suits, how long do you think an infant would survive floating around in the North Atlantic in the late fall, which is also the season when gales are common? If they managed to launch a liferaft, in any kind of seas, with the boat sinking and the liferaft banging against it or drifting away from it, how do you get an infant from the panic and confusion of a sinking boat into the liferaft without injuring it or at a minimum exposing it to some pretty cold water and then cold air? I’m all for kids going cruising and realize countless couples have done it safely, but when the child is still so young that it’s so vulnerable to everything, hopefully most of them have sense enough to take a few years off from making such risky crossings during the season thats known to be dangerous in the area where they are sailing. So yes, you are right that I am ‘predisposed’ against anyone who subjects an infant to excessive unnecessary risk such as an out of season ocean crossing, no doubt about it.

The purpose of my Vagabond ‘denigrating’ is to express my opinion regarding a few specific things that they’ve done that I’ve been made aware of by others posts. Ive limited my comments to just these things because I’m not aware of much else about them or how they usually sail their boat. I’ve also made some other posts in this thread about other utube cruisers who have done things that I feel are admirable or who I’ve learned from. I believe both are in the spirit of the subject of this thread, discussing and expressing our opinions of the good, the bad, the ugly, (and the not so ugly wearing bikinis) amongst various utube cruisers.
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Old 13-01-2021, 19:35   #1254
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Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Originally Posted by Bullshooter View Post
I just watch some of these videos once in a while when I miss my sailing vacations and get curious. I'll admit to being attracted to the bikinis too. Who doesn't like good scenery? Also I admit to being a bit jealous, or maybe envious, but I still generally think "Good for them!" I don't begrudge them being able to live that kind of life. I just have no intention of paying for it. I don't believe you have to pay anything to subscribe to a YouTube channel. Sorry, I don't feel guilty for not sponsoring them, just like I don't feel guilty about fast forwarding through commercials on TV.

Maybe Im a bad person...


Bad person? No, I would say an absolutely normal person.
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Old 13-01-2021, 21:27   #1255
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Originally Posted by jtsailjt View Post
Isn’t an expression of a particular point of view pretty much the definition of an opinion?

I don’t there’s much left to ‘suspect’ since I think my use of the phrase “circus stunt” pretty much characterized just how I feel about anyone who would voluntarily take an infant into an environment where if all doesn’t go well all the adults will climb into their survival suits and likely be fine a day or so later when someone shows up to fish them out of the drink. But since they don’t make infant sized survival suits, how long do you think an infant would survive floating around in the North Atlantic in the late fall, which is also the season when gales are common? If they managed to launch a liferaft, in any kind of seas, with the boat sinking and the liferaft banging against it or drifting away from it, how do you get an infant from the panic and confusion of a sinking boat into the liferaft without injuring it or at a minimum exposing it to some pretty cold water and then cold air? I’m all for kids going cruising and realize countless couples have done it safely, but when the child is still so young that it’s so vulnerable to everything, hopefully most of them have sense enough to take a few years off from making such risky crossings during the season thats known to be dangerous in the area where they are sailing. So yes, you are right that I am ‘predisposed’ against anyone who subjects an infant to excessive unnecessary risk such as an out of season ocean crossing, no doubt about it.

The purpose of my Vagabond ‘denigrating’ is to express my opinion regarding a few specific things that they’ve done that I’ve been made aware of by others posts. I've limited my comments to just these things because I’m not aware of much else about them or how they usually sail their boat. I’ve also made some other posts in this thread about other utube cruisers who have done things that I feel are admirable or who I’ve learned from. I believe both are in the spirit of the subject of this thread, discussing and expressing our opinions of the good, the bad, the ugly, (and the not so ugly wearing bikinis) amongst various utube cruisers.
They did have the foresight to hire a clipper race skipper as crew on the crossing. That definitely adds an extra margin of safety in my book.

Probably not a trip the more safety conscious would have done but it wasn't exactly a suicide mission either.
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Old 14-01-2021, 09:54   #1256
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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They did have the foresight to hire a clipper race skipper as crew on the crossing. That definitely adds an extra margin of safety in my book.



