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Old 18-08-2018, 14:55   #31
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Re: Wood Stove

Are any of these “double burner” stoves available in a size commensurate with a 30’ boat?
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Old 18-08-2018, 15:44   #32
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Re: Wood Stove

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Are any of these ďdouble burnerĒ stoves available in a size commensurate with a 30í boat?

As I understand it, Cubic stoves are built this way.
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Old 18-08-2018, 16:40   #33
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Re: Wood Stove

I've sailed with a few different woodstoves. I found them very pleasant to live with in moderate climates where constant heat isn't a necessity but a comfort. I'd probably go a diesel drip heater for living aboard somewhere really cold where reliable 24 hr heating is essential fue to the sheer quantity of wood needed for 24 hour use. But to warm up a boat on a cold evening or for a few days of wet cold weather a box of good dry wood goes a long way.

I have never had an issue with a double combustion type using driftwood. Sure they burn much better with dry hardwood, but they seem to work ok with dry driftwood and broken up shoreside branches from fallen wood.

I stored the wood in a sealed box on deck to keep the bugs and dirt away. With another box in the dinghy for resuppliy while ashore. The ash never seemed to be a big problem, just scoop out the worst when it gets too full. Creosite buildup in the flue can be an issue if the flue is too small.

A good installation has a decent hearth area which deals with most of the ash dust or mess. Or it can be located on the floor where it is easy to clean up with a small brush. Creosite driping from the flue outside is harder to deal with, and can stain the cabintop badly if you aren't a bit careful. Generally you don't get any significant ash from the flue unless you do something stupid. Certainly I have never had hot ashes come out and risk burning anything.

Ive used drip diesel and webasto type heaters in antarctica and patagonia. They work well, but they don't have the charm of a wood fire and can be messy or complex to fix and maintain. Cleaning a blocked float bowl and combustion chamber in a drip heater, though rare makes emptying ashes seem very pleasant. And a backdraft of diesel exhaust is very unpleasant compared to woodsmoke. The webasto type can use a fair bit of power over 24 hours, are not particularly user repairable, and have about as much charm as a reverse cycle heat pump. though they do work effectively and make sense on many boats.

A hotplate on top is very nice if you have space.

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Old 18-08-2018, 20:43   #34
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Re: Wood Stove

Thank you so much for sharing. It's posts like these that I love to read. Obviously, you have first hand experience with a wood stove and understand more on how one warms up a boat so nicely. Are you familiar with the cubic mini grizzly? From what I understand I can put it close to a side with the stainless steel wall mount. I plan on living between Seattle Washington and Jeanua, Alaska. The weather in both places doesn't get freezing cold often, but A LOT of wet weather. And, I will want to use the wood stove when anchoring along the PNW coast.



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I've sailed with a few different w'oodstoves. I found them very pleasant to live with in moderate climates where constant heat isn't a necessity but a comfort. I'd probably go a diesel drip heater for living aboard somewhere really cold where reliable 24 hr heating is essential fue to the sheer quantity of wood needed for 24 hour use. But to warm up a boat on a cold evening or for a few days of wet cold weather a box of good dry wood goes a long way.

I have never had an issue with a double combustion type using driftwood. Sure they burn much better with dry hardwood, but they seem to work ok with dry driftwood and broken up shoreside branches from fallen wood.

I stored the wood in a sealed box on deck to keep the bugs and dirt away. With another box in the dinghy for resuppliy while ashore. The ash never seemed to be a big problem, just scoop out the worst when it gets too full. Creosite buildup in the flue can be an issue if the flue is too small.

A good installation has a decent hearth area which deals with most of the ash dust or mess. Or it can be located on the floor where it is easy to clean up with a small brush. Creosite driping from the flue outside is harder to deal with, and can stain the cabintop badly if you aren't a bit careful. Generally you don't get any significant ash from the flue unless you do something stupid. Certainly I have never had hot ashes come out and risk burning anything.

Ive used drip diesel and webasto type heaters in antarctica and patagonia. They work well, but they don't have the charm of a wood fire and can be messy or complex to fix and maintain. Cleaning a blocked float bowl and combustion chamber in a drip heater, though rare makes emptying ashes seem very pleasant. And a backdraft of diesel exhaust is very unpleasant compared to woodsmoke. The webasto type can use a fair bit of power over 24 hours, are not particularly user repairable, and have about as much charm as a reverse cycle heat pump. though they do work effectively and make sense on many boats.

A hotplate on top is very nice if you have space.

Snowpetrel Sailing: A tale of fire and ice
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Old 18-08-2018, 22:14   #35
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Re: Wood Stove

^^
It looks very nice. Perfect for a bigger boat. One trap in a small boat is heat output. Something like this pumps out 8000 to 18000 BTU's! And they can be hard to throttle back. Very good on a big boat, or you can leave the hatch open and really dry the boat out.

A freind of mine made a very nice unit out of 12 inches of 4 inch RHS steel. It still heats his wooden 34 foot very quickly.

Heat sheilds are important. Bulkheads get very hot very quickly when the fire starts roaring.

