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Old 22-02-2020, 10:54   #226
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Originally Posted by smj View Post
Seems as if you don’t care for the way some of the boaters in the harbor maintain their boats. i agree and am not bothered by admitting i don't care for scum, whether on the water or land
]
You aren't making me feel bad by saying I am anti boat scum. I am also anti trailer trash and white/brown/black etc trash. I grew up 1 step above houseless living on the street, there still wasn’t trash laying all over the place and even through the house wasn't “pretty” it was picked up. Even houseless people arent necessary scum or trash and you can the difference between those that are and those that aren’t.

But this is a boat forum and in this regard it is the boat scum at the root of all the rules we complain about far as waterway use and anchoring “rights”
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Old 22-02-2020, 10:59   #227
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Originally Posted by PLANET EXPRESS View Post
This is America where we are “free” and should be allowed to live as we want. Lived in a house for long time with many different neighbors. If you chose to have junk cars in your lawn and not mow, paint, roof your house that’s fine with me as long as it stayed on your side.
We should not try and inflict our views on what we feel is acceptable on others it will only lead to problems. Learn to accept and engage those with different lifestyles. Might just find out they are wonderful people with great stories or tragedy where we may be able to help.
When you were in the bar and heard that statement asked why they felt that way. Maybe you both would have learned something by talking to each other. Change can happen one at a time��
How do you feel about the houses on the block with the neighbor who has cars on blocks on his in mowed lawn and tarps on his roof being worth $75,000 less than on the block without him? Does his “freedom” allow him to violate zoning codes costing you real money? You may not be selling your house today or tomorrow but eventually you or the others on the block will. Is it right that they should have much less retirement funds because one person wants to avoid caring for their property?
Perhaps another’s “freedom” to live as they choose stops at my wallet.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:09   #228
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Re: Substandard Housing

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How do you feel about the houses on the block with the neighbor who has cars on blocks on his in mowed lawn and tarps on his roof being worth $75,000 less than on the block without him? Does his “freedom” allow him to violate zoning codes costing you real money? You may not be selling your house today or tomorrow but eventually you or the others on the block will. Is it right that they should have much less retirement funds because one person wants to avoid caring for their property?
Perhaps another’s “freedom” to live as they choose stops at my wallet.


If he violates zoning codes then sure there’s a problem, if not then I guess he has the right to do what he wants. That’s why it’s important to read the restrictions before purchasing property.
I don’t think having a boat with a dirty bottom and stuff stored on the side decks makes it a derelict but if it does there are laws to remedy that.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:13   #229
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Re: Substandard Housing

Florida’s definition of derelict vessel.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/823.11
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:24   #230
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Re: Substandard Housing

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If he violates zoning codes then sure there’s a problem, if not then I guess he has the right to do what he wants. That’s why it’s important to read the restrictions before purchasing property.
I don’t think having a boat with a dirty bottom and stuff stored on the side decks makes it a derelict but if it does there are laws to remedy that.
In most suburban neighborhoods having junk cars in your yard and tarps on your roof ARE code violations. In many places having an unmown lawn is a violation of brushfire regulations, just as a home filled with trash and garbage is a refuge for rats and vermin and a public health danger to their neighbors.

There are indeed laws to deal with derelict boats: anchoring bans. And more are being proposed and passed every year. We are not talking about a dirty bottom and fuel cans along the lifelines, but boats with torn and flapping blue tarps, piles of junk that look like homeless encampments.

But to the family with a waterfront home they look nearly the same, especially when one drops anchor and stays for months. So they call the water cops who come out and tell them that unless the boat is abandoned there is nothing they can do and if it is abandoned it will take months to go through the legal process to get rid of it. That is if there are the funds available. How do you think that family and their friends and neighbors will vote when a total ban on anchoring is on the ballot?
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:26   #231
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Florida’s definition of derelict vessel.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/823.11
I don't like derelict boats, but ....

Some make boat scum boats look pretty nice.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:34   #232
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Florida’s definition of derelict vessel.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/823.11
That may be Florida's official description of a derelict vessel, However, I can tell you from first hand experience that sitting in a committee meeting with a room full of senators or house reps that know nothing about boating, any boat that looks like a pile of crap is a derelict.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:37   #233
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Re: Substandard Housing

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That may be Florida's official description of a derelict vessel, However, I can tell you from first hand experience that sitting in a committee meeting with a room full of senators or house reps that know nothing about boating, any boat that looks like a pile of crap is a derelict.


Yes, but that is the legal description whether the senators or house reps like it or not.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:44   #234
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Yes, but that is the legal description whether the senators or house reps like it or not.
You can tell them that when they pass anchoring restrictions based on what they "see".
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:45   #235
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Re: Substandard Housing

I just did a look around from my cockpit in Boot Key Harbor and from where I am I can see no boats that appear to be derelicts, doesn’t mean they aren’t out there. I do see boats that I think could be maintained better and I do see boats that are maintained better than ours, but it’s not my place to tell someone how to maintain their property if it’s within the legal limitations.
Maybe y’all got the cheap seats!
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:47   #236
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Re: Substandard Housing

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You can tell them that when they pass anchoring restrictions based on what they "see".


So how does complaining and degrading people’s homes on CF help the cause? If you feel that strongly go talk to the owners.
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Old 22-02-2020, 11:55   #237
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Re: Substandard Housing

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I just did a look around from my cockpit in Boot Key Harbor and from where I am I can see no boats that appear to be derelicts,
Do you not go into the dinghy dock? What about the half sunk powerboat up on the rocks, or the grounded sailboat in the east anchorage. They didn't get there because their owners were taking such good care of them.
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Old 22-02-2020, 12:02   #238
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Re: Substandard Housing

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Do you not go into the dinghy dock? What about the half sunk powerboat up on the rocks, or the grounded sailboat in the east anchorage. They didn't get there because their owners were taking such good care of them.


You cut my quote short, I said I don’t see any derelicts from my boat but it doesn’t mean there aren’t any out there.
I’m pretty sure the marina knows of those boats and are taking the legal steps to have them removed.
But we are talking boats with dirty bottoms and stuff tied on the side decks right? That doesn’t describe a derelict vessel it just describes a vessel that doesn’t meet your smell test.
I have no problem with you disliking the way some care for their vessels it’s just the language that you use to describe them.
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Old 22-02-2020, 12:12   #239
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Re: Substandard Housing

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I have no problem with you disliking the way some care for their vessels it’s just the language that you use to describe them.
The problem is not how they are being described. The problem is that many of the boats that are loaded with junk and incapable of navigation, will become next weeks, or next months, or next years derelict.

They give all of us a bad name in the eyes of the land living public.
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Old 22-02-2020, 12:22   #240
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Re: Substandard Housing

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The problem is not how they are being described. The problem is that many of the boats that are loaded with junk and incapable of navigation, will become next weeks, or next months, or next years derelict.



They give all of us a bad name in the eyes of the land living public.


I agree. So what’s the solution? The threat of banning anchoring has been going on for decades. Stricter laws and actual enforcement?
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