Probably not a trip the more safety conscious would have done but it wasn't exactly a suicide mission either.


I’ll give you that it wasn’t exactly suicidal, but IMHO also not how you treat a young, fragile, human life in your care either.

According to an article about this voyage based on a crew interview, near the end of the La Vagabond crossing they had winds forecast at 40-60 knots with 6-8 meter seas, not unusual for this time of year in the North Atlantic. Would you knowingly take your infant child out sailing in conditions like that in a boat like La Vagabond? Do you understand that even a professionally crewed boat is at increased risk of the boat being damaged in these conditions and how much the helmsman margin of error shrinks? Then check out the North Atlantic pilot chart for June in this area. Wouldn’t you prefer to take your young family sailing in those conditions?

They make more money from their videos than probably all but a few posters on this site have ever made and good for them for figuring out how to make a very good living while cruising on a very nice boat. I understand that they need a little melodrama and excitement to set themselves apart and keep their audience interested, but when they start doing things that put their infant baby at unnecessary risk in order to add to the attention they get, then I think they are very misguided. When Greta put out her tweet that she wanted a ride across the North Atlantic in November, dozens if not hundreds of large cruising sailboat owners along the US east coast became aware of this tweet but nobody else volunteered to take her, not because they are uncaring or would mind having her aboard, but because they took a look at the pilot charts and knew that a November/December crossing was foolish and potentially dangerous. La Vagabond undoubtedly knew this too but I think the difference is that they also knew they could monetize the voyage and get even more clicks and $$ than they already were and they were right because now pretty much everyone in the world has read about them and they’ve gained many thousands of fan$ who had never heard of them. But by doing so I think they put their young child at unnecessary risk so I won’t be among those who contribute to supporting them, not that they’ll likely notice.
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Old 14-01-2021, 10:01   #1257
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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I’ll give you that it wasn’t exactly suicidal, but IMHO also not how you treat a young, fragile, human life in your care either.

According to an article about this voyage based on a crew interview, near the end of the La Vagabond crossing they had winds forecast at 40-60 knots with 6-8 meter seas, not unusual for this time of year in the North Atlantic. Would you knowingly take your infant child out sailing in conditions like that in a boat like La Vagabond? Do you understand that even a professionally crewed boat is at increased risk of the boat being damaged in these conditions and how much the helmsman margin of error shrinks? Then check out the North Atlantic pilot chart for June in this area. Wouldn’t you prefer to take your young family sailing in those conditions?

They make more money from their videos than probably all but a few posters on this site have ever made and good for them for figuring out how to make a very good living while cruising on a very nice boat. I understand that they need a little melodrama and excitement to set themselves apart and keep their audience interested, but when they start doing things that put their infant baby at unnecessary risk in order to add to the attention they get, then I think they are very misguided. When Greta put out her tweet that she wanted a ride across the North Atlantic in November, dozens if not hundreds of large cruising sailboat owners along the US east coast became aware of this tweet but nobody else volunteered to take her, not because they are uncaring or would mind having her aboard, but because they took a look at the pilot charts and knew that a November/December crossing was foolish and potentially dangerous. La Vagabond undoubtedly knew this too but I think the difference is that they also knew they could monetize the voyage and get even more clicks and $$ than they already were and they were right because now pretty much everyone in the world has read about them and they’ve gained many thousands of fan$ who had never heard of them. But by doing so I think they put their young child at unnecessary risk so I won’t be among those who contribute to supporting them, not that they’ll likely notice.
I think we know your opinion by now.

My opinion is they did what they wanted for their own reasons and good on 'em for doing just that.
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Old 14-01-2021, 16:46   #1258
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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I think we know your opinion by now.



My opinion is they did what they wanted for their own reasons and good on 'em for doing just that.


And since you made your “horses for courses” comment regarding this issue in a previous post, I think “we” already knew your opinion too, prior to this “beating a dead horse” post. I can’t help but wonder what could possibly be next in your horsey trite phrase lineup? Something about a horses a$$ I perhaps? My feelings would be SO hurt!