Don't forget the flue. Ideally it should be straight or have minimal bends. Hopefully it can extend well above the cabintop. For anchored use an extension can help. Sailing with the fire going can be hit or miss depending on the flue and wind direction. Without the main set is usually fine, but get the main in the wrong spot going to windward and the boat fills up with smoke..

Sounds like your location would really work well for a wood heater. And having one doesn't eliminate being able to fit a webasto or espacher for steady diesel fueled heat in the future.

Nothing beats sailing to a destination, and cooking on a woodfire fueled by dead wood collected from the beaches. It is a very self sufficient way to travel.
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Old 19-08-2018, 02:04   #36
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Re: Wood Stove

And when your Webasto/Eberspacher throws a hissy fit and there is no driftwood on the beach.... this works - see below - vvvvv .. when combined with a Honda genset.....

Diesel stove? Ask Bob Shepton how that went

Best diesel stove setup I have come across had a Pielter effect (sp) fan sitting on top of the stove.... cooling fins on the flue ... and two 12v computer fans under the deckhead where the flue exited... blowing the hot air back down... wish I had a photo..

I would sit as far away as I could from the heater and would still be stripped down to jocks and socks by the end of the evening with -*C outside.....
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Old 19-08-2018, 02:58   #37
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Re: Wood Stove

Just looked at the Cubic Minis, they look better than other stoves I’ve seen. What I like is they sell a complete “system” including the mounts, heat shield, etc for a reasonable price.

I’ve a Dickenson diesel drip cook stove in a hunting cabin, I can’t inagine it in a smallish boat, waaayyy too much heat. To cook when it is warmer we use a two burner kero cooktop unit. I’m now “qualified” on kero and love it.

Which brings me to another point, rather esoteric but.... the final option would be a diesel or pressure kero bulkhead heater. I’ve no experience with the diesel variety but have the kero units in both boats. They put out a fair bit of heat and can keep the chill off. When you are dealing with above freezing temps in a smallish boat it’s a compact and simple install. 1” tubing. A bit of Ss or aluminum heat shield. Pretty unobtrusive. I also have kero cookers so it’s an easy add on for me. I found a ss mug that just fits in top and slowly makes me a cupa. Pricey unless you can find a used one and fiddley until you get the hang of it. AND unperturbed by heel.

Not really suggesting it for the OP, but more for general interest and to round out the options.
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Old 19-08-2018, 05:01   #38
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Re: Wood Stove

^^ Good suggestion. I had a little kero taylors heater on my first boat. It worked well, and the small flue was definitely an advantage.

I wouldn't leave it unattended, I had the odd flare up.. Not that I'd be very happy leaving anything unattended. But a damped down fire that hasn't been fed any new wood for a while is pretty safe.

A mate built a meths version using a little origo burner and a flue. It worked nicely and the flue significantly reduced the condensation.

I have been curious about those little rocket stoves. They burn a handful of twigs very cleanly and very hot, and maybe a smaller flue would work on one of them. They sound perfect for a small boat.
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Old 19-08-2018, 06:08   #39
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Re: Wood Stove

I’m finding this thread very useful. Thanks LadyByrd, and all the experienced folks who are contributing.

I’ve looked long and hard at both diesel drip and injector style (webasto). I think if I needed full time heat I’d probably go with the drip version, mainly due to cost and simplicity of installation (and noise).

My issue is that I’m not sure I really need that much heat. I’ve cruised in some fairly cold areas now (Lake Superior and now Newfoundland). Maybe it’s the Canadian in me, but I only need a heat source on occasion, mostly when it’s both quite cold and damp.

So far I only carry an Origo alcohol heater, and it has always got the job done. But this comes with the problem of carrying additional liquid fuel, and having an open flame in the cabin. This is why I’m getting increasingly interested in something like a Cubic stove.

BTW, while you shouldn’t burn softwood in double-burner stoves, well dried driftwood of any ilk should be fine. It’s the oils and resin in softwood that screws up wood stoves. But well-bleached driftwood can be completely dry. It burns great … just fast.

BTW, I’ve been researching compressed wood bricks as an alternative, or an addition, to sourcing local wood. You can buy these bricks without additives. They would stack in a small space, be clean, and would burn efficiently. Cost doesn’t look bad if only burning occasionally. Something like:

http://canawick.com/en/index.php
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Old 19-08-2018, 06:28   #40
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Re: Wood Stove

We installed a cubic mini cub this fall in Uruguay and have used it all winter. While winter here was not terribly harsh it did consistently get down to 0 Celsius in the heart of it. And it is very damp. The stove heated our 30 foot boat sufficiently. It requires a lot of attention. When we come across perfect wood we can get away tending it once every 45 minutes or so, but usually we are tending every 30 minutes. Because of this we do not use it at night but we don't mind because we have decent sleeping bags. The main thing is we have a way of drying out and getting respite from the cold. We installed it using the bulkhead mount and it was a simple and clean install. We had to use the Dickinson deck fitting and chimney cap because cubic mini does not have its own, but they sell an adaptor to fit there double wall 3"flue to the Dickinson deck fitting. We very much enjoy going out into the woods looking for wood and cutting it up on the boat, but it is definitely a chore. It isn't too difficult to store 4 or 5 days of wood onboard. We have to clean the stove and flue every couple weeks. We have to shovel out the ashes every few days. It's dimensions and mounting options make it a great small boat stove.
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Old 19-08-2018, 06:34   #41
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Re: Wood Stove

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post
Iím finding this thread very useful. Thanks LadyByrd, and all the experienced folks who are contributing.