Isn’t pretty much everything done by every person “done for their own reasons” (yet another trite phrase) but do you think that because according to you it was not done for somebody else’s reason that makes it a good thing, or do you actually think it’s a good idea to take an infant sailing across the North Atlantic in November and December? I’m genuinely curious because you haven’t really said. You’ve made it clear that you don’t like the fact that I was critical of them for doing this and have tried to explain why, but you haven’t really said whether that’s because you actually think taking their infant out there was a good idea, or you just generally don’t like for them to be criticized for anything they do. So which is it?
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Old 14-01-2021, 19:35   #1259
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Originally Posted by jtsailjt View Post
And since you made your “horses for courses” comment regarding this issue in a previous post, I think “we” already knew your opinion too, prior to this “beating a dead horse” post. I can’t help but wonder what could possibly be next in your horsey trite phrase lineup? Something about a horses a$$ I perhaps? My feelings would be SO hurt!

Isn’t pretty much everything done by every person “done for their own reasons” (yet another trite phrase) but do you think that because according to you it was not done for somebody else’s reason that makes it a good thing, or do you actually think it’s a good idea to take an infant sailing across the North Atlantic in November and December? I’m genuinely curious because you haven’t really said. You’ve made it clear that you don’t like the fact that I was critical of them for doing this and have tried to explain why, but you haven’t really said whether that’s because you actually think taking their infant out there was a good idea, or you just generally don’t like for them to be criticized for anything they do. So which is it?
Trite. Straight from the horse's mouth...

I don't think it's a good idea to climb dangerous mountains. I don't think it's a good idea to travel to the middle east. I don't think it's a good idea to race motorcycles. I don't think it's a good idea jump out of a plane in a squirrel suit. And I really don't think it's a good idea not to get vaccinated for whatever the going disease is. So no, I don't think its a "good" idea to cross the north Atlantic in the winter. I do think the child is irrelevant to the question. It doesn't make it any safer or smarter one way or the other. And without all those people doing things that I think are not-so-good ideas, well, I think the world would be worse off despite the fact that I cannot fathom the reason they do it.

As for criticism, I think that Riley is a bit of a doof (as I have previously stated) but that's probably 80% jealousy. I just don't know why some people need to be on about it. So that will be the last of my opinions on them.


Back to you...

Oh, And I like Sailing Chuffed. Not much of a sailor, a so-so filmographer and definitely likely to win the under-prepared award, but she's a vet and does great work along the way for all the local communities so it keeps me watching.
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Old 15-01-2021, 02:05   #1260
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Re: Youtube liveaboard stars?

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Trite. Straight from the horse's mouth...



I don't think it's a good idea to climb dangerous mountains. I don't think it's a good idea to travel to the middle east. I don't think it's a good idea to race motorcycles. I don't think it's a good idea jump out of a plane in a squirrel suit. And I really don't think it's a good idea not to get vaccinated for whatever the going disease is. So no, I don't think its a "good" idea to cross the north Atlantic in the winter. I do think the child is irrelevant to the question. It doesn't make it any safer or smarter one way or the other. And without all those people doing things that I think are not-so-good ideas, well, I think the world would be worse off despite the fact that I cannot fathom the reason they do it.


.





.


I have to say I’m a little disappointed you couldn’t pony up with yet another horse reference for this post, oh well......

I guess that where we differ is in whether having an infant along changes things. I agree that many of the activities on your list aren’t things I want to expose myself to either but I support the right for others to do whatever they want with their lives. But when you bring along an infant on one of these risky endeavors who has no choice in the matter, and is much more vulnerable to the dangers involved, I think you’ve crossed a moral line in the sand. I don’t consider taking an infant sailing on a seaworthy boat in most conditions to be particularly dangerous, but deliberately taking an infant into conditions that will surely stress the boat (40-60 knots snd 15’+ waves and could have been worse) knowing that if the worse happens you will get into your survival suit but there is no survival suit for an infant makes me feel a little ill just thinking about it.
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