Iíve looked long and hard at both diesel drip and injector style (webasto). I think if I needed full time heat Iíd probably go with the drip version, mainly due to cost and simplicity of installation (and noise).

My issue is that Iím not sure I really need that much heat. Iíve cruised in some fairly cold areas now (Lake Superior and now Newfoundland). Maybe itís the Canadian in me, but I only need a heat source on occasion, mostly when itís both quite cold and damp.

So far I only carry an Origo alcohol heater, and it has always got the job done. But this comes with the problem of carrying additional liquid fuel, and having an open flame in the cabin. This is why Iím getting increasingly interested in something like a Cubic stove.

BTW, while you shouldnít burn softwood in double-burner stoves, well dried driftwood of any ilk should be fine. Itís the oils and resin in softwood that screws up wood stoves. But well-bleached driftwood can be completely dry. It burns great Ö just fast.

BTW, Iíve been researching compressed wood bricks as an alternative, or an addition, to sourcing local wood. You can buy these bricks without additives. They would stack in a small space, be clean, and would burn efficiently. Cost doesnít look bad if only burning occasionally. Something like:

http://canawick.com/en/index.php
^^I've used the compressed wood blocks. My old wood heater was sized to take them. They worked well once it got up to temperature.

On the softwoods thing and the oils, I think the real issue is with the stoves that use a catalytic type system to ckeam the smoke. They are quite sensitive to wood quality and need to be run hot. Whereas the double burning type with a simple baffle (they aren't really true double burners due to not getting hot enough) don't seem to be affected by much. I've run one on all sorts of stuff, from pinecones, small amounts of coal and charcoal. Even rubbish. They may smoke more but it doesn't seem to hurt them much except maybe sooting up the chimney a bit faster or more smoke (a 3 inch chimney seems about right, with minimal problems. but a 2.5 inch one i have used filled up with creosite every week amd needed regular Chimney sweeps/scrapes). Be very careful with coal. It burns super hot!

In your case Mike it may be worth trying a flue for your meths heater. It made a big difference to my friends setup. I also used a pressure kero lantern as well for heat on more mild nights.
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Old 19-08-2018, 07:00   #42
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Re: Wood Stove

Yes, thank you so much to everyone who has contributed with all of your knowledge and expertise on the subject. I want a wood stove, but I also want this to be a smart investment for heating and drying out my boat. The more I read, the more I feel like this would be a wise choice for sure.

Thanks again everyone.

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Old 19-08-2018, 07:08   #43
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Re: Wood Stove

Yaye, a cubic mini user. Yeah, I've read that you have to tend to them often. That's why I thought the grizzly would be a wise choice. It's a bit bigger which allows for more wood, thus, less tending. And, I can set it up pretty good before bed and have a good heat through the sleeping hours. But another poster mentioned it might be too much heat for such a small space. If I understand correctly, can't I control the flame level once the fire gets going? And controlling the flame would allow me to control the amount of heat it would be putting out, right? I'm such a novice with a thirst for knowledge.

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We installed a cubic mini cub this fall in Uruguay and have used it all winter. While winter here was not terribly harsh it did consistently get down to 0 Celsius in the heart of it. And it is very damp. The stove heated our 30 foot boat sufficiently. It requires a lot of attention. When we come across perfect wood we can get away tending it once every 45 minutes or so, but usually we are tending every 30 minutes. Because of this we do not use it at night but we don't mind because we have decent sleeping bags. The main thing is we have a way of drying out and getting respite from the cold. We installed it using the bulkhead mount and it was a simple and clean install. We had to use the Dickinson deck fitting and chimney cap because cubic mini does not have its own, but they sell an adaptor to fit there double wall 3"flue to the Dickinson deck fitting. We very much enjoy going out into the woods looking for wood and cutting it up on the boat, but it is definitely a chore. It isn't too difficult to store 4 or 5 days of wood onboard. We have to clean the stove and flue every couple weeks. We have to shovel out the ashes every few days. It's dimensions and mounting options make it a great small boat stove.
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Old 19-08-2018, 07:16   #44
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Re: Wood Stove

So very true and the loveliest way if you ask me.

Nothing beats sailing to a destination, and cooking on a woodfire fueled by dead wood collected from the beaches. It is a very self sufficient way to travel.[/QUOTE]
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Old 19-08-2018, 07:53   #45
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Re: Wood Stove

Mike,

Before you decide one way or another I would suggest you talk to the local Espar dealer. He is nearby you in Stephenville. The web site is giving me a weird problem at the moment. But the name is ACPL Heating Systems. I found him quite helpful and knowledgeable. Straight shooter.
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